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The Trouble with Nintendo. A TL;DR topic.


Transient Curse
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So much for the myths that the Wii U doesn't sell because people don't want to spend hundreds on home entertainment devices in these troubled times and that naming your follow up system the same as the previous system only confuses people.

http://www.mcvuk.com/news/read/xbox-one-sells-150k-units-in-first-week-in-uk/0124857

But I was assured that the low Wii U sales were a sign of the state of the market and not many people would be willing to stump up 1.5-2 times the amount of one for another console.

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Well gee that's a matter of both wild speculation and personal opinion. Anyway I'll parse my posts meaning as you don't seem to be able to: the Wii U is still too expensive for what it offers to me personally. I'm sorry if my stating of my opinion offends you.

I don't know if it's too expensive in a more general sense but its beyond the price that would make me just put aside my reservations and order one straight away. I

What's the price you'd snap one up?

But I was assured that the low Wii U sales were a sign of the state of the market and not many people would be willing to stump up 1.5-2 times the amount of one for another console.

Well, let's see, sure the PS3 sold well initially and then didn't for a long time. Likewise the 360.

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What's the price you'd snap one up?

With a bundled game for £150-80, perhaps. They certainly need to get it sub £200 for the regular bundles.

I really do think 3D World looks great but I worry about the future of the device. I was wondering if they might put out another model given the problems with the game pad but considering the sales i doubt there's enough push for them to do that.

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Well gee that's a matter of both wild speculation and personal opinion. Anyway I'll parse my posts meaning as you don't seem to be able to: the Wii U is still too expensive for what it offers to me personally. I'm sorry if my stating of my opinion offends you.

I don't know if it's too expensive in a more general sense but its beyond the price that would make me just put aside my reservations and order one straight away. I

Thats not what you scoffed at all though is it, £230 for a console and stone cold classic game is no money at all.

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I really do think 3D World looks great but I worry about the future of the device. I was wondering if they might put out another model given the problems with the game pad but considering the sales i doubt there's enough push for them to do that.

What problems with the Gamepad? I think it's fair to say that the lack of sales have little to do with the Gamepad itself and more the woeful marketing message.

I imagine we'll start to see bundles dropping below £200 more consistently next year anyway and you could always pick up a second hand one - its not like Nintendo consoles tend to have many reliability* problems.

* Release schedule excluded

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Man, someone is *really* sensitive. The negs are funny.

I'm literally just saying 'I don't want this product at this price' and someone's getting grumpy about that.



What problems with the Gamepad? I think it's fair to say that the lack of sales have little to do with the Gamepad itself and more the woeful marketing message.

I didn't link the lack of sales to the pad. Sorry, what I meant was that I was wondering if they might put out another revision of the pad or something. The problems (well, problem) I referred to was the battery life.

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The trouble for Nintendo, in terms of shifting a huge amounts of Wii U hardware, is that the new audience they captured with the Wii don't care about the Wii U. The attraction of the remote on the Wii was a system seller at that moment in time, a screen on your control pad isn't. What we're seeing with the Wii U is a return to their previous state of home hardware such as the Gamecube.

That's no surprise as they lost their new audience and never addressed the horrific third party support issue they've had since the N64 days. No number of Mario games, Kart, Zelda etc is going to resolve that.

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Thats not what you scoffed at all though is it, £230 for a console and stone cold classic game is no money at all.

For you, it isn't. Opinions are funny things aren't they?

I also imagine you one of Rllmuk's many hysterically loaded denizens. I'm not. I can't just spunk up cash like a money whale constantly.

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I didn't link the lack of sales to the pad. Sorry, what I meant was that I was wondering if they might put out another revision of the pad or something. The problems (well, problem) I referred to was the battery life.

Yeah, it is crap. I tend to just leave it plugged in pretty much all the time but it does depend where your plug sockets are.

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For you, it isn't. Opinions are funny things aren't they?

I also imagine you one of Rllmuk's many hysterically loaded denizens. I'm not. I can't just spunk up cash like a money whale constantly.

Yeah but go and read your post, there is no mention of it being too much for you - you posted that 230 was too expensive for a games machine with a stunning game.

Regardless of ones personal finances £230 with a game is well below the average price the majority of people buy in on a console let alone a relatively new one offering many good games and some potential stunners in the future.

I haven't negged you and i'm in no way loaded - i have likely spent less on tech this year than you judging by the pc / tvs / laptops / ipads posts you have had this year. I cant afford a ps4, well i can but i cant justify one yet as i had to buy a new fence instead but i shall make do with my crappy old bargain bucket wii u!

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While next gen is just beginning to get started which means overpriced/underwhelming launch software (what I mean is while some launch games are good, they're not going to be generation defining classics) - Nintendo have pulled out some excellent classics this year on both their consoles, particularly the 3DS.

I haven't moved on since the Wii and DS so both the 3DS and Wii U were pretty enticing with both having some excellent exclusives, particularly Mario games, but the 3DS has a nice library now and some decent deals going around. I picked up a 3DS XL with Mario Kart 7 and due to a Nintendo promotion, Mario Land 3D for 130 quid. The only sour part of the deal is no charger- why the fuck are they still doing that with their premium handheld product :hmm:

Smitty, if you don't have a 3DS yet, leave the Wii U for now and pick up the 3DS- it just has a far stronger library right now and for me, the Wii U still only has enough games to count on one hand that are essential- it can wait a bit longer. Will probably be cheaper too! 230 quid or so was too much for me to play Mario 3D world as well right now.

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Yeah but go and read your post, there is no mention of it being too much for you - you posted that 230 was too expensive for a games machine with a stunning game.

Well I meant me really. That said I do think its must be a hard sell for people other than me because many will likely think 'another hundred quid and I can get a beasting PS4' or whatever.

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. The only sour part of the deal is no charger- why the fuck are they still doing that with their premium handheld product :hmm:

Yeah. I got a free charger with a deal on my 3DS anyway, but was still shocked to discover I wouldn't have been able to use my new console at all otherwise; I knew there was no charger in the box, but assumed there'd at least be a USB cable it could charge through.

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Yeah, it is crap. I tend to just leave it plugged in pretty much all the time but it does depend where your plug sockets are.

What is with this negative feedback on the controller? Seriously, I've had no issues with battery life - that might mean playing for 2-3 hours and even a bit of Netflix added onto that. Don't have a problem with it.

I do leave it plugged in to charge after every time I've used it. But then why not??

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While next gen is just beginning to get started which means overpriced/underwhelming launch software (what I mean is while some launch games are good, they're not going to be generation defining classics) - Nintendo have pulled out some excellent classics this year on both their consoles, particularly the 3DS.

I haven't moved on since the Wii and DS so both the 3DS and Wii U were pretty enticing with both having some excellent exclusives, particularly Mario games, but the 3DS has a nice library now and some decent deals going around. I picked up a 3DS XL with Mario Kart 7 and due to a Nintendo promotion, Mario Land 3D for 130 quid. The only sour part of the deal is no charger- why the fuck are they still doing that with their premium handheld product :hmm:

Smitty, if you don't have a 3DS yet, leave the Wii U for now and pick up the 3DS- it just has a far stronger library right now and for me, the Wii U still only has enough games to count on one hand that are essential- it can wait a bit longer. Will probably be cheaper too! 230 quid or so was too much for me to play Mario 3D world as well right now.

I don't have a 3DS. I've considered one at points so I get my fix of Nintendo at a lower price. It's £140 for the XL alone though now it seems.

I do take issue with the cost of the games for it as well.

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I'm sure the Nintendo Excuse Generator will be fired up again shortly.

:lol:

Love it.

Played some more with a friends Wii U on Saturday. Well, after the very lengthy updates to the system and then Nintendoland. I should have timed it but I drank beer and fiddled with the settings on the TV instead. Updating the PS3 took almost as long. Sort your updates out computer-game makers.

We didn't have Wiimotes at hand so we couldn't do too much. But I liked the glossy, colorful world of Nintendoland and the Yoshi game was pretty fun - and I was good at it! But I imagine a lot of people booting Nintendoland up and just thinking, what the fuck is going on? It's not especially intuitive or easy to figure out. Which in some ways is something I personally like, not everything has to be super streamlined, easy to use. I think there's loads of fun hidden away in there. So would I buy a Wii U? Sure. If I had the cash to burn. I'd buy all of them, the next-gen consoles. I don't discriminate. I was also rather positively impressed with the gamepad, screen and feel and all. The display is a bit yellow in the whites perhaps, or is that just my eyes?

I don't even necessarily think that Nintendoland is that hard to explain to folks. Silly and fun mini games for all ages set in the delightful, wacky world of Nintendo. When they start the program though, that'll be when the confusion sets in. For me it would be much more fun to just be able to run around from the beginning without all the nagging and explaining. Just run around and try stuff. Then press a '?' something if you want to know the specifics of some game. And let people play the multiplayer games singleplayer with computer-bots just to get a feel for it. Make it much more immediate and easy to just to some stuff. Isn't that what a theme park/land is all about really?

So the problem with Nintendo is that it takes a lifetime to actually get gaming and then half a lifetime before you are set free. Cut the fat! Like you've apparently done with the new Zelda, Nintendo.

I don't have a 3DS. I've considered one at points so I get my fix of Nintendo at a lower price. It's £140 for the XL alone though now it seems.

I do take issue with the cost of the games for it as well.

A lot of Nintendo games keep their value. Maybe not Nintendogs LOL, (NOT dissing Nintendogs - it's adorable!).

And the good ones are worth the moneys.

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I bought an n64 for 250 including mario.. I only bought the console for that game and I'm glad I did. I didn't even think much of the n64 games of the future to be honest. Eventually though Nintendo bought a load of decent games out ( although rare had a big part of this) and it warranted my investment even though most of the 3rd party software was trash.

I expect the wii u will be simular, I don't really care as long as Nintendo have a few surprises up their sleeves. It's true beyond mario Kart and smash bros ( not sure on donkey kong yet) it does look a little bleak but fingers crossed..

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The reason the wii u isn't selling has nothing at all to do with price. Its to do with a gamepad that the wider market just aren't interested in, its to do with the console being under powered and gazzumped by the PS4/Xbone and its to do with the complete lack of third party support, including a huge number of games people like playing. If you love playing FIFA why would you buy a games machine that doesn't have it?

The wii u is now a top up console, something that perhaps a gamer might buy when they've had their PS$/Xbone for a few years first

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I bought an n64 for 250 including mario.. I only bought the console for that game and I'm glad I did. I didn't even think much of the n64 games of the future to be honest. Eventually though Nintendo bought a load of decent games out ( although rare had a big part of this) and it warranted my investment even though most of the 3rd party software was trash.

I expect the wii u will be simular, I don't really care as long as Nintendo have a few surprises up their sleeves. It's true beyond mario Kart and smash bros ( not sure on donkey kong yet) it does look a little bleak but fingers crossed..

The difference was, the Nintendo 64 looked like it'd have a promising future over a year before it was even launched over here (see: the Space World '95 footage, that was just jaw-dropping). Sure, it never looked like it would match the PlayStation's unassailable market share, even during the pre-launch excitement, but you knew it'd be a great console with lots of fantastic games ahead in its future, many of which you'd have seen brief footage of ages before you were even able to buy the console. I've never had that feeling with the Wii U over the last year.
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I don't even necessarily think that Nintendoland is that hard to explain to folks. Silly and fun mini games for all ages set in the delightful, wacky world of Nintendo. When they start the program though, that'll be when the confusion sets in. For me it would be much more fun to just be able to run around from the beginning without all the nagging and explaining. Just run around and try stuff. Then press a '?' something if you want to know the specifics of some game. And let people play the multiplayer games singleplayer with computer-bots just to get a feel for it. Make it much more immediate and easy to just to some stuff. Isn't that what a theme park/land is all about really?

So the problem with Nintendo is that it takes a lifetime to actually get gaming and then half a lifetime before you are set free. Cut the fat! Like you've apparently done with the new Zelda, Nintendo.

What jars me about modern day Nintendo is that they seem to be so interested in data from consumers, but they don't actually use this data to impact your game experience. They won't give you Star Catalogue points until you've answered the same questions over and over again, they want you to rate yourself as a casual or advanced gamer on Miiverse but it doesn't affect the games you play.

I agree with your points regarding Nintendoland completely... and I feel like there's no joy in discovery anymore with Nintendo products... it has to be sign-posted, it has to be prefaced with a 3-minute conversation, and then you have to acknowledge that you have understood it. Imagine if your rating as an advanced gamer meant that you went into Nintendoland without the hand-holding. Your Mii lands at the central hub with the games in front of you and you explore the area yourself.

The one thing for me, in this (just passing) console generation that stands out as a feature that I have really appreciated is that when I hold down the PS button on my PS3 controller the first option is 'Turn off console' and there's no "Are you sure?" that defaults to 'No'. It might sound banal to you, but it was refreshing to see something designed for regular use.

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What jars me about modern day Nintendo is that they seem to be so interested in data from consumers, but they don't actually use this data to impact your game experience. They won't give you Star Catalogue points until you've answered the same questions over and over again, they want you to rate yourself as a casual or advanced gamer on Miiverse but it doesn't affect the games you play.

I agree with your points regarding Nintendoland completely... and I feel like there's no joy in discovery anymore with Nintendo products... it has to be sign-posted, it has to be prefaced with a 3-minute conversation, and then you have to acknowledge that you have understood it. Imagine if your rating as an advanced gamer meant that you went into Nintendoland without the hand-holding. Your Mii lands at the central hub with the games in front of you and you explore the area yourself.

Yep, bang on. Example: in NSMB Wii where in that match two mini-game they show you the instructions EVERY SINGLE TIME. I don't even think you need it once. Like they couldn't throw you in and just let you figure it out? It's like they are on a mission to improve literacy rates by exposing people to as much text as possible. Often slow scrolling, vidi-printer style. Press A.. Press A.. Press A..Press A.. Press A

I mean, excessive tutorialising is a cross-system issue, but Nintendo take it to ridiculous extremes. What ever happened to show, don't tell?

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I can understand (and more or less agree) with opinions stating that the Wii U is too expensive, I personally thnk this is because having the 3DS held up alongside it shows it up in a bad light. It has a far stronger catalogue of games right now and can gotten for cheaper, and right now especially it just looks like a far more appealing purchase.

I won't deny that Super Mario 3D World looks INCREDIBLE (and if anything will make me bite the bullet on a Wii U, it'll be a combination of that and Smash Brothers) but just yesterday Amazon had a Black Friday deal for a 3DS XL with Mario Kart 7 for £129.99, and starting tomorrow Nintendo have that offer where registering a 3DS console and one from a selected list of games (of which Mario Kart 7 is included) will net you a free copy of Super Mario 3D Land. Right there you can get a Nintendo console with two quality games for almost half the price of a Wii U with Super Mario 3D World, plus y'know portability is cool.

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The one thing for me, in this (just passing) console generation that stands out as a feature that I have really appreciated is that when I hold down the PS button on my PS3 controller the first option is 'Turn off console' and there's no "Are you sure?" that defaults to 'No'. It might sound banal to you, but it was refreshing to see something designed for regular use.

That's odd, if I hold down the PS button on my PS3 controllers I get a menu with four items, the third of which is "turn off console", and I have to confirm on a second screen.

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That's odd, if I hold down the PS button on my PS3 controllers I get a menu with four items, the third of which is "turn off console", and I have to confirm on a second screen.

You don't confirm for turning off the pad. You confirm for turning it off or quitting the game, though curiously turning off the console defaults to "Yes", whilst quitting the game defaults to "No".

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