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Metal Gear Solid 4


jeroenr
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I'm with Spacehost here. They copped out of a grim ending, for reals.

I thought

bringing him back as a barely-human lump of meat, reuniting him with Eva only for them both to die like that, was quite in keeping with the fatalistic, mortality-obsessed nature of the plot.

But no, it's not really who you thought it was! Ho ho!

Eva was faking sorrow, since she was one of the people who helped arrange his resurrection!

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I'm getting to the end of act 2 now and there are a couple of things that are grating.

First,

Naomi is american. WTF.

Second,

that whole cutscene with her giving snake a medical was rubbish, cryptic, boring nonsense. On a par with MGS2 standards or rubbish.

Most disappointing of all was when

octo-woman swore. Said the word "fucking" for no reason at all. I don't remember heavy swearing in MGS games before. Just unnecessary.

Oh well. The actual gameplay is still genius. Perhaps the best MGS gameplay yet... perhaps the worst cutscenes yet as well.

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I'm getting to the end of act 2 now and there are a couple of things that are grating.

First,

Naomi is american. WTF.

Second,

that whole cutscene with her giving snake a medical was rubbish, cryptic, boring nonsense. On a par with MGS2 standards or rubbish.

Most disappointing of all was when

octo-woman swore. Said the word "fucking" for no reason at all. I don't remember heavy swearing in MGS games before. Just unnecessary.

Oh well. The actual gameplay is still genius. Perhaps the best MGS gameplay yet... perhaps the worst cutscenes yet as well.

I can only accept you saying this if you are blind. Or mad.

You have my sympathies then.

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I'm getting to the end of act 2 now and there are a couple of things that are grating.

First,

Naomi is american. WTF.

Second,

that whole cutscene with her giving snake a medical was rubbish, cryptic, boring nonsense. On a par with MGS2 standards or rubbish.

Most disappointing of all was when

octo-woman swore. Said the word "fucking" for no reason at all. I don't remember heavy swearing in MGS games before. Just unnecessary.

Oh well. The actual gameplay is still genius. Perhaps the best MGS gameplay yet... perhaps the worst cutscenes yet as well.

Yeah, they removed any of the heavy accents in Twin Snakes. Something about Kojima saying they never intended for them to be quite so strong. It's a pity, how they were in MGS1 is how I know them best.

I actually thought the swearing was handled well, the BB Corps were quite unsettling at times and that one unexpected instance of strong swearing worked quite well.

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I'm getting to the end of act 2 now and there are a couple of things that are grating.

First,

Naomi is american. WTF.

It's not just me who remembers her

being English in MGS1 then?

Most disappointing of all was when

octo-woman swore. Said the word "fucking" for no reason at all. I don't remember heavy swearing in MGS games before. Just unnecessary.

I spat my tea out at that. Very odd. Are there any other potty-mouthed outbursts like that in the game?

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Well remember I'm only near the end of Act 2. I reserve the right to change my mind if things get better in that department.

But so far? Cutscenes and plot are sub-MGS2. And that's harsh!

No, they are not as far as I am concerned. They are superlative techically and the direction is really better, more dramatic, kinetic and full of detail.

Also the story makes much more sense than MGS2, more sense in a MGS way of course. It is easier to follow and the characters are fleshed out better.

To each his own I guess.

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I spat my tea out at that. Very odd. Are there any other potty-mouthed outbursts like that in the game?

Yeah,

there's a hidden codec call with Otacon - in Shadow Moses, after you've gone through the canyon and then down the lift in the next room, past the electric grill, call up Otacon and he'll ask how Snake took out a tank all those years ago, and then proceed to call him "the shit", because he's a hardcore badass or something. It's great.

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I Lol'ed at that. It was the delivery as much as anything. As for

naomi's accent

, it didn't sound much different to me and Jennifer Hale has done the voice every time. That said I might have to fire up mgs1 and hassle her on the codec for a minute or two

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I Lol'ed at that. It was the delivery as much as anything. As for

naomi's accent

, it didn't sound much different to me and Jennifer Hale has done the voice every time. That said I might have to fire up mgs1 and hassle her on the codec for a minute or two

It's the same as it was in Twin Snakes, which is a lot different to the original. Same with (act 5 spoiler I suppose)

Mei Ling

.

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I think you just need to call her with a ration equipped.

Regarding the ending, my only problem with

Big Boss reappearing

is that the scene drags on for far too long, with

Snake being much too passive for it to impact as it should

. But I get Kojima's intent, as in the end

who else but Big Boss could have said anything meaningful to Snake ?

. And I love love love love

those final couple of shots: "it's good, isn't it", the cigar falling, the sustained long shot of the two of them together and, wham, fade to black. Stunning composition there.

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I think you just need to call her with a ration equipped.

Regarding the ending, my only problem with

Big Boss reappearing

is that the scene drags on for far too long, with

Snake being much too passive for it to impact as it should

. But I get Kojima's intent, as in the end

who else but Big Boss could have said anything meaningful to Snake ?

. And I love love love love

those final couple of shots: "it's good, isn't it", the cigar falling, the sustained long shot of the two of them together and, wham, fade to black. Stunning composition there.

Yeah, the final shot was really great and did sort of make up for it. I don't have a problem with Big Boss coming back, after making him a much more sympathetic character in MGS3 it made sense to give him a slightly more positive send off. It's just annoying that Snake was so passive throughout the entire game, let alone in the ending. He really did fuck all except talk about smoking and repeat whatever people said to him.

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Err, no.

Les Enfants Terribles was the Patriots' attempt to replace Big Boss with a controllable set of lackies, but unfortunately it produced a despot, an anarchist and the world's greatest mullet.

:(

I understand that's how formulaic it was meant to be and as I say it's my interpretation of the events from Metal Gear 1 through MGS1 to MGS4, but from the way each of the characters talked it seemed that they knew from the outset that Zero was veering away from the original Patriot plan with his own fascistic view of how things were to be. They knew what he was planning and had proferred to Zero that Les Enfants Terrible was a means to carry on the Big Boss lineage with a view to creating the ultimate controllable soldier, but unknown to Zero it was with actually with a view to have these soldiers wrestle control of 'the system', being that which has taken many different forms over the years (be it revolutionary weapons technology ie: REX or RAY, nanomachine enhancement or genome modification) but was ultimately Zero's ambition to have overall control of all the soldiers of the world.

Liquid tried to take control of the genome enhanced soldiers by taking Rex and asserting his authority by force but again Snake was made to stop him and Solidus tried to take control by becoming the most powerful elected official on the planet and subversively putting all the US arms under the control of AI but again Snake, in the form of Raiden whose war training and psyche profile was based on Snake and Gray Fox, was made to stop him and finally Liquid re-emerging as the dominant psyche in Ocelot to try and control the nanotechnology which had become a standard application in all the world's soldiers for ID purposes.

'David' has been the only one of that lineage who wanted to stop ANYONE from having ultimate control over a soldiers will because he believed, as the original Boss believed, that suppression of, or over-exposure to, extreme emotions in conflict would mean that any individual in those circumstances would never comprehend the choices, sacrifices and losses have to happen to allow a person to live through conflict to become a true warrior of the battlefield (pretty much all he and the Boss go on about about throughout MGS1 and MGS3 respectively).

Basically the entire story arc is open to each person's interpretation with the amount of blanks here and there but that's mine.

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Most disappointing of all was when

octo-woman swore. Said the word "fucking" for no reason at all. I don't remember heavy swearing in MGS games before. Just unnecessary.

I spat my tea out at that. Very odd. Are there any other potty-mouthed outbursts like that in the game?

:(

You fucking prudes.

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It still has full, proper first person aiming and shooting plus a good third person system now, so what are you complaining about?

To reiterate, my complaint was that the controls have changed from previous MGS games for little discernible reason.

Because in third-person you get a wider field of view?

Hasn't hampered the other games any by not having this increased peripheral vision.

:(

You fucking prudes.

Don't get me wrong, I didn't cough up because I was offended, it made me laugh. Seemed so out of place and ridiculous.

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To reiterate, my complaint was that the controls have changed from previous MGS games for little discernible reason.

And we mentioned how the change in control has allowed a much better third person aiming system. And you said how is that better than a full first person system. Which kind of answers itself when both are available. There are some justifed complaints people can make but the massive improvement on the controls doesn't seem to be one of them.

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I will reiterate once more: I'm not saying the controls are bad, just different enough to previous games to cause some confusion and disorientation.

It's not that hard to understand. If PES came out this year and swapped the shoot and pass buttons around there'd be some embarrassing goal-mouth incidents until you got used to it.

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They've moved "aim" and "fire" off the front of the pad, so you can actually aim your gun and move at the same time. Even in Subsistence you couldn't run and fire a weapon except via Auto Aim. If MGS4 had Subsistence's controls it would be borderline unplayable.

Unplayable mess -> Playable game. QED.

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I will reiterate once more: I'm not saying the controls are bad, just different enough to previous games to cause some confusion and disorientation.

It's not that hard to understand. If PES came out this year and swapped the shoot and pass buttons around there'd be some embarrassing goal-mouth incidents until you got used to it.

There is a degree of Control tuition and learning in EVERY fucking game. Regardless of it's position as a sequel.

I don't get mad and confused because the control systems of COD4 and Halo3 are a bit different! They're both in the same genre.

MGS3 has an extremely convoluted control system. I love that game to bit but it sure was a bit of a hand cramp! The controller felt completely overloaded.

The Improved controls of MGS4 is one of it's biggest accomplishments. almost every move in MGS3 is available to you and MORE whilst also feeling streamlined and totally intuitive.

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I haven't played a MGS game since finishing MGS1 on the PS1 all those years ago, but I couldn't resist the cheap price for this from shopto and ordered it last night. I must say, I'm really looking forward to more Solid Snake!

Does it actually have 90 minute cut scenes then? Can they be skipped or paused or what?

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It has long cutscenes, dunno about 90 minutes though. They can be paused/skipped. You'll want to watch most of them though. There aren't many games where I watch a cutscene and then think it's about to go back to gameplay but I'm there going "no wait I wanna watch this shit!".

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I will reiterate once more: I'm not saying the controls are bad, just different enough to previous games to cause some confusion and disorientation.

It's not that hard to understand. If PES came out this year and swapped the shoot and pass buttons around there'd be some embarrassing goal-mouth incidents until you got used to it.

I understand what you're saying. Whilst I, and you presumably, had no problems with the control scheme of the 3 previous games, others may have not as they may have found them overly complicated. Seriously, I've seen people who've never played the game before and they really struggled with the controls. Therefore I think they had no choice but to change them. As people have already mentioned, the control scheme is far more intuitive and far easier to get into.

Anyway, so I finished this on Big Boss Hard last night with no kills and no alerts and almost no rations (1 used). All I can say is that the

bike sequence

(Act 3) is so not fun when you can't kill anyone. That was a real pain to do. What I will say is that Kevvy Metal was totally right about saying Act 4 is awesome to play stealthily. It was incredibly tense to get through without being seen.

I now plan to go through Hard again but this time I'm going to absolutely destroy everything and anyone during the battle sections, and go for some CQC throat slitting for the stealthy bits. None shall live!

I'm also going to do Extreme at some point although I'm contemplating on whether I should go for the Big Boss emblem. The only thing that is putting me is again the

bike sequence

. I don't know if I could go through that on a harder difficulty, it could possibly drive me insane.

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