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Nintendos future


Silent Runner
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Can you put up some proof (can't get access to gaming sites at work)? The site I'm thinking about puts up the top 10 games sold for the month on each console. If you add up the totals for Xbox and GC they come to roughly the same (within the statistical error).

Here's last year's all format sales chart, from NPD:

Rank Platform Title Publisher Release Date ARP

1 PS2 Grand Theft Auto: Vice City Rockstar Games Oct. '02 $49

2 PS2 Grand Theft Auto 3 Rockstar Games Oct. '01 $50

3 PS2 Madden NFL 2003 Electronic Arts Aug. '02 $49

4 GBA Super Mario Advance 2 Nintendo of America Feb '02 $29

5 PS2 Gran Turismo 3: A-Spec Sony Computer Ent. July '01 $24

6 PS2 Medal Honor Frontline Electronic Arts May '02 $50

7 PS2 Spider-Man: The Movie Activision Apr. '02 $45

8 PS2 Kingdom Hearts Square EA Sept. '02 $49

9 XBX Halo Microsoft Nov. '01 $48

10 GCN Super Mario Sunshine Nintendo of America Aug. '02 $49

Obviously Halo came out more than half a year before Mario Sunshine, so the chart itself is a little misleading. Since then the X-box has had a shitload of US sports titles though, and as far as I can remember has always had a couple of titles in the top ten. The most recent chart I've got has Xbox titles at #2 and #3 (KOTOR and NCAA Football 2004), and no GC titles in the top ten.

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Nintendo suffered their first ever loss last quarter.

Amusingly, this loss was incurred because of their dealings on the international currency market, and was nothing to do with their console business. But it get trooped out evey time someone wants an argument about how the Gamecube's failing.

I agree with most people here - the GC's games are *different* in some ways to those available on the PS2 and Xbox. People should have one of the latter, and a Gamecube.

Tim

No, people should have one of each if they want to get the best games available.

All three have fantastic games which aren't available elsewhere.

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Can you put up some proof (can't get access to gaming sites at work)? The site I'm thinking about puts up the top 10 games sold for the month on each console. If you add up the totals for Xbox and GC they come to roughly the same (within the statistical error).

Here's last year's all format sales chart, from NPD:

Rank Platform Title Publisher Release Date ARP

1 PS2 Grand Theft Auto: Vice City Rockstar Games Oct. '02 $49

2 PS2 Grand Theft Auto 3 Rockstar Games Oct. '01 $50

3 PS2 Madden NFL 2003 Electronic Arts Aug. '02 $49

4 GBA Super Mario Advance 2 Nintendo of America Feb '02 $29

5 PS2 Gran Turismo 3: A-Spec Sony Computer Ent. July '01 $24

6 PS2 Medal Honor Frontline Electronic Arts May '02 $50

7 PS2 Spider-Man: The Movie Activision Apr. '02 $45

8 PS2 Kingdom Hearts Square EA Sept. '02 $49

9 XBX Halo Microsoft Nov. '01 $48

10 GCN Super Mario Sunshine Nintendo of America Aug. '02 $49

Obviously Halo came out more than half a year before Mario Sunshine, so the chart itself is a little misleading. Since then the X-box has had a shitload of US sports titles though, and as far as I can remember has always had a couple of titles in the top ten. The most recent chart I've got has Xbox titles at #2 and #3 (KOTOR and NCAA Football 2004), and no GC titles in the top ten.

But your chart supports my point, that GC and Xbox sell roughly equal amounts of software, not yours. The rest of your post is just fluff.

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Since then the X-box has had a shitload of US sports titles though, and as far as I can remember has always had a couple of titles in the top ten.The most recent chart I've got has Xbox titles at #2 and #3 (KOTOR and NCAA Football 2004), and no GC titles in the top ten.

But your chart supports my point, that GC and Xbox sell roughly equal amounts of software, not yours. The rest of your post is just fluff.

Absolutely not. I've highlighted the important bit.

X-box has had titles in the top ten every month this year, as far as I remember. GC has had two: Wind Waker and MKDD.

Obviously the important stat is the units sold, but I can assure you the GC is giving up retail space to the X-box. If the demand was equal, it wouldn't be doing so.

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There was a thread on here not that long ago, where somebody posted the top 10 US charts for each of the three main consoles. Adding up the total sales from the top 10 titles, the PS2 had sold the most, then the XBox, and then the GC. However, the gap in units between XBox and GC sales was tiny - almost nothing from what I remember.

Can anybody else remember/find that thread? I can remember that the GC top 10 had Viewtiful Joe (selling 100k+) and RS3 in it so it must have been fairly recent.

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For anyone that's interested (you know you all love sales figures really, :huh: ), here is the latest chart from the US. This is not as interesting for comparing GC and XBox as the PS2 drowns them out.

Top 20 Video Games in North America

(Updated: November 21, 2003)

Rank Game Title Publisher Platform USD Units

1 NBA Live 2004 Electronic Arts PS2 $19,311,610 387,363

2 Madden NFL 2004 Electronic Arts PS2 $10,151,370 204,064

3 Jak II Sony PS2 $9,525,686 239,217

4 WWE: Here Comes Pain THQ PS2 $7,575,488 152,073

5 Tony Hawk Underground Activision PS2 $7,166,578 144,842

6 Star Wars: Rogue Squadron III LucasArts GC $5,744,523 115,672

7 Tiger Woods PGA 2004 Electronic Arts PS2 $5,678,678 114,109

8 NBA Live 2004 Electronic Arts XB $5,259,460 105,539

9 Castlevania: Lament of Innocent Konami PS2 $4,733,432 95,177

10 SSX 3 Electronic Arts PS2 $4,559,972 91,815

11 Super Mario Advance 4 Nintendo GBA $4,543,382 158,748

12 Viewtiful Joe Capcom GC $4,060,866 102,231

13 Backyard Wrestling Eidos PS2 $3,948,827 79,233

14 Tom Clancy's Rainbow Six 3 Ubi Soft XB $3,911,208 78,633

15 Conflict: Desert Storm II Take Two PS2 $3,192,561 64,096

Hardware Sales in North America

(Updated: November 21, 2003)

Rank System Manufacturer Units Sold Total Sold

1 GameBoy Advance Nintendo 401,000 16,310,000

2 PlayStation 2 Sony 300,000 19,439,000

3 GameCube Nintendo 254,000 4,948,000

4 Xbox Microsoft 176,000 6,178,000

And the current Japanese just for good measure

Top 10 Japanese Console Games (Current)

From: Nov 24 - Nov 30, 2003

Rank

Game Title Publisher System

Genre

Units Sold Total Sold

1 Everybody's Golf 4 Sony PS2 SPT 500,200 500,200

2 SD Gundam G Generation Advance Bandai GBA S.RPG 136,300 136,300

3 Wild Arms Alter Code: F Sony PS2 RPG 104,700 104,700

4 Mario Party 5 Nintendo GC ETC 82,500 82,500

5 Kamen Rider: Seigi no Keifu Banpresto PS2 ACT 51,800 51,800

6 Castlevania: Lament of Innocent Konami PS2 ACT 49,500 49,500

7 Pokemon Colosseum Pokemon GC ETC 46,900 168,800

8 Mario Kart: Double Dash!! Nintendo GC RAC 42,400 363,600

9 R: Racing Evolution Namco PS2 RAC 40,100 40,100

10 Zero: Crimson Butterfly Tecmo PS2 A.AVG 38,700 38,700

Console Hardware Sales Chart

From: Nov 24 - Nov 30, 2003

System Sales this week Total Sales in 2003

PlayStation 2 87,200 2,423,400

GameBoy Advance SP 59,000 1,954,300

GameCube 34,800 685,900

GameBoy Advance 5,900 1,113,500

Xbox 4,000 90,400

PSone 540 61,800

WonderSwan Crystal 340 33,700

I'd love to see the European charts, and a breakdown into the separate regions, but sadly the companies involved seem to think this is competitive information.

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For anyone that's interested (you know you all love sales figures really, :huh: ), here is the latest chart from the US. This is not as interesting for comparing GC and XBox as the PS2 drowns them out.

What's the source for those?

No NFL titles on X-box? doesn't seem likely.

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Found the stuff I was looking for!

[source: Gamefront.de]

October NPD numbers.

PLAYSTATION 2

Pos. Title Publisher Dollars * Quantity *

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

1 NBA LIVE 2004 Electronic Arts $19,311,610 387,363

2 MADDEN NFL 2004 Electronic Arts $10,151,370 204,064

3 JAK II Sony $9,525,686 239,217

4 WWE: HERE COMES PAIN THQ $7,575,488 152,073

5 TONY HAWK UNDERGROUND Activision $7,166,578 144,842

6 TIGER WOODS PGA 2004 Electronic Arts $5,678,678 114,109

7 CASTLEVANIA: LAMENT Konami $4,733,432 95,177

8 SSX 3 Electronic Arts $4,559,972 91,815

9 BACKYARD WRESTLING Eidos $3,948,827 79,233

10 CONFLICT: DESERT II Take-Two $3,192,561 64,096

XBOX

Pos. Title Publisher Dollars * Quantity *

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

1 NBA LIVE 2004 Electronic Arts $5,259,460 105,539

2 T. CLANCY'S RAINBOW 3 Ubi Soft $3,911,208 78,633

3 CRIMSON SKIES: HIGH Microsoft $2,948,061 59,379

4 ESPN NBA BASKETBALL Sega $2,668,353 53,567

5 MADDEN NFL 2004 Electronic Arts $2,427,489 48,870

6 CONFLICT: DESERT II Take-Two $2,353,912 48,345

7 TONY HAWK UNDERGROUND Activision $2,311,633 46,711

8 TIGER WOODS PGA 2004 Electronic Arts $2,214,646 44,551

9 SSX 3 Electronic Arts $1,936,943 38,990

10 HALO Microsoft $1,813,485 36,547

GAMECUBE

Pos. Title Publisher Dollars * Quantity *

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

1 SW:ROGUE SQUADRON III LucasArts $5,744,523 115,672

2 VIEWTIFUL JOE Capcom $4,060,866 102,231

3 KIRBY AIR RIDE Nintendo $3,063,197 61,583

4 SOUL CALIBUR II Namco $2,659,374 54,369

5 TEENAGE MUTANT TURTLE Konami $1,758,922 43,050

6 SUPER SMASH BRO MELEE Nintendo $1,532,765 51,201

7 BILLY HATCHER Sega $1,429,339 37,215

8 SIMPSONS: HIT & RUN Vivendi $1,419,004 28,999

9 MARIO GOLF: TOADSTOOL Nintendo $1,326,796 26,699

10 NBA LIVE 2004 Electronic Arts $1,321,751 26,511

So then NumberSix, how does that prove that the GC is "dead on its arse" in terms of software sales when compared to XBox in the US? Looks pretty damn even to me. And this was before the hardware sales boost it's currently enjoying.

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So then NumberSix, how does that prove that the GC is "dead on its arse" in terms of software sales when compared to XBox in the US? Looks pretty damn even to me. And this was before the hardware sales boost it's currently enjoying.

Though I'm not defending NumberSix's view, I don't really think you can use the top 10 on each format to prove anything. Also, looking at the figures for the Cube, the indictation is that though the start higher they do seem to peter off sooner than for the X-Box. This would suggest to me that whilst the figures may be close over the top 10, over the top 20 or 50, the XBox may have a more substansial lead.

Personally though, I think as long as Nintendo are not losing money on the hardware or software then what's the problem? I think they will survive quite happily.

Someone ealier likened them to Apple, this is something I started a thread about before as I think there are several similarities between the two companies, the main one, in my opinion, being that they could survive perfectly well with a small market share and dedicated fans.

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Yes, those were the numbers I was looking for. Adding them up gives

PS2 - 1,571,989

Xbox - 561,132

GC - 547,530

I'm not sure of the statistical derivation of the NPD data, but I'd say a 2% difference is well within the statistical error range.

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Though I'm not defending NumberSix's view, I don't really think you can use the top 10 on each format to prove anything.

It's limited yes, but I think it pretty clearly indicates that the GC is not "dead on its arse" as NumberSix was insisting.

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Though I'm not defending NumberSix's view, I don't really think you can use the top 10 on each format to prove anything. Also, looking at the figures for the Cube, the indictation is that though the start higher they do seem to peter off sooner than for the X-Box. This would suggest to me that whilst the figures may be close over the top 10, over the top 20 or 50, the XBox may have a more substansial lead.

That's conjecture though. It's not possible to "prove" anything with sales figures as they are a guesstimate themselves. They do give the highly likely conclusion that the GC is not "dead on its arse" though, which was all that really needed to be shown.

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Though I'm not defending NumberSix's view, I don't really think you can use the top 10 on each format to prove anything.

It's limited yes, but I think it pretty clearly indicates that the GC is not "dead on its arse" as NumberSix was insisting.

Oh yeah, it's clearly not dead on it's arse. I think you'd have to be mad to think otherwise.

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So then NumberSix, how does that prove that the GC is "dead on its arse" in terms of software sales when compared to XBox in the US? Looks pretty damn even to me. And this was before the hardware sales boost it's currently enjoying.

What it proves is that the X-box sold more software than the gamecube in the month of october. Maybe somebody could total up the year to date totals. It also shows that there's a bigger drop after # 1 & 2 on the GC than there is for the X-box.

Anyhow I'm really not interested in getting into a stupid fanboy argument about this, but the fact is that X-box has taken priority over the GC for US retailers. This is sad, because I think the cube is a cracking machine, but it's the truth.

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but the fact is that X-box has taken priority over the GC for US retailers. This is sad, because I think the cube is a cracking machine, but it's the truth.

But how is that fact? The very latest figures we have access to show that the GC is outselling the Xbox by a considerable margin right now in the US (christ it even outsold the PS2 for once). How exactly does that prove that the XBox has taken priority over the GC at US retailers?

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So then NumberSix, how does that prove that the GC is "dead on its arse" in terms of software sales when compared to XBox in the US? Looks pretty damn even to me. And this was before the hardware sales boost it's currently enjoying.

What it proves is that the X-box sold more software than the gamecube in the month of october. Maybe somebody could total up the year to date totals. It also shows that there's a bigger drop after # 1 & 2 on the GC than there is for the X-box.

Anyhow I'm really not interested in getting into a stupid fanboy argument about this, but the fact is that X-box has taken priority over the GC for US retailers. This is sad, because I think the cube is a cracking machine, but it's the truth.

Bollocks, you just want to flame the cube (even though you state otherwise).

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But how is that fact? The very latest figures we have access to show that the GC is outselling the Xbox by a considerable margin right now in the US (christ it even outsold the PS2 for once).

The post price drop figures. See my earlier comments about a spike. Like I said before, take a look again in three months.

How exactly does that prove that the XBox has taken priority over the GC at US retailers?

Er, I never said it did prove that, did I?

Phone a US games shop at random, and ask them how they're set up.

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Does anyone really care?

If Nintendo (or SCEE, or XBox) get ousted out of the market and become a software only developer, would it stop you playing videogames?

The GameCube will suffer exactly the same fate as the PS2 and XBox. It will be replaced. Enjoy it while it is here.

As for Nintendo's "fate". Nobody knows. Stop wasting valuable gaming time trying figure it out.

I am here for the games. I do not care who makes them, and I do not care what platform they are on, I just care that they are fun.

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Bollocks, you just want to flame the cube (even though you state otherwise).

Yes, you're right. Nintendo is for kidz, and is shit.

Which is why I've got more fucking games for the GC than for any other system.

:huh:

I'm only making a point. You don't have to get all territorial about it.

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Phone a US games shop at random, and ask them how they're set up.

Any games shop anywhere (or any shop come to that) will prefer to sell the highest costing machine. It er... costs more you see and the shop gets more money. The cube will lose out in the situation where a customer asks for independent advice especially if the retailer gauges that the customer will buy either way.

The cube at its current price point therefore appeals to existing owners of one or both of the other consoles, people who definitely know what they want and those looking for the cheapest machine.

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http://www.guardian.co.uk/online/story/0,3...1103876,00.html

Hardware-wise, 2003 was an unprecedented year, as three major consoles hit stages of maturity. The big loser was Nintendo which - despite lowering the price of its GameCube to a trifling £79.99 - could not overtake Microsoft's Xbox in total sales. Sony's PlayStation 2, however, towers above its rivals. Microsoft has sold around 10m Xboxes worldwide, against Sony's staggering 62m PlayStation 2s - including 5m in the UK alone.

Nintendo has shipped (rather than sold) 5.6m GameCubes - a figure that must be taken with a pinch of salt, as it stopped manufacturing the GameCube for a period, due to huge inventory build-ups.

I am not saying anything. Well apart from "I am not saying anything".

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(christ it even outsold the PS2 for once)

For 1 week out of 52, unfortunately. And as the worldwide figures show [pinch of salt or no] there's less NGC's out there now than anticipated. 5.6Million is still good, in fact back in the Pre-Playstation days that would be ultra respectable but now it is greeted with a muted shrug of shoulders.

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(christ it even outsold the PS2 for once)

For 1 week out of 52, unfortunately. And as the worldwide figures show [pinch of salt or no] there's less NGC's out there now than anticipated. 5.6Million is still good, in fact back in the Pre-Playstation days that would be ultra respectable but now it is greeted with a muted shrug of shoulders.

I know it was just one week - that's why I wrote "for once".

And that 5.6m figure is rubbish - the total is over 10m right now.

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5.6Million GC shipped, let alone sold? Bollocks.

I hate to come across all Nintendo fanboy-esque, but that has got to be utter toss. As of June this year, I was under the impression the GC had sold 9.something million, and was in second place globally, with the Xbox only a couple of hundred thousand behind it. I'd imagine the Xbox is ahead by half a million/ a million maybe by now. But to be ahead, by 5 million, and for 5 million GCs to suddenly vanish into thin air?

I just flat out refuse to believe that figure.

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