Liverpool Football Club Thread

[JamesTW]

Just glad we didn't get embarrassed, at one stage I thought it would be 4 or 5 nil

Stevie WTF?

They deserved it and I hate them more than is good for my health

[Gabe]

I was going to post a long train-of-thought the other day about our season, but felt it was premature, but given that 4th is now going to be very, very difficult I can't help but feel this has been a pretty rubbish year.

We had an abysmal Champions League campaign and limp attempt at the Europa League, Can is the only summer signing that you'd always include in the starting 11 and - like last season - it's only a great run of form since Christmas that has given us hope of looking competitive.

The problems defensively haven't gone away, they've just been put off for a bit, because if Can starts next season as a CB then we're wasting his talent. I've always questioned Moreno's defensive ability and nothing's changed, today is not the first time he's been directly at fault for goals. And who knows what will happen with Lovren? At least Sahko has come on well this season.

Allen I still find slows down play too much, can't tackle and whilst being able to boast great passing stats, nearly all of them are backwards or sideways. Balotelli has been a gamble that hasn't worked, Sturridge seems to have reverted to his Man City/Bolton days of only ever thinking about shooting, then taking on half the opposition team and losing possession and Sterling has had some purple patches but also spells like his current form (he's been very ordinary for weeks).

What concerns me the most though, is the fact that we start seasons slowly/poorly. I've said this before, but in his short time at the club Rodgers has presided over 2 of the worst 3 starts to a season we've had in 20+ years (I think this season was the worst start in 50-odd years?) and it's only by going on these long runs that makes things look much more respectable. New players can't be an excuse all the time, given that they didn't always start or even play, so that needs resolving.

I suppose this performance was due at some point, we were rubbish against Blackburn in the cup, shaky against Burnley and lucky against Swansea. The City game is the only one this month you'd say we played well in, and even then it was only for 45 minutes.

Next week at Arsenal will be our last chance to stake a claim for 4th - if we win then we pull them back into the mix. Draw or lose, and I think we'll need to fight hard for 5th, as Tottenham are picking up points and Southampton haven't got a bad run-in.

[Oh Danny Boy]

Sterling has been completely absent from this game. To say he wants more than £100,000k a week, he needs to play much better.

Him and his agent are trying to take us to the cleaners I'd rather the club sold him abroad for £40m. Giving into such ridic demands is a bad precedent to set. Only in the madness of modern football would someone dick about on an wage increase of £30k to £100k a week.

It always feels like a punch in the gut losing to a worse team at home. Had one of those games and Gerrard...well he really should know better shouldn't he? On the plus side while most teams would collapse in that situation they rolled their sleeves up and gave it a good try. Still not all doom and gloom, united have a difficult run in and will be dropping points, although I think at the very least not losing to Arsenal is a must, although a win would put us back on track. But I can't remember the last time we won at the Emrites...

[JamesTW]

I'd say our run in is harder than theirs, to answer your question we won 2-0 at Arsenal a few years ago, Frimpong(?) got sent off I think, Mereles scored

[Gabe]

I think it's a bit harsh to call Man U a worse team. They haven't played well for a lot of the season, but they have picked up points and have got players who you would think will come good (the same hope we have for a number of our players too). Their problem has been trying to find a formation to suit what they have, rather than players not being good enough (except Smalling and probably Jones).

Edit: As for the Arsenal game, our record there is poor overall. We won a few years ago under Dalglish, but that is our only second win away to them this millennium. Tita Camara scored the previous last winner away, back in 2000 (good goal it was, too). We've drawn a few lately, but that probably won't be good enough this season.

[SMD]

We fucked that royally, lads.

[Oh Danny Boy]

I'd say our run in is harder than theirs, to answer your question we won 2-0 at Arsenal a few years ago, Frimpong(?) got sent off I think, Mereles scored

Ahh... i forgot that one, still not our most successful of hunting grounds.

[Stig]

Arsenal will win, I just don't see us being able to get a result there. We only just scrapped a draw from them at home.

[Gabe]

See my edit on the previous page, 2 wins since 2000. Some real hammerings in that time, too (not always in terms of scoreline, but totally outplayed).

[Azrael]

Awful from us today. Gerrard's a bellend for losing it like that. Sterling has been gash recently, when's Ibe due back? Lucas was on the bench, hope he gets put back in the starting XI. He was doing a good job before injury.

At least Mignolet denied Rooney from scoring. That would have made an awful day even worse.

Jones should have had at least one more yellow card than he got [/bitter]

4th's gone. Will struggle to get 5th.

[glb]

Second season in a row we've fluffed our lines when it really mattered (or today, perhaps, Mata-ed).

Played shite, deserved nothing from the game, so no complaints whatsoever. The fact it was United just makes it sting all the more.

[Kelthink]

Well, the important thing is that we survived.

[Stig]

Skrtl charged with violent conduct. Just what we needed.

[toythatkills]

Seems a bit premature writing off your chances for fourth when all you have to do is win your next game and you're right back in it. You'll have a much better idea where you stand after that one.

[Kelthink]

Skrtl charged with violent conduct. Just what we needed.

This is truly outrageous, he barely touched him, etc.

(I'm barely shocked)

No way should we contest that. I almost thought Gerrard's stampy dance was less intentional, though I thought his slice through Mata was red-card worthy enough.

[glb]

Seems a bit premature writing off your chances for fourth when all you have to do is win your next game and you're right back in it. You'll have a much better idea where you stand after that one.

It's away to Arsenal, an away game Liverpool have won once in 723 years or something. Not entirely given up on fourth but more than likely going to be eight points off the race after the next round of games.

Thankfully I'm not a motivational speaker employed by LFC.

[Baring]

There she is.

[AlwaysBeClosing]

There are no lols big enough for you. Fuck off.

[glb]

Goddammit Leroy.

[dizogg]

Lol it's worse than RAWK in here! Losing to Man Utd isn't costing us 4th, our abysmal start to the season is. We've just gone on a huge run of form, someone was going to beat us. Yes it hurts that it's Man Utd but they are one of the most expensively put together sides around, it's not the biggest surprise. We were outplayed mostly and they deserved it.

All we can do now is do our best. And yes that probably means 5th. But after the start to the season we had that's not too bad.

But still a lot to play for. Let's go and win the FA Cup for one.

[glb]

It's the hope that kills you. True though, 5th after being in League Two or whatever it was after we didn't win for the first 28 months of the season, would be a decent turnaround.

Think the international break makes it worse; have to stew for a fortnight waiting for the next game. At least the games come thick and fast after that though.

[dogsout]

I agree with diz. In fact, I actually feel quite positive considering we were so well beaten. I think the game answered a lot of questions about the system, the players and the manager's methods. Van gaal set them up perfectly and he deserves a lot of credit for that. It wasn't a case of the players not wanting it enough or not turning up, as I've read many times since the game. They didn't allow us to play our game because their tactics were spot on. They took away our system by breaking our lines and forcing us into a 5-4-1. This meant we couldn't press and we couldn't control the midfield. People have criticised Joe Allen but few of them seem to have noticed that we were badly outnumbered in midfield. So many pundits have suggested the way to defeat this 3-4-2-1 is to exploit the space behind the wing-backs. Van gaal has a great understanding of 3 at the back systems and he had them exploit the space in front of our wing-backs by pinning them back beside the centre-backs. It was very clever and you could see the panic beginning to set in within the fist few minutes of the game.

I thought Rodgers reacted very well at half time by reverting to a back four. Unfortunately Gerrard destroyed any chance of a come back but we were much better in that second half.

I think that performance had been coming for a while. We were finding it harder and harder to create clear chances whilst playing 3-4-2-1. The manager had been experimenting in recent weeks - we've seen 3-4-2-1, W-M, 3-4-1-2, 3-3-3-1. It's been fun and it's been interesting, but I am expecting him to go back to a back four and his favoured 4-3-3 soon. He has many more options for that formation now. Many of the players have played themselves into form now. We have a settled core of defenders and Mignolet has been pretty great since coming back into the team. Meanwhile, Can has started to be targeted at the back, and it's causing us problems. As is the lack of a competent wing-back on the left. Moreno is still playing within himself and although he is capable of getting behind a defence, he is reliant on being played in and his quality still isn't there.

I think the 4-3-3 suits us a lot more right now, and expect that we'll go back to varying between that, the 4-4-2 diamond (less often), with the added option of 3-4-2-1. I don't think this is knee-jerk; I think it's been coming during this run we've been on and was just a matter of time. I'll be surprised if this doesn't happen over the next few games. The only way I see us sticking to 3 at the back now, is if he tries the 3-4-3 diamond and it clicks.

[DC Lemon]

The real disappointment is the abhorrent reaction of the Man Utd fans from all over. You'd expect such delight from Chelsea fans, not Man Utd in such wide swathes. Still I guess they have little else, with an expensive aging team - a little win was clearly the biggest thing to happen to them all year. Sad, I guess.

Does this make sense to anyone? Is it meant to? Delight over a win is abhorrent?

[Adrock]

People have criticised Joe Allen but few of them seem to have noticed that we were badly outnumbered in midfield. So many pundits have suggested the way to defeat this 3-4-2-1 is to exploit the space behind the wing-backs. Van gaal has a great understanding of 3 at the back systems and he had them exploit the space in front of our wing-backs by pinning them back beside the centre-backs. It was very clever and you could see the panic beginning to set in within the fist few minutes of the game.

I think it was quite clear the midfield was overrun, the team were penned in for at least 35 minutes at the beginning of the match but that doesn't mean the performance of Allen can be excused because of that.

Allen looked like a punch drunk boxer, he was in the middle of the pitch at times with the ball at his feet wondering what should be done next. A couple of times he turned into United players and just had a look of shock on his face, clearly he couldn't deal with the pressure. Surely Lucas was a clear option at half time when it was obvious Allen wasn't dealing with the situation.

As a positive I thought Sakho had his most commanding performance yet for the club, he dealt with the pressure of opposition players closing him down very well throughout the game and kept a level head at all times. If he can keep up that level of performance he could be brilliant in the long term.

[Gabe]

It was pretty easy to spot from the off that United were compressing the space between the lines and the team didn't really know how to deal with it. As I said, it was the best they've played at Anfield for many years in terms of a pretty complete performance.

As for Allen, I stand by the fact that in any given game his passing slows things down, is mainly sideways or backwards and he can't tackle - so he falls between being neither a proper holding player, nor one to link the midfield with the attack. I could be misremembering here, but I think for Swansea he played a bit further forward?

With regards to the performance I agree with you dogsout (and as I mentioned in my previous post) - over the last 3 weeks or so the quality of our performances has dipped quite a bit (plus the goals have dried up a bit), so it was the kind of game that was coming.

Anyway, we move on.

Can't believe Skrtel has appealed his stamping charge - there's no way he's going to get it overturned and they'll extend the ban if it is felt his appeal is without merit (and I can't see how he thinks it isn't). I wonder if he'll play Toure with Sakho or have Lovren try and fit in with him (if he changes back to a 4-3-3)?

[dogsout]

Bringing Lucas on for Allen couldn't possibly have changed anything in any meaningful way. We were 2 against 4 in midfield until Rodgers made the change. I really don't think there's any point in looking at individual performances when the problems were tactical.

I think Brendan's got a big decision to make with the team selection for the next game. If he does revert to a back four it is quite likely that we will be bringing two players in the defence. I think that makes it a bit more likely that he'll hold off making the change for now.

[Azrael]

Noooo!

Dirk Kuyt has picked up an injury so won't be able to play on Sunday. Same for Meireles.

Least Kewell has been drafted in. Still want Heskey and Crouch to make an appearance.

[hmm]

Yeah, if you're worried about players not appearing due to injury, I probably wouldn't get too excited about Kewell just yet.

[Azrael]

So Sturridge is injured again then. Just as he was starting to come good again.

Little advice needed, will be heading to Anfield tomorrow, I assume there's little in the way of parking around the stadium. Where would be best to leave the car?

[JamesTW]

dunno if this helps but Shiel Road but it's quite a walk!(20 minutes) and even then it's a hassle, you'll have to get there about 60-75 mins before or there's cars bumper to bumper on both sides and sometimes have to go round the corner into next road, it's free though