Sega Saturn for Beginners

[silentmajority]

Well, I've just bought a Saturn off Trickytree on here as a gift for a pal, so I thought I should give it a thorough testing before handing it over

The conclusion? I want one! It's a strange beast. The 2D games are astonishing for their "best in show" qualities; obviously there's the usual suspects like Radiant Silvergun, but things like Batsugun, Donpachi, X-Men Vs Street Fighter and Bubble Symphony are full of goodness. They feel exciting, and extremely solid visually.

On the other hand, the complex polygon-based games lack that solidity completely. Daytona USA, for example, is still reasonably playable but the lack of draw distance is just embarrassing, to be honest. I remember that when the Speccy was losing to the Amiga, there was a last hurrah when programmers were getting every last drop of juice out of the rubber beermat with games like Chase HQ. I suspect that the last round of Saturn games felt like this; Burning Rangers, for example, feels like the machine being pushed as far as it will go, and although it pales next to contemporary PSX games in terms of visual solidity, it's exciting to see the machine at its limits.

And something else that leaves me kicking myself; I didn't really realise before yesterday that the Saturn inherited the crown of shmups from the glorious PC Engine. Yes, I've been told many times, but seeing is believing. Now I need to get one for myself (and find room under the telly for it!)

[Popo]

I thought that the JPN version of Daytona usa ran better?

Which version? Saturn USA and CCE are identical to their PAL counterparts, more or less.

Daytona USA, for example, is still reasonably playable but the lack of draw distance is just embarrassing, to be honest

It really is - especially when put up against CCE, which is like hot shit off a shovel by comparison, and yet runs on the same hardware.

Saturn 3D always looked ropey as fuck mind you, the polys looked like they were coming apart at the seams most of the time.

Yet there's something really alluring about the whole look of it!

[Alexlotl]

From what I understand about the various Daytona Variants from Googling:

Daytona USA (all regions) - great controls, godawful pop-up

Daytona CCE (USA/PAL) - controls not quite so good, pop-up much better

Daytona CE (JP) - controls improved, pop-up even more improved

Daytona Netlink Edition (US, PAL?) - same as Daytona CE (JP)

Someone with a chipped Saturn should do a quick investigation, in the name of science.

[Oracle]

I have daytona ce and pal so can do a back to back test later on

[spaceyjase]

From what I understand about the various Daytona Variants from Googling:

Daytona USA (all regions) - great controls, godawful pop-up

Daytona CCE (USA/PAL) - controls not quite so good, pop-up much better

Daytona CE (JP) - controls improved, pop-up even more improved

Daytona Netlink Edition (US, PAL?) - same as Daytona CE (JP)

Someone with a chipped Saturn should do a quick investigation, in the name of science.

Only the first really captures the arcade's AI behaviour

[patters2.0]

From what I understand about the various Daytona Variants from Googling:

Daytona USA (all regions) - great controls, godawful pop-up

Daytona CCE (USA/PAL) - controls not quite so good, pop-up much better

Daytona CE (JP) - controls improved, pop-up even more improved

Daytona Netlink Edition (US, PAL?) - same as Daytona CE (JP)

Someone with a chipped Saturn should do a quick investigation, in the name of science.

Not really knowing how they are 'meant' to handle I can vote for the CE Jap version looking better than the others. I got hold of the normal version and it's awful compared.

[JLM]

God bless ebay.

I acquired a Saturn multitap recently (sadly not one of the amazing Bomberman head ones) and our household (plus guests) had a Bomberman and Deathtank marathon the other day. We're all Bomberman veterans but had forgotten just how amazing the Saturn version is. I have always held it as my favourite version (though Bomberman 2 on the SNES holds a special place in my heart) but I'd totally forgotten the madness of "Combine!" and the Devil item that gives everyone a virus. Amazing stuff.

Also hit Athlete Kings for a bit. The pole vault is as absurdly awkward as I remember but events like 100m, high jump and long jump are still tremendous fun. Always thought it was ludicrous that it only supports two players, but other than that it's a bit excellent. Plus we all got to make "gender row" jokes about Femi Kadiena.

Next on the list for a multiplayer session is Guardian Heroes. I played this to death the first time round and it's in my top ten games of all time, but I've never actually had the equipment to play the arena battles in full on six player mode. All I need to do is teach a couple of housemates and regular visitors how to play it and it will be a riot. Random characters/levels/distribution makes for hilarious games: Cyclops vs Sky Spirit vs Coughing old man vs Wolf vs Undead Hero vs Roper. Fun fun. The main story mode with all its branching arcs is joyous too. The lithium battery died since last time I used the Saturn so I recently went through and unlocked everything again alongside a housemate who loves GH as much as me. Our Serena/Nicole team is unstoppable!

I need X-Men vs Streetfighter next. I find it more enjoyable than MVC2. The smaller roster and slightly less insane gameplay makes for a more wholesome experience for me. Plus I love that Rogue actually steals a special move from each opponent when she kisses them. I realise this would be impractical with MVC2's enormous roster but I still miss that feature.

As a general point, I forgot just how satisfying Saturn pads are to use. Durable, satisfyingly clicky buttons, snug, ergonomic design and the d-pad is just dreamy...

[moosegrinder]

The saturn pad is the best non-analogue pad made, IMO.

[Rev]

The saturn pad is the best non-analogue pad made.

Corrected. It isn't a matter of opinion, just simple fact.

[moosegrinder]

I'm just avoiding the Nintendo fanboys wrath, is all

[Dandy_Sephy]

It's a tie up, the saturn pad has a better layout for fighters for sure

[gone fishin]

Does anyone know where a decent place is to get a 3D pad? Ebay seems to be a bit dry at the moment (they all have NiGHTS bundled with them- which I already own- and cost over £20). I might try a few car boot sales/2nd hand shops this weekend.....

[Rev]

I'm just avoiding the Nintendo fanboys wrath, is all

Wrath from fanboys that don't have enough buttons to play games properly is the most vicious. Because they know they can't win with facts.

[Popo]

From what I understand about the various Daytona Variants from Googling:

Daytona USA (all regions) - great controls, godawful pop-up

Daytona CCE (USA/PAL) - controls not quite so good, pop-up much better

Daytona CE (JP) - controls improved, pop-up even more improved

Daytona Netlink Edition (US, PAL?) - same as Daytona CE (JP)

Someone with a chipped Saturn should do a quick investigation, in the name of science.

For those in the cheap seats, as I mentioned earlier in the thread, the Japanese CE edition has an option to tighten or loosen the way the cars handle, but fundamentally it's the same game - ie, not Daytona USA but something a bit different. Both are good in their own way, but the original is the best for sure.

Trust me, I've been playing these 2 games virtually non-stop for the past month or so.

I'm finding Saturn Bomberman　difficult to find, I can only find Saturn Bomberman:Fight!

[spaceyjase]

It's 'one of those' games that holds its price and is in demand. There are a few on eBay now?

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Bomberman-Sega-Satur...id=p3286.c0.m14

[Wiper]

Corrected. It isn't a matter of opinion, just simple fact.

o/\o

Such a fantastic d-pad.

[Popo]

It's 'one of those' games that holds its price and is in demand. There are a few on eBay now?

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Bomberman-Sega-Satur...id=p3286.c0.m14

I'm in Japan, yo! NTSCJ for life. Although I seem to have found it through a shop.

[Alexlotl]

You could pay less than that for a chip, but I'm not sure what the forum-ethics are of playing copies of dead games on a dead console from a dead-in-any-recognisable-sense company.

[spaceyjase]

I'm in Japan, yo! NTSCJ for life. Although I seem to have found it through a shop.

Wicked.

I remember the first time I played it actually, I think it was at an NTSC-UK meet? I thought it was a modern bomberman at the time, thought it was a PS2 game or something! I bought it from a bloke who was also at the meet just a few days later, got a couple of multitaps and 8 $2 controllers from Lik-Sang (I had two already). I still have the lot, it's an excellent party experience and looks brilliant with a full board of players running around on a large TV.

...

I sold a large chunk of my Saturn collection not too long back actually and have about ten games left now that I just can't part with, games I play regularly (e.g. Daytona USA, Sega Rally, Panzer Zwei). They are such utterly brilliant games, I don't think I could do without them. There's an itch I get that is only satisfied by a few select games. I'm certainly not a Saturn fanboy or even that big a fan of Sega classics but I know I certainly couldn't do without a Saturn.

And while I'm thinking about it, Daytona USA does look truly awful on the system but I actually prefer playing it here as it is true to the arcade title. The music is spot on, sound effects and even the right colours are perfect. It is far more than the sum of its parts

[masterhand]

For those in the cheap seats, as I mentioned earlier in the thread, the Japanese CE edition has an option to tighten or loosen the way the cars handle, but fundamentally it's the same game - ie, not Daytona USA but something a bit different. Both are good in their own way, but the original is the best for sure.

Trust me, I've been playing these 2 games virtually non-stop for the past month or so.

I'm finding Saturn Bomberman　difficult to find, I can only find Saturn Bomberman:Fight!

Saturn Daytona,

Daytona JPN, 1st version

Daytona US, Improvements on the original (Frame rate pop up) but not that much.

Daytona PAL, same as US but slower and had boarders

Daytona CCE PAL, 1st version rushed to market in time for Christmas.

Daytona CCE US, improvements on the PAL extra cheat modes some graphical improvements

Daytona CCE JPN, More improvements, has the original soundtrack as an option, cheats and better handling still not the arcade but makes the PAL version look like a fucking beta in comparision.

Bonus info:- The Jpn version of Touring cars controls much better as it was released later.

[Popo]

Isn't that what I said?

Also the Japanese version is just Curcuit Edition.

[Dandy_Sephy]

I just bought Donpachi on ebay for £12 delivered. I think that qualifies as a bargain. Especially as I bought and sold my pcb for £120 (which I miss, but I know the port is great)

[trickytree]

Donpachi's not the best on Saturn - long loads, grainy graphics and low-quality sounds. One of the few shmup ports where the PS1 version was better.

Dodonpachi's a much better port.

[Dandy_Sephy]

It's also a utter bastard to find on ps1. Nothing will be as good as the pcb, so I expect some flaws. Accuracy in the slowdown is the biggest challenge it has with me.

[trickytree]

True, quite a few PS1 shmups are hard to find.

SAT Donpachi's still a very playable version regardless of port issues. Can't remember if it has a 'Wait' option for the slowdown.

[Butane Bob]

Was it Donpachi or Dodonpachi on saturn that had the big chunky pixelly sprites when you played it non Tate?

[trickytree]

Dodonpachi. Apart from that and being one of the few games not to work with wireless controllers it's a very good port.

[Dandy_Sephy]

Was it Donpachi or Dodonpachi on saturn that had the big chunky pixelly sprites when you played it non Tate?

A Cave vert in Yoko? *shudder*

[Dandy_Sephy]

So I finally got my modded jp saturn from trickytree. A combination of me taking time to pay, and it being at dhl for a week.

Unpacked it, unplugged my pal model and yep, sent 220 volts into a 110v system

It's a Mk II saturn, my pal unit is a Mk1 so I can't swap the psu (4 pins vs 5, slightly different size). And one of the caps on the psu has leaked, so it definately won't be working again. The worst thing is that I have 3 stepdowns....

Anyone got a spare 4pin psu?

[PikaStu]

I connected up my Saturn to my new plasma last night. I've not played it for about a year since I gave my spare CRT to my mother-in-law, as it always looked terrible on my LCD telly. Anyway, I'm really surprised about just how good it looks. Sure, the pixels are bigger than the moon, but it all looks so sharp and vibrant through RGB. Spent a couple of hours with Sonic Jam and the original Panzer Dragoon... felt like I was 15 again!!!

I was also pleasantly surprised to find the demo disc of PD Saga tucked in the box too, so I'll give that a go one night.

Anyway, has anyone got a Japanese version of Saturn Bomberman? Is it perfectly playable for non-Japanese speakers? I assume it'll just be menus and whatever that's in Japanese...?

I used to have the PAL version but sold it last year. I miss it. The JPN version is much cheaper (and plentiful) on eBay. The wife was always a fan, I'm sure she'd love to play it again in the comfort of the living room...

I'll need to get another copy of Guardian Heroes too!