Killzone 2

[Meh]

Oh, come on, even I can see that it looks quite lush.

[Talk Show Host]

But that's all FMV, isn't it? The Vekta take off to the Helghan planet is what I presume you're talking about. The intro that's been knocking around for a while. it's not in game, or so I was led to believe.

I really don't know. Upon looking at it seems to be between FMV and in-engine. Crazy I know, but the graphics in actual gameplay are near that level so it's easy to make a mistake.

Simply glorious.

p.s. I'll check it again today when I am not that tired.

[squirtle]

I really don't know. Upon looking at it seems to be between FMV and in-engine. Crazy I know, but the graphics in actual gameplay are near that level so it's easy to make a mistake.

Simply glorious.

p.s. I'll check it again today when I am not that tired.

I'm sure I read that it was a video of the engine with added post processing and stuff. It's not running in real time is the point I'm trying to make.

I'm positive that's what I read somewhere.

[Yoshimax]

They did that with Gears1 at the end of act1 - too much going on for UE3 to manage realtime so they'd basically rendered out the scene on a powerful pc, captured it as video then played it back in-game HD.

Worked very well.

[Mr.Crowley]

Oh, come on, even I can see that it looks quite lush.

It's weird because I'm a graphics whore as big as anyone. It looks really solid and cohesive, but I feel like Killzone 2 showed me all its tricks after barely half an hour. The levels are pretty small, and I know its a fucking cliché at this point but it's all in shades of brown and grey.

Maybe some crazy shit happens towards the end, I dunno.

[Smitty]

They were talking about this on Idle Thumbs the other week, and the guy said he couldn't really understand the high scores, he found it very uninspiring.

[Looper]

Might get Street Fighter 4 instead of this now and get this in a month when it does a Little Big Planet and drops to £20.

[Stolly]

Kindly stolen from gaf

[aeternum_vale]

Boom na da mmm dum na ema

Da boom na da mmm dum na ema

Da boom na da mmm dum na ema

Da boom na da mmm dum na ema

Da boom na da mmm dum na ema

Da boom na da mmm dum na ema

Da boom na da mmm dum na ema

Da boom na da mmm dum na ema

Da boom na da mmm dum na ema

Da boom na da mmm dum na ema

Da boom na da mmm dum na ema

Da boom na da mmm dum na ema

Da boom na da mmm dum na ema

Go!

So...fight! something on the...

Fight...some things they fight

So...something on the...

Fight...some things they fight

Fight...something of the

No...some things they fight

Fight...something of the...

Fight...some things they fight

Something takes a part of me.

You and I were meant to be.

A cheap fuck for me to lay

Something takes a part of me.

Part of me...

Part of me...

Part of me...

LOLDOG.

[Taurus]

They were talking about this on Idle Thumbs the other week, and the guy said he couldn't really understand the high scores, he found it very uninspiring.

That's how I feel about it, too. It's a poor man's Gears of War, and Gears of War was bad enough.

[biglime]

I don't think the British fall for the crazy hyperhypehype as much as the Americans do.

The game's a bit of an also-ran.

[Lorfarius]

Been trying to download the demo from PSN all day long but everytime I select the download option it crashes the whole store Cant exit or cancel and no matter how long I leave it only a reset gets everything working again. Ruddy Sony.

[MK-1601]

The game's a bit of an also-ran.

You seem to be pointing that out an awful lot of times.

[Robo_1]

I don't think the British fall for the crazy hyperhypehype as much as the Americans do.

True, but it's matched by British cynicism, which can become equally grating and predictable.

One thing's for sure, I'll be happy when I've got the game in my hands, and can ignore both the hype merchants and doom mongers and make my own mind up.

[aeternum_vale]

You seem to be pointing that out an awful lot of times.

I think what he's saying is, if you go into this expecting "THE BEST GAME EVERRRRRRRR!!1" you'll come away disappointed but if you go in thinking it's gonna be good but not perfect you'll probably be more impressed.

When shit's hyped it often disappoints.

[Meh]

They did that with Gears1 at the end of act1 - too much going on for UE3 to manage realtime so they'd basically rendered out the scene on a powerful pc, captured it as video then played it back in-game HD.

Worked very well.

I recall being rather annoyed at that. They'd gotten this lush game going on, and still have to bung in bloody FMV. Fooled a few people I know, too, since it uses pretty much the same assets.

[Meh]

It's weird because I'm a graphics whore as big as anyone. It looks really solid and cohesive, but I feel like Killzone 2 showed me all its tricks after barely half an hour. The levels are pretty small, and I know its a fucking cliché at this point but it's all in shades of brown and grey.

Maybe some crazy shit happens towards the end, I dunno.

I'm only basing my opinion off of what the demo offered, and I was pretty drunk at the time, but the models etc all looked really bloody detailed.

[Robo_1]

When shit's hyped it often disappoints.

So true, I'd be hard pressed to think of many big games which haven't been the victim of some sort of backlash after release. At least with KZ2, Sony have allowed reviews to be published close to a month before release, followed by a demo. That does show enormous confidence in a product, as if the quality wasn't there, they'd be in huge trouble at the moment.

At present, it's tracking at a metacritic score of 92, I've played the demo, I've read the comments of people who were on the beta and I've read the reviews of sources I trust. At this point, I can be pretty sure I'm not going to be disappointed.

Other gamers mileage may vary, but at least Sony haven't gone to any lengths to stifle information, not unless people believe they've money hatted 30 odd review scores!

Just to be clear as well, I do genuinely appreciate Biglime coming on here and sharing his honest opinion of the game. I dare say his tempering of peoples expectations has meant the difference between people coming away from the demo satisfied or disappointed, so that can only be a good thing. At this point though, there's enough information out there for me to know that for me, it's going to be far from an "also ran".

[Taurus]

True, but it's matched by British cynicism, which can become equally grating and predictable.

I think that any game featuring big gruff men swearing at each other about how they want to shoot everybody's faces off deserves a certain amount of cynicism. Nevertheless, I hadn't read any of the reviews about Killzone 2 when I played it, so I could only come to my own conclusions, which is that it seems to have been poorly cobbled together from bits of other games. I think that there will be plenty of people for whom the sound and fury will be enough, but personally I would prefer better AI and decent design. I like shooting people in the face as much as the next man, but I'm not sure Killzone 2 is the best example of the genre.

[Robo_1]

I think that any game featuring big gruff men swearing at each other about how they want to shoot everybody's faces off deserves a certain amount of cynicism. Nevertheless, I hadn't read any of the reviews about Killzone 2 when I played it, so I could only come to my own conclusions, which is that it seems to have been poorly cobbled together from bits of other games. I think that there will be plenty of people for whom the sound and fury will be enough, but personally I would prefer better AI and decent design. I like shooting people in the face as much as the next man, but I'm not sure Killzone 2 is the best example of the genre.

Surprised to see you quote the A.I. as something that needs improving, as that's one of the features which has received across the board praise, and to be frank, better design is too broad a comment to really react to.

Either way, I'm certainly not somebody who gets bent out of shape when people don't enjoy the same games I do. The only point I wanted to make, was that Sony have shown their hand when it comes to KZ2, and I think enough information is out there now for people to decide whether it's worth a punt. The reviews I respect have given it a thumbs up, so that combined with the positive comments about the beta and the demo have convinced me it'll be top.

Nothing more to be said until I've got the full thing.

[Taurus]

Surprised to see you quote the A.I. as something that needs improving, as that's one of the features which has received across the board praise, and to be frank, better design is to broad a comment to really react to.

Yeah, I wasn't looking for a reaction, I just thought that I'd add my thoughts about the game to the thread (I thought that was what the thread was for). I haven't read any reviews, but I'm very surprised that anyone would praise the AI because it always seems to react in the same way, and I got through most of the game by simply learning the placements and routines of enemies (which is something I haven't really done in a 3D shooting game since before Halo). As for design, I couldn't really be bothered to spell it out, but if you want me to, I'd just point to the poor low-level design of the environments, and the by-the-numbers feel of it all (eg. here's a sniper alley bit; here's an ambush; defend this emplacement). Or there's the snap-to cover system that's been nicked from Gears of War, but doesn't work as well. Or the two-gun limit which was nicked from Halo but again, not as well because you can only change one weapon (I realise this was in the first game too, but it doesn't make it any less annoying). As for the narrative, and the way it ties together with the action, I still have no idea what was going on, or why I was doing anything that I did, other than to link those different challenges together.

But yeah, I don't want to go on about it because people are free to make their own minds up.

[englishbob]

In stock now at Play

http://www.awin1.com/cread.php?awinmid=1418&awinaffid=84045&clickref=&p=http://www.play.com/Games/PlayStation3/4-/...-2/Product.html

[Robo_1]

Yeah, I wasn't looking for a reaction, I just thought that I'd add my thoughts about the game to the thread (I thought that was what the thread was for).

Oh yeah totally, I certainly wasn't trying to infer anything else (sorry if that's how I came across), the more opinions gathered the better.

As for the rest of your comments, well yeah, you were clearly nonplussed by it, but you've backed up your opinions so fair enough. I can only imagine you'll be raising your eye brows at the various reviews dotted around the net - in-particular Edge's review, as despite being the lowest scorer so far, they reckon the A.I. is pretty stunning.

[Ben]

In stock now at Play

http://www.awin1.com/cread.php?awinmid=141...-2/Product.html

Hmm, will I have a problem walking into a shop next Friday and buying the game? I cancelled my Play order as I won't be at home for most of next week but I've had problems buying some of these AAA titles on release day in the past.

[Dude Ranch]

In stock now at Play

Is this right, I could order it now and get it early next week?

[Taurus]

...the A.I. is pretty stunning.

I am genuinely surprised. I think the AI makes things hard, but I don't think it's very sophisticated. It feels, to me, like it cheats by always knowing your position; I've seen enemies just standing around; and like I say, I've got through every single difficult encounter by just playing it through a couple of times and knowing the attack patterns. If I think back to, say, Call of Duty 4 (off the top of my head), I would know where enemies were placed and where they'd start attacking from, but it never seemed to help too much because the AI would react in so many different ways. Maybe it's because the levels aren't as open in Killzone 2, or because there are more bottlenecks in the level layouts (so you can wait on the other side of a door for all the enemies to chase you through, for example).

But! Like I say I don't want to go on about it (even more than I already have!) because clearly I'm in the minority here and I don't want to ruin other people's enjoyment by seeming to carp on.

[Goldenballs]

I don't think Play send stuff out over the weekend, so the earliest they'd despatch would be Monday, and it usually takes a couple of days to get delivered from Jersey (or Guernsey or wherever) so you're looking at Wednesday at the earliest.

[biglime]

AI is one of those things that...

Right, I genuinely believe that most people who praise or criticise AI don't have a clue what they're talking about. Do you know what I mean? As gamers I think we all think we can make a sweeping comment on a game's AI after a half hour of playing, as if it's always some in-your-face evident and obvious thing. But it rarely is.

Whenever I see anyone saying THE AI IS AMAZING or THE AI IS SHIT I take it with a pinch of salt. Even back in the day when people would say about Halo THE AI IS AMAZING ON LEGENDARY I would go...yeah, but is it? I think people sometimes imagine behaviour to be better or worse than it actually is. Just to be clear, I think the enemy behaviour in Halo is wonderful.

EDIT: This is not a pop at Taurus by the way. I agree with what he's saying about the game. I'm talking about the OMG AI chat on the American sites. I'm kinda like "you don't even know what AI means, do you?"

[Taurus]

But! Like I say I don't want to go on about it (even more than I already have!) because clearly I'm in the minority here and I don't want to ruin other people's enjoyment by seeming to carp on.

Actually, I do want to carp on about just one more thing: the script is utterly risible, even for a videogame.

There is a thread in off topic about some guy whose friend asked him for advice about a movie script full of lines like 'don't be the problem, kid, be the solution.' That movie script sounds like it is at least ten times better than the nonsense that somebody managed to puke up for Killzone 2.

[Stolly]

Actually, I do want to carp on about just one more thing: the script is utterly risible, even for a videogame.

There is a thread in off topic about some guy whose friend asked him for advice about a movie script full of lines like 'don't be the problem, kid, be the solution.' That movie script sounds like it is at least ten times better than the nonsense that somebody managed to puke up for Killzone 2.

What do you think of the multiplayer Taurus?