Red Steel 2

[scottcr]

Bye then!

so you've decided then? Eurogamer likes it

[Vemsie]

Kills and Combos Walkthrough

Kills and Combos Gameplay

Holy hell, this new build looks amazing. Sad to see there's no epic amounts of blood though.

It looks really good. It's been awhile since I said that about a Wii game.

[Mr. Gerbik]

so you've decided then? Eurogamer likes it

Maybe it doesn't even matter whether it's good or not. It's on the Wii, it's third-party, it's a 'core' game, in short Ziggy projects there's a 99.9% probability that it will bomb regardless.

They would be better off bringing part three to the PS Wand

[Vemsie]

Hidden moves vid

And a preview

[son_of_helvetica]

Looks very promising indeed. Wonder how little it will sell

[hanzo]

Kotaku have a preview on this today, and it sounds like corridory simpleton boredom time. This has got flop written all over it. It's just too confused imo

http://kotaku.com/5476604/hands+on-sword-o...ith-red-steel-2

The game's controls take a bit of getting used to, but once you come to grips with the fact that your motions are essentially triggers for the animation on the screen, like a fancy button push, the game becomes a lot more fun.

My 8-year-old son, Tristan, also likes the teen-rated game. Its combination of broad and precise motion, its colorful aesthetic, come together to deliver an experience far more fun than the original Red Steel. Being only about half-way through the title, it's too early to tell if there will be enough of those complex fights and blending of motions to make the game the sort of deep experience I want, or whether the end result will be a game that feels too light, too easy to be satisfying.

[scottcr]

the review is very positive...

[Retroid]

Somebody here is working on this game - does that make it good now?

[hanzo]

9 out of 10

[RubberJohnny]

It'll come out, scott will praise it for it's art style, level design, controls and moveset.

Meh will pirate it and say it's proper shit.

scott will then instantly concede that most things in it aren't very good, yeah.

It won't sell.

[Retroid]

9 out of 10

...

On a serious note, it's pretty much sold to me - I just need to know how fluid the combos are and how acurate the gunfighting is. If both are good then I reckon this will probably be the Wii's GOTY.

[Massive Invisible Dog]

From the recent trailers it looks a bit more like a first person Devil May Cry-like game than an FPS.

[Girth Certificate]

The game's controls take a bit of getting used to, but once you come to grips with the fact that your motions are essentially triggers for the animation on the screen, like a fancy button push, the game becomes a lot more fun.

[scottcr]

did you expect it to be anything else... 1:1 sword fighting just isn't practical in a game...

there's a cracking video earlier in this thread where the main man associated with the game explains that the game is supposed to make you feel like a ninja - but not actually have to *be* a ninja to be able to wield a samurai.

[Sprite Machine]

did you expect it to be anything else... 1:1 sword fighting just isn't practical in a game...

We wouldn't know, no-one's bothered to try it yet.

I don't think it's technically capable of doing it anyway, even with MotionPlus. There's not enough input data to know where you are at all times.

(That said, I was already aware RS2 wouldn't have 1:1 controls, but I reckon it looks pretty good anyway.)

[Massive Invisible Dog]

WSR had 1:1 control, or at least a very close approximation since it has to fudge some of it.

[Rudderless]

WSR had 1:1 control, or at least a very close approximation since it has to fudge some of it.

It's certainly a lot closer than that Natal video. There's still time for MS to sort that, but I think that's a flaw inherent with any camera-based motion system - you're always going to get a slight delay.

[rgraves]

We wouldn't know, no-one's bothered to try it yet.

I don't think it's technically capable of doing it anyway, even with MotionPlus. There's not enough input data to know where you are at all times.

Looks like the development team 'bothered to try it' - and guess what, they thought it didn't work:

"We make the decision of how to use MotionPlus differently for different actions," says VandenBerghe. "On the one-to-one end of the spectrum, we have blocking, where the motion is as close to accurate as we can have it while still making you look like a hero. What we found, though, is that if you do true one-to-one, you just look like an idiot. You look terrible. It's just so bad. So bad.

"The fantasy of the hero doesn't survive that one-to-one modelling, so we're always doing a little bit of handholding. Every attack goes through the centre of the screen, for example, no matter where you're swinging - but the angle of that attack is 100 per cent determined by you and what you did. It's not like there's eight slashes - there's an infinite number of slashes.

"On the other end of the spectrum, we have special moves which are deliberately triggered actions," he continues. "You push a button and swing in a particular way, and as long as you get the input right, we're going to pull off a cool move that may not always look that much like what you physically did. We're using the MotionPlus to get a better idea of what you want to be doing, and then we make sure you get the result you wanted."

Watching VandenBerghe - who, granted, has had a fair bit of experience by now - play through one of the game's later stages suggests that once you've really got to grips with things you can blast around Ubisoft's world with real style, leaving an expert series of gored nasties in your wake.

[Retroid]

I hope they have options or a mode where 1:1 controls are possible, you know for when nobody else is around.

[Sprite Machine]

Developer in 'justifying their decision' shock.

I for one would like to look like an idiot.

[Massive Invisible Dog]

It's not about looking like an idiot, it'd just be loads worse.

[RubberJohnny]

It's not about looking like an idiot, it'd just be loads worse.

Yeah, but I think people would like to judge for themselves rather than take the word of PR.

[Super Craig]

Yeah, and then they'd moan when the game controls like shit.

[scottcr]

we'll see what they do with Zelda

I expect Zelda to be shown today at the Nintendo Media Summit

[Massive Invisible Dog]

Yeah, but I think people would like to judge for themselves rather than take the word of PR.

Why? I'd rather they just make the game as good as they can instead of throwing in something that anyone who has thought it through will realise is definitely going to be shit, let alone the people actually making it who are in a position to try it. It's not just something that could be toggled on and off, it would change the game completely.

If Capcom said Natal control wouldn't be added to a new Street Fighter because it would be ludicrous, would you demand they add it anyway just so you can try it for ten seconds then realise they were right and never try again?

[Sprite Machine]

instead of throwing in something that anyone who has thought it through will realise is definitely going to be shit

I've thought it through. It definitely wouldn't be shit.

[Massive Invisible Dog]

I've thought it through. It definitely wouldn't be shit.

Playing through a whole game standing up and doing all the proper motions? Rubbish, might as well just boil it down to flicks of the wrist/forearm which give identical results, it's still more control than you'd have with buttons and sticks without massively overcomplicating them. 1:1 would make using gestures for the special attacks weird as well, whereas if you're using gestures then just holding an extra button to do specials will feel quite natural.

1:1 is all well and good for something simple like Wii Sports Resort but for something more complex like this, no chance. They're right to concentrate on nailing the gestural control.

[Sprite Machine]

1:1 is all well and good for something simple like Wii Sports Resort but for something more complex like this, no chance.

Well, that's what I thought you were referring to - not that Red Steel 2 as it exists now would better with 1:1 controls, but that a 1:1 controls game would be a good, if Red Steel 2 was made to be one.* Then your point about combo triggers or whatever wouldn't be relevant because there wouldn't be any, because it would just be a 1:1 sword fighting game, and it would be awesome. But no-one has made one yet.

And WiiSports Resort swordplay isn't 1:1, although it's probably as close as you can get with the MotionPlus and sensor bar tech.

*Similarly, a 'Natal mode' shoved into Street Fighter would be rubbish, but a Natal-enabled boxing game, say, could be pretty good.

[Massive Invisible Dog]

Well, that's what I thought you were referring to - not that Red Steel 2 as it exists now would better with 1:1 controls, but that a 1:1 controls game would be a good, if Red Steel 2 was made to be one.* Then your point about combo triggers or whatever wouldn't be relevant because there wouldn't be any, because it would just be a 1:1 sword fighting game, and it would be awesome. But no-one has made one yet.

And WiiSports Resort swordplay isn't 1:1, although it's probably as close as you can get with the MotionPlus and sensor bar tech.

*Similarly, a 'Natal mode' shoved into Street Fighter would be rubbish, but a Natal-enabled boxing game, say, could be pretty good.

Of course I'm talking about Red Steel 2. It's a Red Steel 2 thread and the developer of Red Steel 2 was talking about why it didn't work when they added it to Red Steel 2.

WSR is about as close as you need to get. Some of it might be an illusion of 1:1, but I don't think there's an awful lot 100% accurate move recognition would add to it.

[Sprite Machine]

Of course I'm talking about Red Steel 2. It's a Red Steel 2 thread and the developer of Red Steel 2 was talking about why it didn't work when they added it to Red Steel 2.

Yes, very good. Let me rephrase, then:

I wish they had made Red Steel 2 a 1:1-controlling sword fighting game from the start.