Suicide Squad - Will Smith, Margot Robbie & Jared Leto

[Mr. Gerbik]

2 hours ago, Mr Cochese said:

Deadpool totally drew in a load of people who'd never even heard of him.

 

These things are the mainstream action movies now, just as the Westerns once were. But with capes for hats.

 

1 hour ago, Lorfarius said:

Just imagine if they had capes AND hats. Madness.

And this is the best part of Marvel getting the Spider-Man licence back! Now they can do both:

 

 

Your move, DC.

[Mr Cochese]

The main development in action film storytelling seems to be that instead of getting the mysterious stranger's tragic backstory in a bar scene flashback two thirds of the way through, it happens upfront, and there's an entire film of it.

[Benny]

45 minutes ago, Mr Cochese said:

The main development in action film storytelling seems to be that instead of getting the mysterious stranger's tragic backstory in a bar scene flashback two thirds of the way through, it happens upfront, and there's an entire film of it.

 

I miss the days when characters were written well enough that they didn't even need a backstory. Or where you had to work it out yourself by paying attention to subtle hints.

[Sledge]

Caught this midweek. It's a hot mess all right, although for my money less worse than BvS... I mean, objectively it made even less sense but somehow avoided being quite so utterly risible. Deadshot and Harley being (i) the main characters, (ii) portrayed well and (iii) not horrendously written* in comparison to everyone and everything else, is probably what swung things. A bit.

 

To me, DC's emerging problem is the quality of their source material. Suicide Squad verged on unintentional parody, and why? Because one of the Squad's "super power" was tying knots (or something) while another's was throwing boomerangs... I honestly had to double check that he wasn't called Captain Billabong because that's the level they're operating at there. And what else have they got? The infamously lame Aquaman; a Green Lantern that even Ryan Reynolds couldn't rescue; The Flash who, let me tell you speaking as a non-comic book person, may as well be Aquaman with that embarrassing outfit... once you get past Batman and Superman DC have next to nothing that anyone in the mainstream can invest in.

 

Fingers crossed for Wonder Woman because that's kinda their last shot for a generation, isn't it?

 

 

*I say this with like a million billion caveats that I won't bore everyone with. Quinn was never given a narrative reason to even be there, I know I know, but the character writing was either okay or I was hoodwinked by Robbie.

[Captain Novaforce]

DC have got a few great characters with powers they could use, I'm thinking Poison Ivy mainly in terms of villains. The thing they have issues with is the execution.

I quite enjoy having Jon Jonzz in the Supergirl TV show, mainly as they've just gone all out cheese and have a good actor for this human form.

[Mr Cochese]

12 hours ago, Benny said:

 

I miss the days when characters were written well enough that they didn't even need a backstory. Or where you had to work it out yourself by paying attention to subtle hints.

To be fair, it was always that their wife and children were killed by a gang and they returned to find their homestead burning.

 

And then got bitten by a radioactive cow.

[glb]

Someone in the office just said, "Keith Ledger's Joker was far better."

 

I'd like to think so too.

[Festoon]

Not sure what anyone was thinking when they though the Juggaloker was a good idea...

[Festoon]

16 hours ago, JohnC said:

Eh? Surely the amount they are pulling in shows the exact opposite? Several have gone over a billion. Shitloads of people who don't follow comics are going to them.

 

Yeah, I expressed that really poorly. What I mean is that there's a bit of a divide becoming apparent whereby these films get to 600 million and that's yer lot.

 

It's still a lot of money but I'm not sure comic book movies will capture the 1bn attention anymore, particularly when they get ever-dependent upon watch previous/all in-universe tie-ins and so on.

[JohnC]

We've already had a billion dollar comic movie this year.

[jon_cybernet]

I think the divide is that the DC films will only ever get to $600m because they're grimdark affairs aimed only at 14-year old boys, whilst the Marvel films will continue to hit those $1bn highs, because they're more family-friendly 4 quadrant flicks. They've just got a bigger audience available, and they've built a brand that people trust. 

[RubberJohnny]

 

[Ste_S]

15 hours ago, Sledge said:

Caught this midweek. It's a hot mess all right, although for my money less worse than BvS... I mean, objectively it made even less sense but somehow avoided being quite so utterly risible. Deadshot and Harley being (i) the main characters, (ii) portrayed well and (iii) not horrendously written* in comparison to everyone and everything else, is probably what swung things. A bit.

 

To me, DC's emerging problem is the quality of their source material. Suicide Squad verged on unintentional parody, and why? Because one of the Squad's "super power" was tying knots (or something) while another's was throwing boomerangs... I honestly had to double check that he wasn't called Captain Billabong because that's the level they're operating at there. And what else have they got? The infamously lame Aquaman; a Green Lantern that even Ryan Reynolds couldn't rescue; The Flash who, let me tell you speaking as a non-comic book person, may as well be Aquaman with that embarrassing outfit... once you get past Batman and Superman DC have next to nothing that anyone in the mainstream can invest in.

 

Fingers crossed for Wonder Woman because that's kinda their last shot for a generation, isn't it?

 

 

*I say this with like a million billion caveats that I won't bore everyone with. Quinn was never given a narrative reason to even be there, I know I know, but the character writing was either okay or I was hoodwinked by Robbie.

 

It should be noted that the CW shows do amazingly well with the minor 'quirky' DC villians such as Captain Boomerang, Captain Cold, Heatwave, King Shark etc Mostly by acknowledging the source material for what it is and camping it up. You can't do grimdark with someone who's main power is throwing a Boomerang...

[Hexx]

Yeah I posted Captain Boomerang's fight a few pages ago - but even on a TV budget they do more involving fights than these movies

 

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BNUfDbZuEOQ

 

It's naff, and silly, but it's fun and got a sense of purpose as you know/like the characters]

 

[Liquid Myth]

6 hours ago, jon_cybernet said:

I think the divide is that the DC films will only ever get to $600m because they're grimdark affairs aimed only at 14-year old boys, whilst the Marvel films will continue to hit those $1bn highs, because they're more family-friendly 4 quadrant flicks. They've just got a bigger audience available, and they've built a brand that people trust. 

 

This is probably the stupidest post I've ever read on these films.

 

"Well, DC make films for dweebs and losers, which I am definitely not, whilst Marvel make the films for the cool guys, like me"

 

DC make bank because they've spent years in other markets (comics and cartoon films, mostly) catering hugely towards Central and South American audiences, so they have an in-built guaranteed audience of some kind, though not necessarily one that will consist of repeat viewers. Also, this film features at least one significant Hispanic character with a lot of screentime, not to mention a teaser for a superhero who is also Hispanic (in these films).

[jon_cybernet]

1 hour ago, Liquid Myth said:

 

This is probably the stupidest post I've ever read on these films.

 

"Well, DC make films for dweebs and losers, which I am definitely not, whilst Marvel make the films for the cool guys, like me"

 

DC make bank because they've spent years in other markets (comics and cartoon films, mostly) catering hugely towards Central and South American audiences, so they have an in-built guaranteed audience of some kind, though not necessarily one that will consist of repeat viewers. Also, this film features at least one significant Hispanic character with a lot of screentime, not to mention a teaser for a superhero who is also Hispanic (in these films).

 

Well Suicide Squad made more money on its opening weekend in the UK than it did in all of South America, so if cultural appropriation is their awesome non-niche strategy for box office $$$, they'd probably be better off calling the film The Rotter Gang and making them all swan around in top hats whilst quaffing cups of Earl Grey tea. 

[Mr Cochese]

Your point is stupid, because something about the immense Corto Maltese audience for these films.

[RubberJohnny]

Yeah I'm not sure where Liquid Myth copy and pasted that from, but I recall Suicide Squad got pulled from cinema chains in Mexico because WB tried to alter the contract last minute, so another stellar strategy from them there.

[Liquid Myth]

2 hours ago, jon_cybernet said:

 

Well Suicide Squad made more money on its opening weekend in the UK than it did in all of South America, so if cultural appropriation is their awesome non-niche strategy for box office $$$, they'd probably be better off calling the film The Rotter Gang and making them all swan around in top hats whilst quaffing cups of Earl Grey tea. 

 

Uh, there's a huge S.American/C.American population in the southern states of N.America? It's a really big country.

 

2 hours ago, RubberJohnny said:

Yeah I'm not sure where Liquid Myth copy and pasted that from, but I recall Suicide Squad got pulled from cinema chains in Mexico because WB tried to alter the contract last minute, so another stellar strategy from them there.

 

Yes, the very possibility that I aggregated the info myself is completely fucking bewildering. I don't appreciate being called stupid just because I remembered a thing from something I read years ago.

 

On-topic, it was one of the big cinema chains yes, but see above for something more relevant. If anything, it's much more affected by the ban in China.

[Broker]

I imagine it's success was most directly influenced by being a shit film based on characters that either nobody cares about or they've fucking butchered.

[Khrushchev]

I don't really think a term like grimdark would apply to many of these mainstream action blockbuster super-hero films.BvS, Suicide Squad or even the po-faced Batman films may be less campy than most of Marvel's stuff, but they are hardly Blood Meridian or Alien3 are they.

[jon_cybernet]

5 hours ago, Khrushchev said:

I don't really think a term like grimdark would apply to many of these mainstream action blockbuster super-hero films.BvS, Suicide Squad or even the po-faced Batman films may be less campy than most of Marvel's stuff, but they are hardly Blood Meridian or Alien3 are they.

 

I would say that a series of films where, off the top of my head (MoS and BvS spoilers):

 

 

 

Superman snaps necks and is grumpy about saving people, Batman brands and kills criminals (whilst being plagued by apocalyptic visions) and Superman's best pal Jimmy Olson is murdered at point blank range by mercenaries

 

 

Is pretty grimdark, yeah.

[RubberJohnny]

5 hours ago, Khrushchev said:

I don't really think a term like grimdark would apply to many of these mainstream action blockbuster super-hero films.BvS, Suicide Squad or even the po-faced Batman films may be less campy than most of Marvel's stuff, but they are hardly Blood Meridian or Alien3 are they.

 

I mean "Grimdark" is a thing that Warhammer40k fans think is a genre when it isn't.

 

BvS is a weird film that celebrates cruelty and violence and couldn't be further from its "fun thing for kids" source material.

[ph0rce]

Saw the film on Sunday night; it's stupid, there's way more wrong with it than there is right but it's enjoyable enough all the same.

 

I'd happily watch a Director's Cut ( if they ever make one ) to see what it should have been like, and if there's a sequel then I'll probably see that too.

 

However it's not as good as any of the recent Marvel offerings & as someone posted earlier, the Arrow & Flash TV shows are the best example of the current DC universe, in my opinion.

[Distinct muttering]

I spoke to a girl at the weekend who proclaimed this the greatest movie she had ever seen with no hint of sarcasm. 

[Sabreman]

It might well be. Probably the same situation that puts The Dark Knight at number 4 in the IMDB all-time greatest list.

[glb]

We live in a world where someone out there will count their favourite movie as Norbit. That's both utterly terrifying and completely beautiful.

[Uncle Mike]

I love this new belief that every film ever made has a Director's Cut coming that always somehow turns shit films great.

[Mr Cochese]

Truly spoken like someone who has obviously never seen the Chronicles Of Riddick director's cut.

[Captain Kelsten]

If we lived in a world where every director's cut was akin to the Kingdom of Heaven one in terms of how much it improved a film, well, that'd be a world worth living in.