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Official Star Wars Thread - May the force be with you


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1 hour ago, Hexx said:

It's very telling that none of the Disney(+) announcements are from the sequel trilogy era - and few seem to care.

There's just so little at the moment that sets it apart, making it just a flimsy rehash of the original trilogy era. I think there's just more mileage in the 30 year gap after the OT, especially now that The Mandalorian has provided a springboard. We know less about the "main plot" stuff in that time, and there's a New Republic to provide some stability to the setting while the Imperial Remnant is still providing a threat.

 

I think Disney are quietly trying to make Star Wars their own with the whole High Republic thing, especially now that they've got a TV series in production set during that era. If it's successful it would provide a clean slate for new stories without any need to tiptoe around any existing canon.

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2 hours ago, Hexx said:

Getting rid of 3 terrible made films (before you even get into their heritage/links...I'm still amazed that something as fundamentally awful as TLJ got released), which even the defenders don't have an overwhelming degree of love for, would be done in a second if Disney thought they could make more money that way.

 

I don't think they're as disliked as you think, The Force Awakens is/was pretty popular and The Last Jedi is, at best, polarising - yes some people intensely hate it but I (and many others) would argue it's one of the best of the lot. It's only Rise of Skywalker that's pretty much universally accepted as a stinker.

 

I genuinely can't see them ever decanonising the sequel trilogy simply because it's got Harrison Ford, Mark Hamill and (especially) Carrie Fisher in it. If they weren't in it, sure, you could see it being quietly forgotten about, but with such strong links to the original trilogy, it's never going to happen. And with the Mandalorian already hinting at links to the sequel trilogy, I'd say it's definitely here to stay.

 

Doesn't mean they have to do anything *more* in that era, though. Going backwards with the High Republic or even the Old Republic would be an easy way to give fans more of what they want.

 

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After TLJ apparently ruined everyone's childhoods I think they should just say none of Star Wars is Star Wars then just make a movie where Luke Skywalker spins a lightsaber loads and fucks for aaaages.

 

That's my Star Wars. 

 

That's my Luke Skywalker.  

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I think Disney are going to steer well clear of the sequel trilogy for a while. 
 

A really good (and inevitable) Jedi Academy TV show that explains the rise of Snoke, The First Order and why Luke and Ben got so fucked up, would properly heal quite a lot of the wounds. 
 

Then they just need to delete Episode 9 from history. As much as I hate TLJ, it had a more complete ending than the film that came afterwards. 

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57 minutes ago, BitterToad said:

After TLJ apparently ruined everyone's childhoods I think they should just say none of Star Wars is Star Wars then just make a movie where Luke Skywalker spins a lightsaber loads and fucks for aaaages.

 

That's my Star Wars. 

 

That's my Luke Skywalker.  

 

I'd go further: not even Luke Skywalker is really Star Wars. IMO they should bin everything, and go all the way back to the start so they can do Journal of the Whills right this time.

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Ewan McGregor is apparently really pissed off with the way his character got treated in the sequels, getting punked by Vader and killed off in Episode IV, then emotionally manipulating the kid he's supposed to be looking out for in Eps V and VI. Maybe they'll retcon all that in the upcoming TV series.

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I think that was my issue with the Sequel films, no real context or explanation as to what had happened in that 30 year gap after Jedi. We just jump to Empire mark 2 versus rebel alliance mark 2.

 

So what do we currently know happened in that time between the trilogies (spoilered just in case):

 

Spoiler

New Republic was formed immediately after the Empire was defeated at Endor.

 

Palpatines Force spirit (?) materialises on the Sith Planet Exegol.

 

Empire begins enacting Operation Cinder, destroying "weaker" elements of itself in preparation for rebirth.

 

NR continue fighting Imperial remnant culminating in a massive battle over Jakku which NR wins. Empire formally signs peace treaty with NR.

 

 One Imperial ship escapes Jakku and heads to Exegol (as part of Op Cinder) with children onboard ready to rebuild empire/first order.

 

Luke Skywalker travels galaxy in search of Jedi artifacts and establishes a new Jedi temple and begins training students.

 

For a time Leia becomes head of NR, has son Ben with Han. 

 

Imperial remnant  under Moff Gideon searches for the Child to extract Midichlorians and create/clone suitable host body for Palpatine to control (Snoke).

 

Palpatines son has a daughter (Rey) and leaves her on Jakku to hide her away from Palpatine.

 

Ben Solo is coerced to the Dark Side by Palpatine, destroys Luke's Jedi Order, forms Knights of Ren, becomes Kylo Ren and joins First Order as apprentice to Snoke.

 

Luke abandons the force and goes into hiding.

 

First Order comes out from the shadows.

 

Leia forms Resistance to monitor First Order.

 

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There is actually some really great world building in the expanded universe but it’s rarely made reference to in the films themselves to help fill in the obvious gaps...rather it’s a rush to the next set piece.

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18 hours ago, Dirty Harry Potter said:

I think Disney are going to steer well clear of the sequel trilogy for a while. 
 

A really good (and inevitable) Jedi Academy TV show that explains the rise of Snoke, The First Order and why Luke and Ben got so fucked up, would properly heal quite a lot of the wounds. 
 

Then they just need to delete Episode 9 from history. As much as I hate TLJ, it had a more complete ending than the film that came afterwards. 


I think they’ll do the same thing with the prequels.

 

Ignore them, then have a few cartoons to make all the characters apex mixed in with new great characters.

 

If they can rehabilitate the prequels, they can do the same with the sequels 

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On 07/01/2021 at 22:44, sid said:

They can keep ‘fixing’ stuff over time though.....

 

eg the ‘holdo manoeuvre’ is now (according to last film) a million to one shot that would never happen again....odds are so low that you’d never try it. Suggesting also that she was clearly daft to have considered it.


it may always be canon but they can change the meaning or impact of stuff easily.

 

 

Yes, clearly daft! Silly woman, that's why they should never be in command. And what about her stupid hair?

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7 hours ago, Matt Defis said:

Leia was never in charge of the NR, she almost was but then the galaxy found out who he real father was. 

Ah, that was the old Expanded Universe leaking out from my brain!

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We did this chat 15-20 yrs ago about Star Wars films that weren't Star wars films and they should be ignored... decanonise them was the cry! Some things never change :D

 

Just enjoy the films from the series that you enjoy and ignore the others - that is how I "lived" with the prequel trilogy. And now with all the expansion of shows and films and spinoffs Star Wars fans just have to do as much sifting and ignoring as Star Trek fans do :D  For me I enjoyed the original trilogy and to a lesser extent the sequel trilogy - I have just started watching the Mandalorian (4 episodes in) and it better pick up the pace as it is very "plodding" and safe. But it is better than the prequel trilogy which I don't enjoy so I ignore.

 

Calling for striking films from canon and reshooting and reimagining is a bit extreme. Star Trek managed to reset its continuity and film series completely with an alternate history and didn't have to decanonise much to do it. There hasn't been time travel in Star Wars? meh just write it in if you want. One day there will be a different actor playing Luke and we'll have a reimagined Star Wars even if it takes 50 years to happen. Because in the end, for the top level producers, it is not about artistic endeavour it is about money and wringing money out of what was, one decent idea for a single space adventure film in 1977.

 

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58 minutes ago, Swallow said:

 

Yes, clearly daft! Silly woman, that's why they should never be in command. And what about her stupid hair?

 

while you are clearly having a dig, sigh, my point is that it demonstrates how sensitive you need to be with this stuff.

 

saying it’s a million to one shot explains away why that’s not a viable military tactic while , lazy writing......while at the same time it therefore insinuates that she was clearly incompetent for relying on that tactic. This shits all over that film, therefore shits all over the wider canon etc, and that’s not great to watch as a fan.

 

rewriting this stuff is like a pack of cards......it’s fine in small amounts but it needs someone with overall control of the franchise validating stuff like this and pushing back on major things like this. 

 

 

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22 hours ago, Garwoofoo said:

 

I don't think they're as disliked as you think, The Force Awakens is/was pretty popular and The Last Jedi is, at best, polarising - yes some people intensely hate it but I (and many others) would argue it's one of the best of the lot. It's only Rise of Skywalker that's pretty much universally accepted as a stinker.

 

I genuinely can't see them ever decanonising the sequel trilogy simply because it's got Harrison Ford, Mark Hamill and (especially) Carrie Fisher in it. If they weren't in it, sure, you could see it being quietly forgotten about, but with such strong links to the original trilogy, it's never going to happen. And with the Mandalorian already hinting at links to the sequel trilogy, I'd say it's definitely here to stay.

 

Doesn't mean they have to do anything *more* in that era, though. Going backwards with the High Republic or even the Old Republic would be an easy way to give fans more of what they want.

 


The Rise of Skywalker was pretty well received outside of the usual circles that repeat the same mantras. 
Even on this forum, there were plenty of people who enjoyed it, myself included. 

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You are in one of the usual circles, repeating the same mantras..but you are so consumed by your own opinion you can’t see it.

 

Rise is a film of moments / set pieces which just don’t gel. It’s a trilogy of plot in one movie and suffers as a result.  It could have been great but it’s merely enjoyable and will be forgotten.

 

 

 

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2 minutes ago, Welrain said:

You are inone of the usual circles, repeating the same mantras..but you are so consumed by your own opinion you can’t see it.

 


What? I’ve not repeated anything. A few people have posted saying “TROS is now universally disliked”, I was meeting with a point that’s prior been made that a lot of people here have very much enjoyed it but don’t tend to repeatedly point it out. 

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Having to compress the plot of a whole trilogy into one film is not a criticism I would ever leverage at the sequel trilogy, but has always been a major one I’d point to when dealing with the prequel trilogy. 
 

Nothing of interest happens in eps. 1 & 2, and everything does in Ep. 3, which is why the Clone Wars has been so successful fleshing it all out. 

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1 hour ago, Kevvy Metal said:

Having to compress the plot of a whole trilogy into one film is not a criticism I would ever leverage at the sequel trilogy, but has always been a major one I’d point to when dealing with the prequel trilogy. 
 

Nothing of interest happens in eps. 1 & 2, and everything does in Ep. 3, which is why the Clone Wars has been so successful fleshing it all out. 

To me Rise does feel compressed because JJ tried to rewrite the changes in direction to the story made by Johnson in Last Jedi. He effectively made a film that should have been split into two parts.

 

Unfortunately it doesn't work and we end up with something that runs at breakneck pace with some pretty key moments (like the Emperor returning) shoe horned into the opening crawl.

 

They should have had a consistent and planned direction on story from the very start or, at the very least, considered creating another film between Last Jedi and Rise. Having writers/directors with differing visions on how stories play out does not make for a good trilogy of films. Hopefully Disney have learned from this with any future planned Trilogy projects (Johnson having a trilogy to oversee is a good start, if that is still happening).

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46 minutes ago, Jg15 said:

To me Rise does feel compressed because JJ tried to rewrite the changes in direction to the story made by Johnson in Last Jedi. He effectively made a film that should have been split into two parts.

 

Unfortunately it doesn't work and we end up with something that runs at breakneck pace with some pretty key moments (like the Emperor returning) shoe horned into the opening crawl.

 

They should have had a consistent and planned direction on story from the very start or, at the very least, considered creating another film between Last Jedi and Rise. Having writers/directors with differing visions on how stories play out does not make for a good trilogy of films. Hopefully Disney have learned from this with any future planned Trilogy projects (Johnson having a trilogy to oversee is a good start, if that is still happening).


That’s all fair enough, but it certainly works for me. I totally get and buy that Snoke was nothing but a red herring, and a more mobile clone body decoy for him to use while his main new clone body is being prepared on Exegol. It even ties in with the likes of Queen Amidala using decoys, and cloning is such a big part of the Star Wars universe. 

Introducing him then is totally fine by me, The Emperor was barely even a thing in the OT till ROTJ. 

 

It’s all a sci-if opera and I’m totally along for the ride. 

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The problem with the ‘they should have planned it all out’ argument is that they did have a (high-level) plan for all three films, and then Carrie Fisher died and the plan had to be chucked in the bin. 

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4 minutes ago, K said:

The problem with the ‘they should have planned it all out’ argument is that they did have a (high-level) plan for all three films, and then Carrie Fisher died and the plan had to be chucked in the bin. 


Yes, and in a Daisy Ridley interview she said they literally started filming TLJ immediately after completing principal on TFA, and there’s no way that all the writers and directors didn’t talk, or... you know... had the support of an entire world building writer’s group. 
 

The Colin trevorrow duel of the fates script is even dated like 2015... and that will be the other major shake up the trilogy had. All the preproduction on that will of been thrown out. Probably because it was shit and he’s a shit film-maker. 

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On 08/01/2021 at 11:40, Hexx said:

 

It's very telling that none of the Disney(+) announcements are from the sequel trilogy era - and few seem to care.

 

Cause they were narrative dead-ends, Last Jedi aside, but Rise killed off everything in that stone dead. 

 

So there's nowhere to go and nothing to do.

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2 hours ago, Festoon said:

 

Cause they were narrative dead-ends, Last Jedi aside, but Rise killed off everything in that stone dead. 

 

So there's nowhere to go and nothing to do.

 

That's not true. In terms of Palpatine we can still get:

His clone

His son

His grandson

His Force Ghost

His reincarnation from Midichlorians

A time travelling version from Rebels

His dad might still be alive......

 

And in terms of successors to the Final Order we can still get:

The Prime Order

The Ultimate Order

The Penultimate Order

The Zero Order

The Empire Order

The First Empire

The Final Empire

The Final Order Pro

 

And in terms of new Stormtrooper colours, we can still get:

Green

Yellow

Grey

Purple

Orange

Brown

Pink

Turqoise

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7 hours ago, Kevvy Metal said:

whole trilogy into one film


what I meant was there was enough going on in the last film that it could easily have been a trilogy of its own. So many ideas chucked at the screen but not given time to breath or develop.  

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