Talk Show Host

Matsuda, on TR "failed" launch period of 3,9m copies, 4 years ago:

Quote

I say this with the benefit of hindsight now, but at the time our numbers leading up to the release of Tomb Raider had been very poor and I think our people were probably banking on that and wondering how much it was going to help our final earnings. In the end, it didn’t quite sell as much as we had anticipated.” It wasn’t that Tomb Raider‘s performance, in a vacuum, was weak; it’s that it didn’t do well enough to turn around the entire company.

🙄

3 hours ago, Broker said:

So what IP has been sold here? Tomb Raider, Deus Ex, Thief, Legacy of Kain, Gex. Is that it? Because $300 million seems like a fair price for some studios whose games consistently underperform, two franchises that haven’t seem a successful game in 20 years, two franchises that have a cult following (one of which had some moderately successful games quite recently), and the TR franchise which has been overvalued consistently since it was briefly very popular 25 years ago. 

The last 3 TR games have sold more than 38m copies and the last two Deus Ex more than 12m. 

I'd say "consistently underperforming" is way off the mark.

21 minutes ago, jonamok said:

Careful now, that sounds like “hyperbole”.

Nah, hyperbole would be "its probably the most stunning achievement ever".

3 minutes ago, ChewMagma said:

 

Legitimately don't know what GRRM did on this game tbh.

I think he named some heroes and from them the bosses were created?

10 minutes ago, Zael said:

I think TW3's world is a bit of a playground too. Finish that game and look at your map and count the amount of little icons that are spread out there. And a lot of it is the same stuff, bandit camps, monster lairs, etc. And yeah the game is set in a more active world and so they need more NPCs but I've always thought that was to the games detriment. The NPCs in TW3 are so static. Big hubs like Beauclair and Novigrad are full of NPCs following the same routes, shouting the same dialogue, quest givers rooted in place until you talk to them.

 

I love TW3 but the open world is only ok imo. There's a lot of good things in it but they fill it with ?'s that have you repeat the same activities. Elden Ring doesn't do anything new but I've never had a moment in TW3 like I had in ER where I saw the Caelid Wilds or Siofra or Leyendell for the first time. 

Fair point, but the generic NPCs in open worlds are there to enhance the atmosphere, nothing more. An inhabited open world like W3 or RDR2 would look silly with no NPCs.

I personally still remember the first time I saw Beauclair or Skellige Islands, so the W3 has plenty of moments like that as well. For an open world it doesn't lack awe, although ER has a greater effect because the imagination in the art has practically no limits, unlike in the more traditional open world games which usually need to follow a cultural or historical theme.

9 minutes ago, ChewMagma said:

At the end of the day, it is really hard to compare these games taken holistically because they are very different tonally and in what they want to achieve. Elden Ring really ticks all the boxes for me, I find it difficult to find any serious criticisms, but I also recognise it is a fairly acquired taste in many respects.

 

Basically Miyazaki took every weirdo, pulp dark fantasy book from the 60s and 70s, added a hefty dose of Advanced Dungeons & Dragons, a pinch of Lovecraft, and blended it with massive quantities of Berserk. And then sold 12 million copies of it. In 2022. It is astonishing really.

And he didn't even need Martin to do anything.  😜

2 minutes ago, Minion said:

 

Well ok maybe shitting on is a bit strong sorry, but my point is you felt the need to criticise the game and used an example by comparing elements of TW3 and RDR2 as evidence of this criticism even though you then later admitted that a comparison of the combat between the 3 games would not be fair because Elden Rings is so good. Do you not see how that comes across as speaking rubbish? It's fair to make a comparison between populated open worlds and elden ring but not the combat system? My posts do sound quite antagonistic I can only put that down to being sunday morning and feeling exhausted. Criticise away but using RDR2 or TW3 as examples of better games is where I feel you are wrong. TW3 did have some good story and writing in the first half but by the middle/end it does nothing new and overstays it's welcome. RDR2 is the most tedious game I have ever played, it looks stunning, the open world is an incredible achievement, but as a game it fails miserably with outdated combat and controls and no player agency in the journey through the game.

I never compared W3 and Elden Ring directly as games, I just compared their open worlds. Maybe you missed some of my posts?

3 minutes ago, Minion said:

 

But this is exactly what you did when you bought RDR2 and TW3 into the conversation explaining that the world of Elden Ring is not inhabited by npc's everywhere.

 

 

As always it seems like you're trying to shit on a game because you prefer another, TW3 which you are strangely evangelical about and you've contradicted yourself here because of this bias. As for maps Elden Ring has the best map of any game ever, it's a work of art, I've never studied a map in a game like I have in Elden Ring. Face it, it does so many things way better than TW3 ever did, the game was impressive but quickly became tedious, it wouldn't make any of my 'top' lists as I couldn't even finish it because I was so bored by the end.

I am trying to shit on a game that I have already said its a stunning achievement and I am having a good time playing it?

It is prettly clear who is obsessively against any view that doesn't support ER as the second coming. 

2 minutes ago, Let us measure said:

 

Sorry to pile on, but you're replying to someone saying that the game world is stunning with the retort that it's not revolutionary. 

 

ER's open world isn't revolutionary but it is stunning. For precisely the reasons that you've brought up. It wouldn't work with loading screens at all. That one screenshot that everyone takes of the vista overlooking Liurnia of the Lakes, with the academy in the distance, and the capital further still, and then Mt. Gelmir behind that... And each location just as recognisable from miles away as it is from when you're deep within it. 

 

It's a crazy achievement. At all times like being thrown into a Caspar Friedrich painting or something. 

 

 

Fair point, but I already said it is a stunning world, but not the most stunning we have ever seen in open worlds. 

12 minutes ago, ChewMagma said:

RDR2 is one of the most tedious games I have ever played with terrible controls. W3 had a beautiful setting and interesting quests but the combat was incredibly dull. Neither can hold a candle to Elden Ring really. BOTW is the only open world game that is in the same league imo.

I totally disagree but we are talking about the open worlds specifically anyway. Sure, the combat in Elden Ring is on another level but that makes sense because it is its main thing. I don't think its a fair comparison to use it to compare it to other games though. It would be like saying "Elden Ring sucks compared to the W3 because the latter has an incredible story while the former doesn't".

2 minutes ago, Jamie John said:

 

Signature checks out 

 

I agree that the game world isn't revolutionary, but what it does better than any other open world game I've played (except BoTW) is make clever use of sightlines, landscape and geometry to lead the player to interesting things without the use of quest markers. Too often when I'm playing open world games I don't even bother to pay attention to the landscape I'm traversing - it's just something that's in the way between me and my next destination - whereas in Elden Ring you're all but forced to observe the terrain and plan out your route, lest your way is obscured by a sheer cliff, impassable mountain or massive horrible monster. At times while playing it I was reminded of Death Stranding in this regard, but here the combat is 100 times more fun.

Yes, but that works exactly because it is not built as a proper inhabited open world but as a playground. Games like RDR2 and W3 are way more complex and use of landmarks would not be enough to find all the little villages and other places because nature would get in the way, as it does in real life. You would actually need a real map or spend so much time in them as to learn the land as a proper living person there. 😅

I do agree though that if Elden Rings brings something new to the table and open world games is the less hand holding. We do not need as much or we should certainly have the options to tailor the experience as we would like. But that is not a simple matter of settings, design would have to support that. That is why I was looking at my screen in disbelief when an AC designer said that you can turn everything off in AC games as well.

Sure, but then you wouldn't be able to play the game because it is not designed to be played like this.

8 minutes ago, Blunted said:

 

How does this specifically not apply to your two examples of RDR2 or W3?

Maybe it does apply, but I believe because these games have been built to offer an inhabited open world which is more unified and where everything feels part of the land and connected, it would do the games a huge disservice if you had loading screens. But technically it could apply to them as well. In Elden Ring I wouldn't mind loading screens so much. I would mind it though if there was a "please wait for loading" in the middle of Novigrad.

Maybe I am off topic because I haven't given up on Elden Ring, I am having a great time even though I am quite shit at it. 😅

7 hours ago, petrolgirls said:

I’m not sure I’ve heard ’revolutionary’ bandied around much. It’s a BotW inspired open world Souls game - two well known quantities so there’s nothing massively surprising or radically new. What it is, though, is incredibly well put together and executed. 

I have read plenty about how it changes open world games. I am suprised that you haven't.

7 hours ago, jonamok said:

Why is it hyperbole? It’s a truly stunning game world. Care to name a better one?

It is a stunning game world but not the most stunning game world ever created. RDR2 or W3 are more impressive in my opinion. Also, it depends on what you mean as well. Elden Ring doesn't have to follow any rules that make sense in an inhabited open world. It doesn't have to include cities, NPCs and NPCs behaviour, random animal behaviours, extended quest lines, interaction with other NPCs, etc. It is just a playground where every place tries to outdo the previous one. If all the areas were just different lands seperated by a load screen there wouldn't be much difference. 

As I said, trully impressive game, but other than its world beating art, its open world is really nothing special as an achievement.

On 21/04/2022 at 22:48, JPL said:

It’s probably the most stunning game world ever created.

If there is something that is making me question this game more than other from software titles is this kind of hyperbole. 

Good game, I am having a fun time with it, but nowhere near as revolutionary for open world games as people would like to think imo.

This will probably be a prequel, taking place when the cat school actually existed. A chance also to meet a younger Geralt as NPC. It’s clear why they chose the cat school: it was the school which allowed women to take the trial of the grasses, hence players can create a female Witcher if they want. 
 

Also, their main base was actually a caravan, so a perfect choice for moving around the land doing contracts etc. 

1 hour ago, Fallows said:

They need to look at unlocking mods for consoles. It should be a whole lot easier to integrate compared to what Bethesda had to do for Skyrim.

I certainly hope so.

8 minutes ago, Fallows said:

Mods.

 

Speaking of which the list is almost fully updated/compatible with 1.5 now. I should get back to playing.

How did I forget that? Let me log on to my console mod store account. 😛

14 minutes ago, nightwaxon said:

A pen and a piece of paper by the looks of it.  The same complaint is being levelled at Elden Ring by some. 

It’s not the same though, is it? Elden Ring is designed to be like this, it’s entire system is created based on exploring and experimenting. In Cyberpunk it’s just a logistics issue, you don’t need to do any exploring, everything is right there on the map for you. 

For all the amazing stuff in this game, I would never let anyone designing this UI or the entire crafting system near a PC again. Not only that, everything is designed to make your life difficult. There’s no way to know which vendor sells what. Where did you find that legendary mod? How can you locate a mod for your glasses? Where can you find crafting recipes? It’s not like they are hidden, but there’s so many places and so different items sold by different vendors that trying to do crafting becomes such a chore. You literally need pen and paper. There’s not even a way to make map

bookmarks ffs. 
 

What am I missing here?

6 hours ago, Kingpin said:

Yes, do more side quests. I just did the bit in your spoiler this evening. A few hours later, I got a text and a new mission but now I’m waiting on a phone call. 

The problem is I have no text or a new mission in my journal. The quest has totally disappeared.

I will do some more side quests and see. The whole game I literally had no bugs at all - just a couple of graphical glitches in 60+ hours. I Hope cyberfate is not out to get me now. 🤔

Closing in on the point of no return and hit two game breaking bugs - thankfully an earlier save solved the issue.

But now I’m getting anxious again because it seems another one has hit - or simply is taking too long for the event to be triggered? It involves the Judy quest line and when 

 
A little help would be appreciated because I’m afraid to Google in case of spoilers.

42 minutes ago, Darwock said:

You got me interested so I went to check out the thread. Less than half a page before discussion shifted to the controversy the game was creating regarding the treatment and portrayal of it’s female characters. People bemoaning the fact the genre has shifted more and more in that direction. In other words, exactly what I was expecting.

 

I’m sure the game is great but enjoyment of it will depend on your ability to tolerate that sort of stuff, and I think this game here just managed to stay on the acceptable side of it (for me). Didn’t stop my wife commenting ‘what is this creepy game you’re playing?’. Unfortunately anime style artwork is automatically equated with dodgy content nowadays.

Yeah, but almost all Japanese games are like that (and rll is way too reactionary anyway), so if you can’t take their dodgy outfits and sexual innuendos you are excluding yourself from some of the best games. In most cases, Japanese dodgy stuff are superficial and the games are never about them, as usually female characters are at least as strong and independent as male ones, but of course I get it if someone can’t easily stomach their sexism when it pops up.

Actually I have found VC4 to be the best in the series by quite a margin. There are missteps, sure, but all in all it has the best cast imo and some great moments. Gameplay is easily improved as well.

The more I play this the more I am in awe of the sheer complexity, beauty and ambition, both in narrative and world building. I am now fifty hours in and still in Act 2. I really like how CDPR helps the player enjoy the side quests and exploration by giving us a moment to breathe. They have provided small stops in both the main and side quests by concluding small arcs and have the NPCs “be in touch when they know more to proceed”.

I also love how they use world building to tie in with some quests. In the early game I remember watching on TV a case of a serial killer and the death of an important figure and wishing I had the chance to figure out what happened. Well, after 30 hours and coming in touch with the right people I got my side quests wish - and what great side quests they are, even if one I had to stop to take a break because of how disturbing it was. There are no better writers in the RPG genre than CDPR (and are easily amongst the best in the industry).

The writing also goes hand in hand with the world building and exposition.  CDPR are masters of taking their time to explore and build characters, develop the world. They have the characters talk about themselves and the city in organic ways like eating and drinking with V, quest details are discussed and not simply narrated or read. This goes a long way to make the world and the story feel present, alive.
 

The gameplay has now opened up and it has been a joy using stealth and controlling the environment. So many options to approach things, so many different elements combined. I just hope one day we can actually have a better AI for when using stealth, because it’s not much different from the rest of games. The actual shooting is fun and coming up against bosses can really mix things up, but all in all this feels more like the W2 combat - it’s almost good. 
 

Johnny is excellently  written and such an asshole. 😆 Even one line from him gives color to the most mundane tasks. Last but not least, some of the main missions are incredible. One specific springs to mind that I played yesterday with Takemura. The atmosphere, the rhythm, the tension and so, so beautiful (Series X, RT - pic probably looks like shit, upload from the phone and don’t know how to do it proper):

There so many little things that can be so annoying regarding the UI, from inventory to trading to crafting (or other things like journal not keeping track of what has happened before).

But nothing gets me more than auto centering camera when driving. It’s beyond belief that this day and age a developer can’t give us full freedom on controlling the camera. 🤬

Other than the above, this is like living in another world, such is the detail and atmosphere of everything, from main to side quests. I am literally properly driving or walking everywhere. 😜