RLLMUK's Official Sales Figures 2011

[Paul3704]

I can't see anyone buying a 3DS just for the films, not even for kids. Why would anyone buy a version for the home, and a version for the kids to watch on the 3DS?

I don't want to watch a film without moving just to get the film to work properly - I want to sprawl on the settee and scratch my balls when I feel the need. I used to play my DS on the train, it used to bounce around a bit, but it didn't damage my experience of the game.

To me, the whole 3D argument is a gimmick, and to entirely base a hand-held console around it seems a bit short-sighted. I'm happy to be laughed at once it sells a billion units or so, but I can't see it happenning. Once the story of 3D imaging damaging your childs vision is reported on the news on a slow news day - it's scuppered.

[Boyatsea]

No, I don't think it is intentional. The opening few shots panning through the city and into Flynn's house - which, naturally, is in the real world - is in 3D actually. Everything I heard about it pre-release suggested 3D had been tagged on during production.

There were only a few shots during the last half hour that felt tailor made for 3D, to be honest.

[Boyatsea]

I can't see anyone buying a 3DS just for the films, not even for kids. Why would anyone buy a version for the home, and a version for the kids to watch on the 3DS?

I don't want to watch a film without moving just to get the film to work properly - I want to sprawl on the settee and scratch my balls when I feel the need. I used to play my DS on the train, it used to bounce around a bit, but it didn't damage my experience of the game.

To me, the whole 3D argument is a gimmick, and to entirely base a hand-held console around it seems a bit short-sighted. I'm happy to be laughed at once it sells a billion units or so, but I can't see it happenning. Once the story of 3D imaging damaging your childs vision is reported on the news on a slow news day - it's scuppered.

I wouldn't go quite as far as 'gimmick', but I certainly think it's a short-sighted move and, as I said previously, follows the old model of offering the same platform, albeit with beefed up visuals.

It's important to distinguish between the tech behind the 3D effect - which is obviously a step forward and impressive in its own right - and the idea that caused Nintendo to go down that path. In the case of the latter, I think it's a little uninspired and doesn't offer the kind of out of the box kinda thinking that resulted in Wii and DS.

[Varnsen]

I'll have to take your word for it.

The actual glasses tech behind it must be the same though - having to look dead on centre and keep your head straight - regardless of the quality of the 3D itself.

I wasn't wrong - I've seen on 3D film and I was summarising the experience. This wasn't actually an attempt to spark up a debate about 3D or 3DS, but rather Wahwah prompted me to recall how crude the whole thing was for me. I felt the same when I saw my first 3DTV stuff, to be honest - someone is going to come along and do this much better at some point. It's a bit of a false dawn, this, in terms of TV and cinema.

There are several different technologies for delivering '3D' in the cinemas. The system you get depends on what cinema and they have drawbacks and limitations. IMAX is pretty bad, you get image separation as you tilt your head and a strobing feeling if motion is fast. Odeon generally has RealD which is okay but image brightness is an issue depending on the screen. The best I've seen is Dolby 3D which you can see at Empire cinemas. Image brightness is an issue but less so and the 3d image delivery technique is more robust than the other two mentioned. The glasses are more expensive (around $50 or something) which is why they collect them afterwards. RealD uses cheap polarised glasses which many people keep.

There are also many different ways for creating '3D' in a film, there is a post-conversion system (which is becoming big business) and there are more and more stereoscopic camera rigs and setups coming around now. The layered effect you described is symptomatic of the post conversion process which is often done in a hurry in India (Clash of the Titans).

blah blah blah tl, dr; there's a hell of lot more to '3D' in the cinema than you think. Not saying it's mind blowing or amazing but it's not just one system to deliver it and not one way to make it.

[RubberJohnny]

Despite its increasing popularity, and Avatar being the most successful film of all time? Are there any films released these days that aren't in 3D, apart from rom-coms?

It's amazing that you managed to skip over the post on the very same page that countered both its increasing popularity and Avatar being the most successful film of all time.

I bet he's got me on ignore because I keep answering his questions and he doesn't like the answers :qq:

[Boyatsea]

There are several different technologies for delivering '3D' in the cinemas. The system you get depends on what cinema and they have drawbacks and limitations. IMAX is pretty bad, you get image separation as you tilt your head and a strobing feeling if motion is fast. Odeon generally has RealD which is okay but image brightness is an issue depending on the screen. The best I've seen is Dolby 3D which you can see at Empire cinemas. Image brightness is an issue but less so and the 3d image delivery technique is more robust than the other two mentioned. The glasses are more expensive (around $50 or something) which is why they collect them afterwards. RealD uses cheap polarised glasses which many people keep.

There are also many different ways for creating '3D' in a film, there is a post-conversion system (which is becoming big business) and there are more and more stereoscopic camera rigs and setups coming around now. The layered effect you described is symptomatic of the post conversion process which is often done in a hurry in India (Clash of the Titans).

blah blah blah tl, dr; there's a hell of lot more to '3D' in the cinema than you think. Not saying it's mind blowing or amazing but it's not just one system to deliver it and not one way to make it.

That's interesting. It was an Odeon I was in last night, but I'll have a look around to see what else is available and give it another crack.

[mushashi]

Genuinely interesting view, if only because it highlights the different reasons the various folk put down to people buying gaming hardware, I guess.

I don't think there's any doubt that the 3D tech will inspire a hell of a lot of sales, but if you're talking 180 million - 200 million - a total number no other console has come anywhere near touching as of yet - then that's going to require one hell of a drive for 3D handhelds.

Let's be fair, any console that sells over 80 million is pretty damn successful. To add another 100 million on top of that - well, that would be something.

I agree, Yes it would, the only possible scenario I personally could see it coming true in is if Nintendo manage to take off in China or other untapped parts of the world with a lot of potential customers, it's worked for Apple, no wonder they are now in a position to rival Microsoft for making money

Chinese revenue was $2.6 billion in the last quarter, 4x the previous quarter. Their 4 stores in china are their biggest in terms of number of people who enter and revenue. Total revenue for previous year was $3 billion

[Boyatsea]

Is 3DS planned for launch in China?

If that's true, you might be right. Though I suspect sales in the territories where DS is already available will still be down by generation's end.

[mushashi]

Is 3DS planned for launch in China?

If that's true, you might be right. Though I suspect sales in the territories where DS is already available will still be down by generation's end.

Outside of the 3 major markets, 3DS is TBA.

Personally, my gut feeling is 3DS is going to do a GBA/SFC in comparison to its world conquering predecessor, the competition is heating up, and I don't really feel that market expansion will counteract that enough to prevent some downturn in the numbers, unless console gaming takes off bigtime in the BRIC countries (the only parts of the world with enough potential people and economic growth to cause a massive uptake in console gaming anytime soon).

Unless somebody is developing a real new killer app(s) to drive it which pretty much all past world conquering Nintendo consoles have required to deliver really big numbers, I don't see my gut feeling changing.

[Boyatsea]

Well, indeed.

Aside from any theories we've come up with in this thread, DS has gotten so big that, anything but a drop in sales - however slight - in comparison would take some doing. Suggesting that it'll be just as easy for 3DS essentially devalues with DS has achieved.

[Stolly]

the Guardian's write up on the 3DS launch today

I particularly like these quotes:

Graphically, it's at least on a par with the Wii. So all those franchises that, even on the DSi, had to make do with 2D graphics made to look three-dimensional, or top-down perspectives, now operate in their full glory. Super Street Fighter IV, Pro Evolution Soccer, The Legend of Zelda: The Ocarina of Time, Driver, Super Monkey Ball and Resident Evil Mercenaries were all impressive to behold for a handheld, even if you turned off the stereoscopic 3D

Super Monkey Ball really made sense on the 3DS, with the added perspective enabling you to manipulate your ball with extra precision (plus, it made use of the 3DS's orientation-sensing gyroscope). The stereoscopic 3D also added new atmosphere to familiar scenes running through a 3D forest in Ocarina of Time, for example, felt twice as immersive as the original

The 3DS may look like any other handheld console, but it has an unbelievable technological depth to it which throws up an almost bewildering welter of possibilities. Some, undoubtedly, will prove more seductive than others, but if you thought the original DS, with its touchscreen, was revolutionary, prepare to be absolutely blown away on 25 March. We certainly can't wait to get our hands on one

Sounds better than I thought

[Boyatsea]

The Guardian, there, which wrote off iPad as a fad after road-testing one.

[Stolly]

The Guardian, there, which wrote off iPad as a fad after road-testing one.

Sounds almost like you want the 3DS to fail there.....

[Transient Curse]

Sounds almost like you want the 3DS to fail there.....

I'm gonna come clean and say that I hope the iPad fails. I know it's late in the day but I hope all the same.

Sounds almost like you want the 3DS to fail there.....

I'm gonna come clean and say that I hope the iPad fails. I know it's late in the day but I hope all the same.

[HarMGM]

Is 3DS planned for launch in China?

If that's true, you might be right. Though I suspect sales in the territories where DS is already available will still be down by generation's end.

Outside of the 3 major markets, 3DS is TBA.

Personally, my gut feeling is 3DS is going to do a GBA/SFC in comparison to its world conquering predecessor, the competition is heating up, and I don't really feel that market expansion will counteract that enough to prevent some downturn in the numbers, unless console gaming takes off bigtime in the BRIC countries (the only parts of the world with enough potential people and economic growth to cause a massive uptake in console gaming anytime soon).

Unless somebody is developing a real new killer app(s) to drive it which pretty much all past world conquering Nintendo consoles have required to deliver really big numbers, I don't see my gut feeling changing.

From what I know, Nintendo has not yet showed a lot of interest in China. Probably because most of the competition is already focused in that particular country. However, Iwata recently remarked that the developing countries in Africa are becoming more and more of interest to Nintendo.

Oh, and i'd like to say that I agree with Mushashi in that the 3DS is never going to do DS numbers, simply because the DS had a record amount of BIG sellers on a steady basis which will be hard for any system to replicate in the coming generations. Not to mention an economy that is still in the shitter.

[Boyatsea]

Sounds almost like you want the 3DS to fail there.....

I'm not bothered either way. From a business perspective, I think it's a shortsighted move and I worry both Nintendo and Sony aren't aware of what's happening, but no I don't want 3DS to fail. I won't be getting one, mind.

[Sng]

Aren't aware of what's happening, what's happening?

[Boyatsea]

PS3 sales are going through the roof!

Quick go to the window and look!

[Sng]

No really, do you think 3D is a fad?

Are you one of the ones a few months ago saying HD was pointless and no one would buy HD TVs?

LOL.

[Boyatsea]

No really, do you think 3D is a fad?

Are you one of the ones a few months ago saying HD was pointless and no one would buy HD TVs?

LOL.

When I said 'what is happening', I was talking about the rise of the app and its impact on handhelds, not 3D.

I don't think either Nintendo or Sony is equipped to deal with it over the next few years.

[Halo]

No really, do you think 3D is a fad?

Are you one of the ones a few months ago saying HD was pointless and no one would buy HD TVs?

LOL.

What proportion of people bought a HDTV for HD rather than as a big, cheap and thin CRT replacement? My suspicion is most HDTVs aren't even connected to an HD signal.

[Transient Curse]

What proportion of people bought a HDTV for HD rather than as a big, cheap and thin CRT replacement? My suspicion is most HDTVs aren't even connected to an HD signal.

Yeah, people still talk about "Flatscreen" TVs quite a bit. I think the chasis was definitely a big selling point.

[futureshock]

When I said 'what is happening', I was talking about the rise of the app and its impact on handhelds, not 3D.

I don't think either Nintendo or Sony is equipped to deal with it over the next few years.

I hope they continue to not care. Games on phones are not very good, and at best, time killers.

[Transient Curse]

I hope they continue to not care. Games on phones are not very good, and at best, time killers.

There's definitely a change in the air. Games on phones are going to be more sophisticated, and probably are more sophisticated than what you're thinking of. Certainly this isn't what I think of when I think "phone game":

I hope that games on phones become amazing.

[futureshock]

I realise they can throw about polygons with ease, but there's no getting round the incredibly bad controls. Playing for lengthy periods of time will be the hobby of a few mentalists, not the mass market.

[Boyatsea]

You couldn't be more wrong Futureshock.

That's an incredibly snobby and, more importantly, archaic way of thinking, and I genuinely hope Sony and Nintendo don't share it.

There are some absolutely brilliant mobile games out there that make controls their selling point, rather than a compromise.

Each to their own, though.

[Transient Curse]

I realise they can throw about polygons with ease, but there's no getting round the incredibly bad controls. Playing for lengthy periods of time will be the hobby of a few mentalists, not the mass market.

I must admit I am inclined to side with you at the moment, touchscreens is no substitute for D-Pad and Buttons. With any luck there'll be some really good games that arrive that suit the available input.

[RubberJohnny]

I realise they can throw about polygons with ease, but there's no getting round the incredibly bad controls. Playing for lengthy periods of time will be the hobby of a few mentalists, not the mass market.

Playing for lengthy periods of time is the preserve of the hardcore, so it's pretty bizarre to criticise a casual gaming device for being a casual gaming device.

[futureshock]

I'm sure there will be (are?) great games that work with the very limited controls, but given a choice of game system to actually sit down and spend a few hours with, the vast majority of people would put the phone at the bottom of the list.

It's not archaic, it's common sense. People want to have fun, and hours of smooshing thumbs over the very screen you're playing, isn't. Phones are the de facto time killer, not the go-to choice of the gamer.

Playing for lengthy periods of time is the preserve of the hardcore,

No it isn't.

[footle]

I'm sure there will be (are?) great games that work with the very limited controls, but given a choice of game system to actually sit down and spend a few hours with, the vast majority of people would put the phone at the bottom of the list.

It's not archaic, it's common sense. People want to have fun, and hours of smooshing thumbs over the very screen you're playing, isn't. Phones are the de facto time killer, not the go-to choice of the gamer.

On the other hand, your phone is *always* there. Getting games onto it is now trivial. The games themselves cost peanuts.

These three factors are far more important than whether a dpad is required or not: and hell, the latest iPhone is graphically more powerful than any of the DS, PSP or 3DS given what's been released for each platform.