Jump to content

Star Wars: The Force Awakens


Captain Kelsten
 Share

Recommended Posts

Bringing back old actors is a bad idea IMO. The whole thing needs a reboot, a fresh pair of eyes not tied down by having to use actors that today are far from the top of their game just because they were in the films 30 years ago.

Reboots are uncreative and lazy and terrible. If the story can't continue within its existing universe then it shouldn't be attempted.

Han and Leia not having got together would be fantastic, which is why it isn't going to happen.

These films will be utter shite. Quote this in 3 years!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Reboots are uncreative and lazy and terrible. If the story can't continue within its existing universe then it shouldn't be attempted.

Whilst this is often true, it's a bit of a crazy blanket statement. Sometimes the stuff that takes place within a series of movies is so fucking stupid that it destroys the possibility of anything serious coming after it. Imagine watching Batman Begins knowing it was the origin of the Batman from B&R. Less to get invested in or excited about. They had to reboot Spider-Man because they wanted to tell a story which featured three dimensional characters and if people knew it followed on from the Raimi films they'd go in expecting talking cardboard cutouts awkwardly delivering school play dialogue straight from an autocue.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Standalone films now officially confirmed.

http://www.denofgeek.com/movies/star-wars/24730/disney-officially-confirms-standalone-star-wars-movies

No word on whether or not 'Yody: The Teenage Years' is still the first one planned or whether we'll get 'Han: Solo' up first.

After 'Jack the Giant Slayer' disasterous opening I am no longer endorsing Nicolas hoult for a young Han Solo.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

A good recap of the Disney acquisition of Lucasfilm as told by both sides.

Also, a casual bombshell of casting from Lucas himself; Ford, Hamill & Fisher will all be returning for Episode VII. Maybe.

Asked whether members of the original Star Wars cast will appear in Episode VII and if he called them before the deal closed to keep them informed, Lucas says, “We had already signed Mark and Carrie and Harrison—or we were pretty much in final stages of negotiation. So I called them to say, ‘Look, this is what’s going on.’ ” He pauses. “Maybe I’m not supposed to say that. I think they want to announce that with some big whoop-de-do, but we were negotiating with them.” Then he adds: “I won’t say whether the negotiations were successful or not.”

http://www.businessweek.com/articles/2013-03-07/how-disney-bought-lucasfilm-and-its-plans-for-star-wars#p5

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I actually came out of that read feeling a little sorry for Lucas - which takes some doing considering he is a multi-billionaire and I am POOR AS FUCK - but you could tell the very personal attacks on him when the prequels came out had been very painful for him.

Also, the parts where it talks about him being determined but also sad to sign Star Wars away was affecting. Like him or loathe him you have to respect the *ahem* 'Empire' that he built for himself.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Yeah he does come across in that as remarkably sympathetic. Like he is saying goodbye to his baby as he signs it away.

He was seen as a movie god before the prequels, a living legend. almost untouchable. his fall from geek grace must have been as humiliating, as it was unprecedented.

can you even imagine the amount of shit he must get about his creative choices whenever he goes out in public?

Usually you have to be exposed as a pedo or sex pest to experience the level of hate he has.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I’ve just finished reading a book called ‘The Secret History of Star Wars’, which is quite interesting – it goes behind the scenes and the official Lucasfilm history of the series, and talks about stuff like the various different versions of the story for episode IV, and Lucas’ porky-pies over when he had the idea to make Darth Vader into Luke’s dad. One of the most interesting bits is about the mooted episodes X, XI and XII – the series was originally supposed to be twelve episodes long, with each episode taking place in a different era with different characters.

Anyway, one of the most interesting bits is just how miserable Star Wars made Lucas. He wanted the series to make him rich enough to set up this cutting-edge film production house, where he could work away from studio interference. He worked hard at making the original trilogy to make it financially possible to do so, but he worked so hard he destroyed his marriage, and he got divorced – thus losing most of his net wealth, and stopping him from being truly independent. He eventually made enough to set up this surrogate studio, but it was so cutting edge that only the big studios could afford to use it. It’s quite a depressing read overall to be honest, Lucas comes across as being a victim of his own franchise – Star Wars killed his marriage, and the death of his marriage killed him. He even seems to hate being rich.

The other interesting thing from the book was the fact that Return of the Jedi was slated on its first release. Everyone kind of remembers it as not being as good as Empire but still a pretty cool film, but the critical response at the time wasn’t far off the vitriol directed at the prequels.

tl;dr it sucks to be George Lucas.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

The other interesting thing from the book was the fact that Return of the Jedi was slated on its first release. Everyone kind of remembers it as not being as good as Empire but still a pretty cool film, but the critical response at the time wasn’t far off the vitriol directed at the prequels.

tl;dr it sucks to be George Lucas.

Jedi was mostly fine except for Endor. Gary Kurtz fell out with Lucas over it, because it was originally intended to be Kashyyk and the Imperials would fight Wookiees. Ultimately Lucas decided on making the film more child-friendly after the darker Empire and changed it to Ewoks.

Of course, he totally fucked the subtext of Vader's silent sacrifice with the blu-ray release overdub, but then he's redubbed a few lines over the trilogy that totally change the tone. It's like he can't let the audience work things out for themselves. Davros and I have a standing joke about the replaced "Bring my shuttle" line in Empire.

Disney would make some serious money by releasing restored versions of the theatrical releases. Hell, I don't even mind some of the CGI additions - the extra shots of the Falcon, the additional dogfighting stuff, the Wampa cave and the improvements to Cloud City are not bad. The rest of it should be restored - especially dialogue and additions that totally change the original intent of the scenes.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Jedi was mostly fine except for Endor. Gary Kurtz fell out with Lucas over it, because it was originally intended to be Kashyyk and the Imperials would fight Wookiees. Ultimately Lucas decided on making the film more child-friendly after the darker Empire and changed it to Ewoks.

That's another point raised by the book - specifically, that Kurtz is as full of shit as Lucas. Or, more charitably, that he's conflated a lot of different things in his mind over the years. There was never really a version of the Jedi script with Wookiees IIRC, in the same way that there was never this planned version of Jedi without a second Death Star where Leia gets crowned queen of her people. The Jedi script changed a fair bit over its development, but there were never wookiees on Endor - that's a holdover from a very early version of the script that became Star Wars, where the proto-Luke and his master get marooned on a wookiee planet and convince them to rise up against the empire. The main changes to the Jedi script over its various drafts were in respect of Vader, and how sympathetically he was portrayed.

Kurtz didn't fall out with Lucas over Jedi, Lucas basically sacked Kurtz after Empire because he was supposed to be keeping Kershner in line while they filmed in Europe while Lucas was in the states. Instead, Kurtz did the opposite - he sided with Kershner against Lucas, and let the film go enormously over budget. This definitely resulted in a much better film, but it was Lucas' money he was spending, and it was money that was supposed to be going towards Lucas' dream of his own high-tech filmmaking centre. Even thought Empire is a great film, you can sort of see why Lucas wouldn't want to work with Kurtz again - he didn't do what he was hired to do.

Lucas loved Star Wars at this point, but he also saw it as a means to an end, and he was understandably stressed out by the way that Kurtz and Kershner were spending his money and threatening his own future security.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Interesting stuff K - it seems a lot of myths have built up around the films ! The specific thing I remember about Empire was Lucas apparently telling Kershner "You're ruining my movie !" And giving him a bollocking about letting Vader use his lightsaber one-handed.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Secret History of Star Wars is an excellent read.

I can also recommend Marvel Comics: The Untold Story, if you're at all interested in comics, as another really good behind the scenes of the entertainment industry book.

One of the early drafts of Jedi was batshit insane, there were two new Death Stars, the Emperor was chilling out near the centre of the planet in his lava cave (leading to a fight a bit reminiscent of what we ended up with in Episode 3). That's not the mad part though, in the third-act there's all kinds of weird shit involving force ghosts helping Luke and then at the end I think Obi-Wan and Yoda come back to life.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

There were still Ewoks, but they were called Ewaks at that point. Endor was the moon of Had Abaddon the home planet of the Empire (it was renamed to Coruscant in the prequels to match up with what had been established in the novels, but it had the same concept of a city covering an entire planet).

Link to comment
Share on other sites

tl;dr it sucks to be George Lucas.

Interesting stuff, will have to check out the book! I find the whole American Zoetrope story really quite interesting, imagine how different things would be if Lucas had done what was originally planned and made his version of Apocalypse Now! instead.

I kinda hope that now he is finally free that Lucas has a go at doing something else, maybe he'll find something left of the young guy who struck out with his mates to try and make their own movies so long ago (in a city far, far away...)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

There were still Ewoks, but they were called Ewaks at that point. Endor was the moon of Had Abaddon the home planet of the Empire (it was renamed to Coruscant in the prequels to match up with what had been established in the novels, but it had the same concept of a city covering an entire planet).

The whole set of changes is listed here:

http://starwarz.com/starkiller/2010/05/draft-variations-for-return-of-the-jedi/

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I remember when the original trilogy came out on DVD, I listened to the commentaries - it was clearly obvious that ANH was the only one Lucas really gave a shit about. He was almost infectiously enthusiastic about it, talking about its development and everything, whereas on the other films (and the what I've heard of the prequels too) he basically just describes what's happening in each scene.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Interesting stuff, will have to check out the book! I find the whole American Zoetrope story really quite interesting, imagine how different things would be if Lucas had done what was originally planned and made his version of Apocalypse Now! instead.

I kinda hope that now he is finally free that Lucas has a go at doing something else, maybe he'll find something left of the young guy who struck out with his mates to try and make their own movies so long ago (in a city far, far away...)

The book is pretty good, although it could have done with some judicious editing - it's about 700 pages long, and could easily have been half that. There are loads of insanely nerdy digressions, some of which are worthwhile and some of which are rather tedious. The tone is all over the place too, some bits are well-written and fast-moving journalistic accounts, and some bits are prissily academic and pedantic. It's still worth reading if you're interested in the Star Wars films and how they were written.

I wouldn't hold your breath for these experimental films that Lucas keeps saying he's going to make, he's been talking about them pretty much since Return of the Jedi came out, and he's nearly seventy now.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I remember when the original trilogy came out on DVD, I listened to the commentaries - it was clearly obvious that ANH was the only one Lucas really gave a shit about. He was almost infectiously enthusiastic about it, talking about its development and everything, whereas on the other films (and the what I've heard of the prequels too) he basically just describes what's happening in each scene.

Kinda odd to do commentary for films he didn't direct though, eh?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

They had to reboot Spider-Man because they wanted to tell a story which featured three dimensional characters and if people knew it followed on from the Raimi films they'd go in expecting talking cardboard cutouts awkwardly delivering school play dialogue straight from an autocue.

Well, gee, they really failed with that reboot then! Spiderman 2012 was snore-inducing mediocrity with flatly played dull characters.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
 Share

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.
×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

We have placed cookies on your device to help make this website better. You can adjust your cookie settings, otherwise we'll assume you're okay to continue. Use of this website is subject to our Privacy Policy, Terms of Use, and Guidelines.