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No Refunds, You Idiot – The Sony Customer Service Thread


Timmo
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No promises, but I rummaged in my media contacts and may have The Guardian interested in a story. Who on here has been affected by this? Pockets, at least one other guy who's name I forget, anyone else?

Can the people affected send me a PM with a brief summary outline of their story and juicy quotes from Sony emails? And some contact details. I'll collate them, send them on to the Guardian, and hopefully they'll run with it. Please be aware I'll pass your details on, unless you really don't want that for some reason (but that weakens the story.)

Links to forum threads discussing this with other people who've seen it would be helpful, too. Anything that suggests this is more widespread and not a couple of unfortunate cases. I seem to remember NeoGAF had a big thread.

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No promises, but I rummaged in my media contacts and may have The Guardian interested in a story. Who on here has been affected by this? Pockets, at least one other guy who's name I forget, anyone else?

Can the people affected send me a PM with a brief summary outline of their story and juicy quotes from Sony emails? And some contact details. I'll collate them, send them on to the Guardian, and hopefully they'll run with it. Please be aware I'll pass your details on, unless you really don't want that for some reason (but that weakens the story.)

Links to forum threads discussing this with other people who've seen it would be helpful, too. Anything that suggests this is more widespread and not a couple of unfortunate cases. I seem to remember NeoGAF had a big thread.

It was Istanbul and Timmo

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No promises, but I rummaged in my media contacts and may have The Guardian interested in a story. Who on here has been affected by this? Pockets, at least one other guy who's name I forget, anyone else?

Can the people affected send me a PM with a brief summary outline of their story and juicy quotes from Sony emails? And some contact details. I'll collate them, send them on to the Guardian, and hopefully they'll run with it. Please be aware I'll pass your details on, unless you really don't want that for some reason (but that weakens the story.)

Links to forum threads discussing this with other people who've seen it would be helpful, too. Anything that suggests this is more widespread and not a couple of unfortunate cases. I seem to remember NeoGAF had a big thread.

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It was in the same week that there was a massive leak of Sony stuff. I think it was just the Pictures side of the company but it's not like they don't have form for leaks.

I mean, it would be hilarious if all these 'hacks' on their customers that they refuse to refund for due to T&C saysing that customers are responsible for their own account securyt, were actually due to account details being stolen from Sony themselves.

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Yes but people who have done chargebacks in the past have had their accounts permanently banned by Sony.

Which would presumably result in them selling their PS4 and getting an Xbone. That's definitely what I'd do.

The most obvious take-away from all this (apart from not storing your card details with Sony) is to not buy digital, especially not from Sony.

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I don't get the Sony bloke claiming that they get loads of people attempting to scam them? How do they know? And surely they can remove the game license when they issue a refund so there's no way to get a free game unless you disconnect the console from the net forever. Not much of a scam.

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It's not even REALLY £40 because they're not missing a physical good out of the deal, they're back 100% to where they would be if the transaction which shouldn't have taken place never took place.

Minus a few GB of bandwidth I guess. But it's not like there's say, a car they can only sell on at a massive discount or something.

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I don't get the Sony bloke claiming that they get loads of people attempting to scam them? How do they know? And surely they can remove the game license when they issue a refund so there's no way to get a free game unless you disconnect the console from the net forever. Not much of a scam.

They claim they 'know'. It may be true. It may not be true. They may believe it to be true, or they may just say it because they think it's expedient. After all, no-one is likely to take them to court (even small claims), the authorities aren't interested unless there is a big enough fuss at which point Sony can say, "after careful consideration blah blah blah we have decided to refund these customers blah lessons have been learned." You know, the usual guff. They don't need to do anything until there is a big enough fuss.

Whatever; AFAICS, they are presently complicit in the fraud they agree is occurring and they have stolen money from the innocent customer.

They would be compelled to do something if the amount was ten or a hundred times as much.

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And surely they can remove the game license when they issue a refund so there's no way to get a free game unless you disconnect the console from the net forever. Not much of a scam.

I don't think they can cos I've seen a few people on Reddit asking why they can still play a game after getting a refund. This is PSN we're talking about after all.

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Last time I went to my local CAB I waited an hour to talk to a 16 year old. As much as it's about the principle really, there's only so much I'll do over £40.

Well quite, it's hardly worth you spending an hour on the phone, let alone queuing up in CAB or filing with small claims. If it were £400 it would be a different story. And they know that.

Really the bad press angle, which you're trying in cooperation with others, seems the best approach. Also contact Trading Standards. And maybe the police. If they're interested, great. If they're not interested you have more material for the press to run with: "... and what's worse is there is no practical way to hold Sony to account."

[edit]

Maybe contact self-proclaimed consumer justice warriors (CJW), too, like TotalBiscuit (over 300k Twitter followers and over 1m YouTube subscribers).

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They removed FIFA and British Cop skin pack from my download list so it can be done. I know this for sure because I had to rebuy British Cop skin pack.

And they removed all my purchases when my £80 was refunded. Gave me enough money to buy British Cop skin pack myself. Which I was delighted with.

Seriously though Pockets, there's no point talking to the support centre on the phone or via email once the initial report and initial 'no refund' email has been made. They have zero power to do anything no matter how sympathetic (or not as others have experienced) they seem. Once you've shown that you've done everything reasonable to resolve the issue via the support centre, move on to the emailing people within Sony, like my long post suggested in the other thread.

To sum it up;

1. Go through the normal support route. This will take 2-3 weeks from reporting it. It is extremely unlikely that you will receive a refund at this point. They will read you 'Terms of Service' and how 'You' are solely responsible for your account.

2. Appeal this decision. Make formal complaint. Will most likely be denied. Or ignored.

3. Write a letter (post) to Sony HQ in London. Will most likely be ignored.

4. Again, appeal on the phone/email. Message them on Twitter/Playstation forums etc. My Twitter account has 60k+ followers and they responded to my questions, until they know who I really was...then they just ignored me. So, prepare to be ignored again.

Throughout all of this be prepared to be attacked by Sony Fanboys, people calling you an idiot for getting hacked or phished (even if it isn't true!), and be prepared for Sony to treat you like either an idiot or a criminal. This forum here was by far the most friendly and helpful for me in getting my funds returned. I am still grateful for that guys!

The point of all the above is to show that you have gone through the proper channels and you have done everything reasonably possible to try and bring the issue to resolution.

Now you can step it up, my breakthough I feel was for one of two reasons:

1. I emailed a bucketload of Sony employees on www.linkedin.com and one took pity and escalated the issue to someone who could actually do something.

The way you can do this is, search SCEE & customer or consumer and find people who are in that field within SCEE. Then, to obtain their email address use this guide: FistName_LastName@scee.net.

I believe that the guy who did help me was a Mr Nick Caplin as I was once called on behalf of him. But I cannot be sure. If it was him, I remain grateful to him. https://www.linkedin...SRPcmpt:primary

2. I emailed a number of papers/blogs etc. Only the Guardian responded to me, and a kind person there told me she would investigate my case. I didn't hear anything else back from her, but shortly after, I did receive the refund. Her name was Ann Timms of the Guardian's Consumer Affairs section.

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What was the fraudulent transaction for, Pockets? I think the fact that Timmo's included British Cop Skin Pack is what gave the story traction.


Timmo couldn't go to the police because they wouldn't understand why he'd want a refund for the British Cop Skin Pack.

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