Final Fantasy XII (Official Topic)

[David Kenny]

I agree with this. This was when I stopped playing the game for awhile as I thought Giruvegan was very dull so I just lost interest. I'm not bothered about the enemies as a challenge is good, especially in FFXII that most of the time it just seems too easy. Other than that, Giruvegan was a very dull place.

I did find it dull and very difficult when first playing through it, but it's a brilliant place for levelling up if you open up the final area. The constantly spawning zombie things meant I went from level 70 to 80 in a matter of hours.

[Pmccee]

Is there something you need to do in order to allow the purchase of new magic abilities ? I am right at the end of the game pre bahamut but I cant buy certain magics in that they are not for sale. For example bravery from the rabanstre store which is the only one according to the guide that sells it! Help.

[Djx]

If you've been completing the hunts and ranking up, The spells (Bubble/Faith/Bravery) should be available for purchase from the Clan bazaar stall. I already have them and I've yet to get to the Salikawood.

[Pmccee]

Oops ! I assumed the guide was referring to the magic shop in rabanastre. Cheers !

[will]

I don't have any real issue with the level design (there are worse places such as The Feywood), and it was nice to have a challange with the enemies after going 40 hours without any real danger. Can't say I saw any respawn either.

I quite enjoyed the feywood. It never confused me at all and is a decent length.

Surely all of you people who made it to level 70 found the game ridiculously easy? I didn't die after salika wood and I only finished at about level 40.

[JoeK]

I quite enjoyed the feywood. It never confused me at all and is a decent length.

Surely all of you people who made it to level 70 found the game ridiculously easy? I didn't die after salika wood and I only finished at about level 40.

Doesn't the game slightly tinker with enemy stats according to what level you are? I only ask because I recently started the game again, and was up to level 5 before I'd taken out the Rogue Tomato, and I swear the dungeon bit was harder.

[Osito]

I had to play this in 2 parts because of exams.

It was odd though, as originally I didn't like the battle system, but after 2 months off it, I loved it.

Thought the game was fantastic though.

[Pmccee]

Thoroughly enjoyed the game however the end fights were too easy and I had only levelled up to around 55 and was without the amazing weapons. I suppose the real challenge is with the marks. What kind of level should I be looking at to have any chance of beating the omega mark ?

[Mr.Jeff]

Started this up agan after leaving it for a few months despite being a stone's throw away from the final dungeon. Seeing all the optional stuff I felt compelled to do before the last fight made me stop.

Anyway, cracked on, killed a few marks. Got given an old key for some place in the Sohen Cave Palace. The guide I'm following along assures me that the boss I'm going to fight is certainly doable for a level 45 person.

Is it bollocks! Hell Wyrm; an appropriate name for an utter bastard of an enemy that has so many health bars I couldn't be arsed counting them. Started off fairly well until it started repeatedly killing me with 1 hit kills for absolutely no reason. After about 20 minutes whittling away roughly 1/6th of it's health I eventually conceeded the guide was lying and restarted from a previous stage.

Give me a few more levels then I'm going back their to slaughter that bastard.

[Dandy_Sephy]

Breaking news: I just finished this, having been up all night. I'll post my thoughts later as I've just finished watching the credits and I have to leave for work in TEN MINUTES Cut that close

[Mr.Jeff]

Ugh. Finished this as well today after finishing everything but Yiazmat(sp?) and the omega mark. What a horrible game. Some nice minor little fmv clips in the ending but still awful. So much promise in a game and yet the only part I actually enjoyed was seeing the credits roll by and realising I'd never have to play it again. Oh and possibly

Gilgamesh

.

I'd have been willing to have put up with that stupid battle system if that actually included a storyline in it.

[hughes]

Why did you see it through to the end?

[Mr.Jeff]

Because I kept feeling a vague sense of guilt that I hadn't finished it despite being so close to the end before I gave up a few months back.

[David Kenny]

Thoroughly enjoyed the game however the end fights were too easy and I had only levelled up to around 55 and was without the amazing weapons. I suppose the real challenge is with the marks. What kind of level should I be looking at to have any chance of beating the omega mark ?

I think the Omega is just a boss type thing rather than a Mark. Anyway, I was about level 90 when I did it but I think you could do it 70. That one's more about the tactic you use than your level.

[Frankie Lee]

Started this over the weekend. Enjoying it, but I had to buy the guide as I was afraid I miss out on stuff. I surprised at how similar everything is ti FFXI, but that's no bad thing IMO. It seems the battling runs along a similar vein, with tanks and damage dealers etc. Hopefully it'll be easier to get a good team together on this!

Is it wrong that I find Fran attractive?

[imp]

Started this over the weekend. Enjoying it, but I had to buy the guide as I was afraid I miss out on stuff. I surprised at how similar everything is ti FFXI, but that's no bad thing IMO. It seems the battling runs along a similar vein, with tanks and damage dealers etc. Hopefully it'll be easier to get a good team together on this!

Is it wrong that I find Fran attractive?

I'm thinking of playing this through again, soon. I don't know if I'll ever have enough time to dedicate to it though, I bought the big old guide for this for a second runthrough, but it's dauntingly large. Still, I enjoyed it enough last time. And this time I guess I won't have to struggle through under-levelled so much. I swear I got about 8 of the espers severely just by chaining limits!

Damn final fantasy retrospective, making me want to play them all again!

[womblingfree]

I'm not bothered about the enemies as a challenge is good, especially in FFXII that most of the time it just seems too easy.

All my characters are around Level 50 and some of those Marks keep handing me my arse on a plate!

Every time i think I'm done with this there are always more Espers, Marks, Legendary weapons to find.

Great that there's so much to do even when you've finished the storyline. Some of the sub-plots and sidequests are really fun and keep the challenge going for another 100 hours

Even thinking of going back to FFX and X-2 when I finally finish this to do all the stuff I missed.

[daveodeth]

I'm 20 hours in and at the Wraithwall place, at least i think it's called that. Anyone know a good strategy to waste the first rock hard demon wall that appears? Oh and how on earth do you power up the quickenings/mists things whatever they are?

[JoeK]

I'm 20 hours in and at the Wraithwall place, at least i think it's called that. Anyone know a good strategy to waste the first rock hard demon wall that appears? Oh and how on earth do you power up the quickenings/mists things whatever they are?

I did it by having gambits set simply to 'attacking nearest visible' enemy (no other gambits set), so they just keep on kicking the crap out of the wall. The all you have to deal with (and I'd be Balthier with a ranged weapon for this one) is switching the correct buttons to stop the bloke. It also helps have some accessories which make you immune to sleep and...the other thing the wall casts on you.

[womblingfree]

Oh and how on earth do you power up the quickenings/mists things whatever they are?

I'm about 110 hours in and I still don't quite get them.

As far as I can tell the more MP you have the more likely you are to be able to pull off a string of them in succession. If no ones quickenings appear highlighted you tap R2 and hopefully at least one will become available, if not then just keep trying before the timer runs out. What I'm not sure about is how you can best increase the likelihood of pulling off a level 3 mist attack.

It's like a magical fruit machine as far as I can see. Very satisfying when you pull off a load in a row, think my record is about 12. Essential for finishing off super-hard baddies when they go beserk and increase their attack/defense.

This game not being in our top 100 is baffling, should be top 10 at least, best JRPG ever IMO. Now if they can just better incorporate summons into XIII then it'll be nigh on perfect.

[JoeK]

I'm about 110 hours in and I still don't quite get them.

As far as I can tell the more MP you have the more likely you are to be able to pull off a string of them in succession. If no ones quickenings appear highlighted you tap R2 and hopefully at least one will become available, if not then just keep trying before the timer runs out. What I'm not sure about is how you can best increase the likelihood of pulling off a level 3 mist attack.

It's like a magical fruit machine as far as I can see. Very satisfying when you pull off a load in a row, think my record is about 12. Essential for finishing off super-hard baddies when they go beserk and increase their attack/defense.

This game not being in our top 100 is baffling, best JRPG ever IMO. Now if they can just better incorporate summons into XIII then it'll be nigh on perfect.

Yup, quite agree. I think the game is absolutely brilliant, and after you 'get' the way the fighting works, then the grinding becomes utterly addictive. In the grand scheme of things, I'm fighting far more than I would have done in the previous FFs, but without that jarring sensation you get with random encounters, the journey is so much more pleasurable.

I'm also astounded that some people don't think the storyline isn't as good as other Final Fantasies. Personally, I think the broader canvas which the saga plays out is much more satisfying.

It's certainly one of the very, very few games I'm happy to play through again and again to get everything.

[womblingfree]

DP!

[womblingfree]

Yup, quite agree. I think the game is absolutely brilliant, and after you 'get' the way the fighting works, then the grinding becomes utterly addictive. In the grand scheme of things, I'm fighting far more than I would have done in the previous FFs, but without that jarring sensation you get with random encounters, the journey is so much more pleasurable.

When I first played the demo I actually cancelled my pre-order in disgust

After being convinced to give it another the system finally clicked, when I was fighting some big unicorn thing in the sewers I think. There's really no going back to line-dancing after that.

The main difference between this and random encounters and turn taking is that with this system I actually go looking for fights, whereas with the old JRPG systems I live in constant agitation that yet another will pop up before I've crossed a room.

[womblingfree]

Phew, just had the most epic battle against Ixion. Holy's flying all over the shop as his electric mane went whistling around my ears. Very epic.

I wonder how long it'll be before these new consoles come anywhere near the depth of the old lot? Seems to be nothing but FPS's, driving games and the usual guff around for the last year or so.

[imp]

First time through, I really enjoyed it, I'm now on my second playthrough which I started last week, just in Archades, and man, I'm loving it! I've just set up some amazing gambits for my party, so they all stay hasted and floated, with the leader protected, bubbled, regened and libra'd, which you think would be immensely draining on MP, but because of all the various ways to get MP back, after the initial splurge, it's quite sustainable. Gambits are genius like that! This time I haven't gone out of my way to get all the espers early, so I've not had so many frustrating under-leveled battles.

The plot's easier to follow too!

[Alan Stock]

Spoiler Filled post!!

I finally finished FFXII tonight, after having owned it for about 8 months! A true epic. Had 113 hours on the clock, and spent about a week before Bahamut doing loads of the Marks, and exploring any missed areas like Nadubis. My characters were about level 48.

It really breathes a massive amount of life back into the stale formula of Final Fantasy games - there's so many new elements that are brilliant, and they've actually managed to make the combat in a Final Fantasy game fun!!!!!. It's just leaps and bounds ahead of all the others, as a game. And it's sooo polished! The balance is also spot on, it's a challenge and forces you to go off and explore, or do side quests to level up to progress through the story.

Overall I found playing it engaging in some parts and not in others, but you find that with any FF game. The story wasn't as engaging or heartracing as usual, but it's interesting and it's great to see the plot not being completely ridiculous for once and more "mature". However it didn't grab me much a lot of the time - whereas in other FF games you tend to be playing just to uncover more of the story and characters. I think part of this is because the story is so spread out across the game, though it is nice that the focus is actually on the gameplay for once! A shame as well that there's the hackneyed "Ancients" and Vayne the obvious bad guy powering up to take over the world. Snore. At least it wasn't cheesy for the most part, unlike most FF games.

The characters - fantastic. The character design is great, and the main team characters are believable and charasmatic. Balthier, Fran, Ashe, Bashe are ace. The secondary characters are really good too - where even small-bit characters are cool - like that guy from Rozzaria with the shades. I liked the voice acting and thought the the overall focus on the "olde England" speech was well done. Translation was very good - Square Enix localastion is the daddy, continuing their success with Dragons Quest 8. The only characters who I didn't care for much were Vaan and Penelo, because they're your standard annoying FF character. Dialogue was pretty good too.

I didn't like the visual style too much of the environments, especially the dungeons, though for PS2 they're pretty detailed. The rest of the graphics were nice though. FMVs were what you'd expect from Square - though it annoyed me that the character's faces looked a bit different in the FMVs from the main game.

Combat system was really good, though they could have given you some of the more useful Gambits earlier. Engaging and satisfying, even when wading through huge numbers of enemies. The Chain and loot system is nice and actually rewards you for fighting lots of baddies instead of making it a chore, for the most part. One problem with variety I found, was that I didn't end up using magic till quite a way into the game, because spells were so expensive and at that point your characters don't have much MP anyway. The emphasis on guarding against and actually using status effects was a nice fresh change as well, and having to use items as well as spells. In older FF games you'd just use basic commands like Attack, cast spell or Cure!

As I played Final Fantasy 11 (online) a lot, the similarities are obvious, but I think they've done a much better job in this game of making that kind of combat engaging. There's a nice spread of enemies in the areas, and I like the fact that they'll team up, buff each other, and chase you for part of the time, but not forever. It's quite clever that usually you can't just do the classic FF tactic of RUN RUN RUN because the enemies you pulled behind you will still be at the exit of the area if you return to it, and will summarily beat the shit out of you. The vast variety of enemies was good, and it's nice that the more you kill, the more information you unlock in the Clan Primer. Nice idea. I liked the fact that you had Flying enemies, hard shelled enemies and suchlike, all encouraging you to use different tactics and keeping the gameplay varied. Oh, and nice not to have to cast Scan on every enemy and Boss like the other games make you!

The quality of the level design varied. Some of the areas were really well done, with spreads of different difficulties of enemies and types, and interesting routes to follow and bits to explore. Large outdoor areas did tend to feel very samey though (within the region). The dungeons were generally pretty pants in design, and I agree with you lot about Geruvegan and the shitty lead up to it - ballsing around in those snow ruins, and then in the city itself - absolutely rubbish level design. "Going down 20 ramps in a row will be fun!!!" and then after that in the crystal: "wandering around more ramps and circles with no map will be brilliant!" My God! The massive tower by the waterfalls towards the end of the game was also incredibly long, boring and uninspired - I almost lost the will to play any more. Bits like that reminded me of the awful levels in Final Fantasy X. There were some decent dungeons though - the mines in Bhujerba for example. I found the cities pretty dull as well (don't start me on Old Archades and information quests!), so a pretty mixed bag for levels overall.

One thing I do really like in the game is that you end up revisiting old areas all the time - where in other FF games you tend to not need to revisit old areas unless you're looking for secrets. I loved stuff like revisiting Barheim passage to uncover that whole new part. Then you go also back to the mines in Bhujerba multiple times and unlock more of it. There's the locked bits in Golmore forest. There's the Zertinan caverns which you eventually get deeper and deeper into. The Rains in Giza. The Waterway. And of course Marks force you to revisit and explore old areas all the time too (and I suppose Rare Game if you can be arsed). It's really well done.

Talking about Marks, to begin with I thought they were a bit annoying, but I grew quite addicted to taking them down, and you often need to, to make cash or level up to progress in the storyline. By the end of the game I managed to take down about 46 of them (I maxed out my Clan rank) - I was too low level to do the Marks at the end of the Bhujerba mines, I didn't know where the "Strong" one was. And the other one really took the piss. It's the Wyrm in Paramina Rift. I spent hours trying to make it appear (your clue is it comes out in a blizzard). I eventually got too pissed off and checked an FAQ online. Turns out you can only make it appear by taking a specific route through the whole Rift from the questgiver. Absolute bullshit. Completely different to any other Mark, and there's no way you could figure that out without an FAQ or by sheer luck. It really pisses me off because the concept is basically that you won't get to see all the game unless you buy their strategy guide. GRRR. At that point I refused to fight it on principal. Apart from that though, the Marks were well done and a real challenge. What's Montblanc's reason for setting up the club then? I assume there is some epic Mark at the end or something?

Espers. I didn't really use these. I read a few pages back in the thread that most of you did the same. I did collect about 12 of them, but they didn't really help much, they were only handy now and then. Good fighting against them though (especially the ones which drain health, etc - owch!) The problem with using the Espers is that because there's only one Esper, against multiple enemies they get swamped and can't heal quickly enough. And against bosses, the enemy attacks tend to kill them really quickly (or the boss will just twat the summoner and kill him quickly). I also didn't use them much because of the unskippable animations (summoning, special attacks). Seems stupid to me that you can't skip those, when you can skip everything else in the game. I guess Final Fantasy will always force you to watch their piss annoying long Summon cutscenes, and special attacks (the Quickenings are also really annoying for this). I kept meaning to use Espers to fight normal enemies, but I always forgot - though I guess in areas where they might come in handy, they'd just get killed quickly anyway.

I thought the licence board was pretty ace. I liked the sheer customisation you could give your characters, and it was always nice to havea reward after some slogging combat to be able to increase your characters abilities, spells, or weapons and armour. I found Techniques to be pretty useless though, other methods being far more reliable (Techniques in FF games have always been too finnickity and unnecessary, especially the incredibly boring Steal!). I also never used those magic staff weapon things (Fire. On hit Bubble, etc) - can anyone explain them to me? Seemed like too much fiddling around! I ended up with a lot of good weapons, armour, spells and accessories, though I didn't get a lot of the really rare ones (Excalibur, Renew spell, Ribbon, etc). I'm guessing a lot of them come from the Rare Game shop, but there's no way I could be bothered going out to hunt 80(!) rare game, when I'd already done pretty much everything else. In the first part of the game the board was a bit too stingy, and you would be struggling to kit your characters out with good abilities, spells and weapons.

What else did I miss in the game? I know I missed the final Marks. There were some doors opened with medals in the Necrohol I couldn't open (I never found the Numu the guy in the Deadlands talks about). There was a door or something up by Roblon in Deadlands which I couldn't open. I didn't bother opening the door down in the Sohen Palace - though I did find out how to after many boring hours (run around in circles), I couldn't be arsed to go back and do it though. I also wasn't high enough level to delve into the lvl 50 + 60 areas of Lhusu or the other mines (though I ran through one of them to see if I could beat the final encounter with Gilgamesh.... he kicked my arse!). I also didn't fork out 250000 gil for the Urn in the Bazarre - what does that do? I'm not sure if I missed any Espers - I think I had 10 or 12. As far as I know I explored all the game world and maps, except for the 2 mines I mentioned above. I got up to about level 24 on the running mini-game before I vowed never to do it again. I also never found the Cockatrice beginning with C, that the one in Rabanastre wants to see if he'll return home. I returned all the other Cockatrices I found (except for the Balfonheim one who won't go). I think that's it!

So all in all a very good outing for Final Fantasy and they've really done an excellent job in many areas, and it's so fresh and new! The gameplay, design and balance is by far the best in any of the series. If the story was more gripping and the game didn't sag in some places it would be bloody brilliant. It'll be interesting to see what they do with the next one.

[David Kenny]

Nice mini-review there.

The wyrm in the paramina rift was indeed a complete bugger to find, although there are subtle clues if you spot them. As for the purpose of the Hunter's Club,

You're quite right, Montblanc set up the club to find the ultimate warrior to take down a massive Wrym, Yiazmat. It was an utter pain in the arse to take down, with 50 million hit points, and attacks that caused instant death. I think it took me 7 hours in all, although you could leave the area and come back without him regenerating his health too much.

I spent over 200 hours hunting down all the marks, bosses and rare game (I never did find all of them actually) and I'm seriously considering starting it again. Brilliant game.

[Stolly]

Cleverly avoiding Alan's write up, I've just got going on FFXII and am already hooked. I've just hit the desert to hunt and kill a tomato headed bod and, although I'm sure I'm missing one or two tricks, so far equipping, updating licences, using the inventory and map all seem very straight forward. Fighting too, although I've got bugger all to use apart from a sword, potions and whatnot and a 'steal' ability. My armour appears to be a leather hat at the minute .

One small step then on what could be a big journey by the looks of things.

[Stolly]

I'm not looking for help by the way but I am having a real nightmare getting through some dungeony tunnels about 6 hours into the game - where mimics (robot spider like jobs) are sapping power from the lights and where spectres come out if it gets to dark! Its certainly taught me to get my gambits properly working...... and my levels up. And I'm not letting it beat me and will just level up if need be until I can breeze my way out

I am now at the start of the area with the lizard bazaar man with a team of level 8's all with pretty good weapons, battery power at 100%, no battery mimics to kill in the adjacent area but mimics, undead and flans to kill where the door opening charger thing is*, a shed load of phoenix down, potions, antidotes and eye drops, a well balanced set of gambits with healing in mind and a couple of the team able to use some tasty black magick and am going in again.......

* where I have been killed half a dozen times or more so far

[Stolly]

Continuing my one man thread (the trouble with playing games long after everyone else), I breezed through the remainder of Barheim Passage having suddenly worked out just how easily flans and battery mimics can now be killed - even the queen mimic was soon toast to my hardened team of level 8's