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Halo 4 - It's the one before Halo 5


T Pot
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Haha, imagine not putting CE at the top.

People bemoan the reduction to spectacle that is currently afflicting most mass-market games, but then openly trumpet the trinkets of presentation.

Opinions, eh?

Presentation aside, for me CE's gunplay feel far floatier than everything that came after.

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Halo2 has the worst story ever and the most disappointing single player campaign too but I spent 18months playing it online every single fucking day so for me that puts it right up there at the top of the list.

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Halo2 has the worst story ever and the most disappointing single player campaign too but I spent 18months playing it online every single fucking day so for me that puts it right up there at the top of the list.

I think people are ranking campaigns, rather than complete packages.

Although I do agree, in the multiplayer stakes Halo 2 would be top of my list by a huge distance.

Halo 2's story is actually much better told than Halo 3's. And to be fair, is there a single sci fi story you actually like?

One thing I will say for Halo 2: More weapon types on the battlefield meant more ways to actually play. In CE, for instance, you were limited to the number of sniper shots you had in a sniper rifle before you were back to an AR and magnum/carbine. In Halo 2 you could fall back on the BR/AR, or pick up an enemy beam rifle to carry on picking off enemies from distance.

All of that said, however, Halo 2 also had more linear, narrower levels and inferior enemy AI.

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Well, it hadn't become apparent to me early on because sometimes you can't go back and also because the guns are all so much of muchness I would usually just grab whatever and it would make little difference. There weren't that many times were I was hunting around for a particular weapon out of sheer necessity rather than choice.

But at a few points I doubled back to choose another weapon or (more often) to get more ammo. And, yes, guns had vanished.

Still, NICE GRAPHICS.

The funny thing here is that I get called a Halo fanboy. I criticise aspects of this, and suddenly i'm a heretic, a petty loser, I know nothing about Halo, I want everything to be the same.

Even with posts where I am praising various aspects I am getting negged.

I've yet to play it on Legendary though, and that's a significant test of the combat mechanics.

Yours is one of the opinions I was looking forward to the most because you love Halo and I knew you wouldn't let things go or sugar coat it. i think the problem though is that you are so reactionary in general that people find it hard to take your opinions seriously. i don't mean that as a dig, but you often criticise games you haven't yet played based on others' opinions so when I read your comments earlier i certainly had a 'i'll see for myself' kind of attitude towards em.

Not really sure why I haven't started the campaign yet to be honest. But this gun thing has bummed me quite hard

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I think 2 gets far more stick then it deserves - the Brute AI is completely broken and the Elites glitch sometimes but it's still a fun game to play - I always like the way the Elites laid down supressing fire in 2.

And the Hunters in 2 after 1... The first time one of them sweeps a bunch of crates out of the way to get to you was breath taking.

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Smitty - you appear to be somewhat swimming against the current.

Time to move on to a new title, if its really not floating your boat? :blah:

Doubt you're going to convince folks that your perspective is the right one.

Myself? It's beautiful. I've played em all too. And the PC ones. A lot. It's a leap in tech, artwork, sound ('cept that warthog). I've found some glitching with cloud saves, and restarted by accident a level I was an hour in. But mostly, I loves it. It does try and further the universe and story, which I'm all for. I didn't always know what the hell was going on - despite reading the novels precursing it, but it's a real showboat of a title.

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What? :blink:

it's tricky. I replayed the whole Reach campaign on Legendary last week in a single day and I really did find that the abilities made for excellent and varied gameplay. Not just another bolt on but opening the whole thing up to stunning levels of depth and complexity.

CE has the purity of its sandbox and weaponry, and its open battlegrounds as its forte, but Reach has so many more toys to play with and some refined enemy AI. I found it stunning to play through.

Another thing that surprised me was that when I went and played Halo 3 'The Ark' level I found the flood loads of fun to fight against. Getting stuck in with a shotgun and blowing arms and legs off made a nice change from the mid to long battles i'd been having for the previous 8 hours.

I guess that yeah CE is of course the better game overall, but I reckon when I go back to Anniversary next time i'll miss the bubble shields, vehicle jacking, jet pack fun of Reach and 3.

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Right, I admit it: I am BEYOND SHIT at Halo MP. Any tips? :blush:

DON'T get stuck in. Always be stood around a nice vertical piece of cover and try to have at least 2 other yellow blips on your radar. If you get caught off on your own and your DMR skills aren't sharp, then you are a dead man.

What I try to do is hang back, keeping a yellow dot on either side of me on the radar, then when I see one of them in a gun fight try to get a flank on the opponent. Then when that battle is done immediately try to get back into a formation where i'm not the first one to be shot at.

Halo2 has the worst story ever and the most disappointing single player campaign too but I spent 18months playing it online every single fucking day so for me that puts it right up there at the top of the list.

Thing is though, I spent 18 months playing it too, mostly with you. But the experience was fucking shit. It was nothing like the fun we had with Halo and most nights were spent frustratedly swearing at the screen about LAAAAG. it was only cos there was fuck all else to play that we persevered.

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One thing I will say for Halo 2: More weapon types on the battlefield meant more ways to actually play. In CE, for instance, you were limited to the number of sniper shots you had in a sniper rifle before you were back to an AR and magnum/carbine. In Halo 2 you could fall back on the BR/AR, or pick up an enemy beam rifle to carry on picking off enemies from distance.

That's funny because I see that as one of the biggest missteps in the series' history.

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it's tricky. I replayed the whole Reach campaign on Legendary last week in a single day and I really did find that the abilities made for excellent and varied gameplay. Not just another bolt on but opening the whole thing up to stunning levels of depth and complexity.

CE has the purity of its sandbox and weaponry, and its open battlegrounds as its forte, but Reach has so many more toys to play with and some refined enemy AI. I found it stunning to play through.

Another thing that surprised me was that when I went and played Halo 3 'The Ark' level I found the flood loads of fun to fight against. Getting stuck in with a shotgun and blowing arms and legs off made a nice change from the mid to long battles i'd been having for the previous 8 hours.

I guess that yeah CE is of course the better game overall, but I reckon when I go back to Anniversary next time i'll miss the bubble shields, vehicle jacking, jet pack fun of Reach and 3.

Fair enough explanation, but you specifically said the gunplay and you haven't mentioned that once here. There's no way on earth the gunplay is better in Reach than the 'a perfect gun combination for every situation' that the original pioneered. And that's not taking into account grenades and melee either.

The balance of CE is so finely tuned that no matter what they did to introduce new elements it always unbalanced the stripped back purity of the original.

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Thing is though, I spent 18 months playing it too, mostly with you. But the experience was fucking shit. It was nothing like the fun we had with Halo and most nights were spent frustratedly swearing at the screen about LAAAAG. it was only cos there was fuck all else to play that we persevered.

I'm not sure I agree with that though, maybe it was different because while I did a lot of HaloCE local lan stuff and had some epic games on massive projectors at peoples houses or even offices these were rare weekends, it just wasn't something I could do every day, I know you basically turned your house into a halo den for the whole time but that wasn't how it was for me so I don't have the same memories.

I remember Halo2 and the latest Pro Evo coming at the same time and pro evo not even being put into the machine, my housemates who used to play timesplitters and unreal got turned on to Halo2 pretty quickly after dismissing the first game and we pretty much drove someone out of our house because he he couldn't interact with anyone, there were always 2-6 people in front of the tv playing Halo, we had one shitty CRT and an awful cable connection but we persevered through the lag and it was awesome.

For me, Halo4 reminds me of Halo2, the campaign I've gone through and whatever, it wasn't briliant for me, not the experience I was looking for but the multiplayer is brilliant, it's different, but it's different in a way that's sucked me in again and I can see myself losing days and nights to the game, If I had the free time and lack of responsibility that I used to have when Halo2 came out, I'd be putting it all into this.

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Fair enough explanation, but you specifically said the gunplay and you haven't mentioned that once here. There's no way on earth the gunplay is better in Reach than the 'a perfect gun combination for every situation' that the original pioneered. And that's not taking into account grenades and melee either.

The balance of CE is so finely tuned that no matter what they did to introduce new elements it always unbalanced the stripped back purity of the original.

That's the problem, isn't it? For anyone who's so enamoured of the (campaign) combat in CE that they describe it as 'perfection', any development is inevitably going to lead to its being tarnished: there will always be a downside, in terms of weapons, balance, feel, new enemies, adapted behaviour. On the other hand, sticking as closely to the original as possible - trying to recreate it but with new graphics - well, they've done that with Anniversary. So it's either move on - and change, and make things different from that 'perfection' - or make nothing new in the series at all.

I'm about 3/4 of the way through this campaign on Heroic, and for me it's striking a pretty decent balance: there's the new and the adapted (which there has to be to stop this being to 'been there, seen that', and there's also enough homage to CE to make it feel integrated. I actually agree with some of what Smitty says about the combat and enemies, but I don't feel nearly as bad about it. In fact I don't feel bad about it at all. I already know it won't replace CE as my favourite by far, but it's the best follow up so far. And that puts it second in the rankings, easily. Sure, I would (if I could) have done some things differently, but it's definitely got most of the CE feel to it, and in terms of atmosphere and exploration they've taken things back to that sense of alienness of CE, and that's wonderful. There are certain things I don't like but they're not game killers.

I think it's a great success, at least 3/4 of the way in on Heroic anyhow.

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That's funny because I see that as one of the biggest missteps in the series' history.

It's getting to the point where you're just some angry buzzing noise... It's not like any of it is meant as personal affront from Bungie or 343 or even Sabre against *YOU*

Just so I'm clear, I'm loving the 'gameplay' also. Clearly everything - even the rubbishy forerunner grenades - have been turned over and considered far longer and by far more people than you or I. So I'm prepared to run with it. You on the other hand, just sound like an angry teenager.... Who want's to be known as that eh ?

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