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The Enfield Haunting


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On Sky Living. First episode was yesterday.

I thought it was very good although.

some of the jump scares are unnecessary and, the 'true story' should be enough horror and it doesn't need ficticious 'happenings' being added to the story

Timothy Spall's in it.

The documentary is quite disturbing viewing. It's on Youtube.

It's three parts and is on On Demand.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/culture/tvandradio/11571607/The-real-story-of-the-Enfield-Haunting.html

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It's very much a ghost story K.

It's not quite a black and white case although, yes, it's very interesting as a true story; something did indeed happen. I'm not sure how certain you can be that it was a complete hoax. It's (so far) not based upon a lot of the events that were documented; there was a lot of dramatic licence at work in the first episode - jump scares and weirdly, an embodied 'ghost'.

A skeptical view with links to loads of weird psychological theories.

http://www.theguardian.com/science/2015/may/01/the-enfield-poltergeist-a-skeptic-speaks

I love this stuff.

I've experienced certain things myself so I'm a bit more open minded to the possibility that this wasn't a hoax.

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I think it's pretty black and white. The girls were caught faking paranormal phenomena; the defence is that they only faked the bits where they were caught faking it, and all the other stuff that happened was real red-hot ghost action, but come on.

"Did you eat that whole packet of hob-nobs?"

"No, it was a ghost."

"I saw you eating a hob-nob."

"I ate THAT one, obviously. But a ghost ate all the others."

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I get your point but they had the police as witnesses and neighbours too. The little girl Janet also had some knowledge of a man named Bill that she couldn't have known.

Rather than derail the thread, I thought the little girl was a very good actress and Timothy Spall's good in everything - he's good in this.

The NEXT section looked a bit 'out there' in the Exorcist mould - I much prefer the creepy plausible ghost stories that could have happened,

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I thought the lack of any ambiguity at all over whether the haunting was real or not was a bit of a mistake- right from the start it sets it's stall out that it's all real (and then gives Spall a totally unambiguous moment where there's no doubt over what he sees)- and pretty soon after it just shows you the ghost- which was an odd choice because the unseen is always going to be more unsettling than someone mugging and pulling 'scary' faces. Maybe it's a more of an issue with the direction- it feels like it could use a lightness of touch which isn't quite there.

I thought the viewfinder bit was really badly done, it could have been weird and creepy- and it was a great idea- but it went full on rubbish with the final shot- reminded me of those old FMV video games like Night Trap or something, ends up looking cheesy- same with the chest of drawer bit.

The only creepy bit was her walking through the house alone- the toilet scene- and again that was ruined a bit by the sledgehammer end to that sequence.

And then the girl says "Oh, I was playing hide and seek in the graveyard and maybe the ghost followed me home from there" which considering the opening shot of her seeing the guy who is the ghost in the graveyard seemed massively on-the-nose in making sure the viewer doesn't have to leave anything to the imagination



There was a weird time jump between the start and Spall showing up where they casually mention that the police have been round and the poltergeist was chucking things at the police woman. It feels like.. hang on, wouldn't that have been a moment worth seeing for the viewer..? I mean, if the show was from Spall's view-point then it'd make sense, but it's not, so I don't know why they decided to fast forward past the bit where a ghost threw things at the police. That seems like a big deal.

That said now the question of whether or not it's real has been well and truly done with, I'm quite looking forward to the batshit crazy stuff they showed in the 'next week' trailer and possibly that's where it'll come into it's own- and maybe some of the plot points that they've hammered home will turn out to be smart red herrings. And the girl is very good, she's probably the best thing about it.

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Seen this pop up on Now TV, quite intrigued by it. The story is also going to be the main plot of The Conjuring 2 (out next year).

Reading up on the actual story, didn't realise it was the inspiration behind BBC's Ghostwatch. Man alive that was a freaky show. Pipes!

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all set against the background of a really grim UK mid-seventies environment

My gf grew up on the next street. She says it was a pretty normal environment. And that she's going to glass you.

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It's very much a ghost story K.

It's not quite a black and white case although, yes, it's very interesting as a true story; something did indeed happen. I'm not sure how certain you can be that it was a complete hoax.

Well, of course it was a hoax. Are you seriously suggesting that there's any possibility it was a 'ghost'?
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My gf grew up on the next street. She says it was a pretty normal environment. And that she's going to glass you.

Everywhere in 1970s Great Britain was grim. Even Prince Charles spent his evenings in beige slacks and a string vest, watching depressing news about strikes on a minuscule TV and drinking weak gassy lager out of a side-handled glass, while the queen cooked tripe in the next room in between power cuts.

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Well, of course it was a hoax. Are you seriously suggesting that there's any possibility it was a 'ghost'?

Yes, it's possible it wasn't a hoax. Again, it's a thread about the TV series and not a LOL YOU BELIEVE IN SOMETHING THAT'S NOT REAL thread.

Part 2 was quite good but it's moving further away from the source. Without spoiling the plot, it's quite a sad narrative for all the characters. It's fairly bleak.

'Janet' is a really great little actress.

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Thoroughly enjoyed this. Didn't know anything about the case so that might have helped. Had a quick look for documentaries about this on YouTube but couldn't see any that looked much cop.

Its pretty notorious among st people who follow this sort of stuff that it was a lot of nonsense and that the girl was making it all up, but she was clever and manipulative to fool the people around her.

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What do you expect when you come out and say you believe in ghosts?

Respect. I'm not mentally ill. It's an interesting case and just because a man writing a book about the paranormal experiences and witnesses something he explains as being paranormal, doesn't mean it isn't. The BBC send war correspondents to report on wars - something happening that seems paranormal would attract that kind of investigator. It might have been a hoax but it might not have been.

I'm just open minded.

I've not watched part 3 yet.

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But the big difference is that wars absolutely exist. There's documented evidence that cannot be disputed.

A war correspondence doesn't cover war with the viewpoint that he's looking to see if wars are a reality or not. He covers them factually. A paranormal investigator's very livelihood is based on a pseudo-science that is mostly dismissed. It's in his or her interest to find 'evidence' to support their personal views and their occupation.

Mind you, I don't have a problem with anyone saying they believe in ghosts or magic or God or anything- I just mean that it's a stretch to compare a paranormal investigator to a war reporter.

Have you heard of Harry Price, the 1920s paranormal investigator? He bequeathed his collection of books and items to Senate House library in London. You have to make an appointment to see items, I did it about a year ago or so, it was fascinating- lot of old books on conjuring and magic, argumentative letters between him and Conan Doyle, paintings of the Golden Dawn and so on.

These are some of the photos I took at the time.

post-9022-0-14117600-1432019652_thumb.jp

post-9022-0-04181400-1432019609_thumb.jp

post-9022-0-49678200-1432019626_thumb.jp

The interesting thing about Price is that although he made his name investigating the paranormal and debunking fraudulent mediums and so on, evidence after he died suggested he might have been behind quite a few of the so-called paranormal incidents he looked into as well.

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That wasn't my point really - war correspondants cover war, Royal ones cover the birth of princesses, sport ones cover rugby matches and paranormal investigation is covered by paranormal investigators. Paranormal doesn't just mean ghosts either, it can just mean something unexplainable - a bit like UFO doesn't mean aliens.

The World's an interesting place and classic science isn't always right.

I'm very biased as I've experienced something identical in my own home. Tapping that moves around from one side of a room to another that stopped when I asked it to. That was in this 'case'.

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I'm not sure what your point is, sorry. The big difference in those four things that three of them are indisputable events, and one of them is very much open to interpretation. I don't think they're really comparable. And for all the books and books on paranormal, there's an amazing lack of real evidence. Especially since video cameras came into play.

It's like Colin Wilson books. Very readable, but he's incredibly accepting of paranormal events without any evidence beyond someone's word- and he has to be because that's what sells the books. It's a world away from actual reporting though.

I don't think I'm even arguing with you :) We're quite possibly talking about different things.

How many times has the tapping happened?

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Yes, I think we are.

Tapping. It happened on and off for a year. Usually when it was quiet - i.e. when I was in bed or reading. My ex-girlfriend was really freaked out by it and didn't like staying at my place. It would emenate from a wall or from the ceiling and if you got close to it, it would move to the other side of the room instantly. It would go on for hours sometimes.

Her (my ex) brother was an electrician and he said it could be electric cables but then, they don't stop ticking if you ask them to stop or bang the wall or go near them.

I thought it was an insect, a beetle but again, beetles can't move that fast.

It wasn't the house settling either or my neighbours as they didn't lve in my attic. We've had mice in the walls scratching and it was a different noise entirely.

We had other stuff 'happen' but that might have been coincidence or my own heightened awareness.

It felt like the tapping was playing with us.

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I liked this. The trouble with ghost movies is usually that you have a sceptical character in a universe where ghosts unambiguously exist, which means either they're the kind of moron you want to reach through the screen and strangle or everything happens when they're tying their shoelaces or something. I appreciated that they went a different way with it by having two "believers" in conflict. Ultimately it's a character drama that happens to have a bunch of spooky stuff as the backdrop.

I could've sworn I saw a glossier dramatisation of this in the past few years - the scene with him doing the tiling was familiar - but I can't for the life of me confirm such a thing existed.

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The interesting thing about Price is that although he made his name investigating the paranormal and debunking fraudulent mediums and so on, evidence after he died suggested he might have been behind quite a few of the so-called paranormal incidents he looked into as well.

What a shocker.

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He also more or less forced his collection on the library according to the guy who took me round the collection. They weren't sure they wanted him, but he was keen to ensure that his name lived on after his death. And it worked.

One of his big cases was Gef the Talking Mongoose. It was a ghost in the form of mongoose, hiding in a wall in a farmhouse that would speak to the people living there.

"I am a freak. I have hands and I have feet, and if you saw me you'd faint, you'd be petrified, mummified, turned into stone or a pillar of salt!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gef

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It was a mouse.

It wasn't.

Mice don't move from the corner of a 20ft room to the opposite side in a single second behind the walls and they don't make the noise that I and a few other people heard.

I'm 99.999999% unconvinced of 'proof' given by the TV ghost hunting programmes but to just discount something that just happened in a normal house to a normal person is narrow minded.

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One of his big cases was Gef the Talking Mongoose. It was a ghost in the form of mongoose, hiding in a wall in a farmhouse that would speak to the people living there.

This could be real as I experienced something similar myself. When I was a child we used to have an ornament in the hallway that used to emit a ringing sound at random times and would on stop if you picked it up. My parents would pick the ornament up and speak to it, and although I couldn't hear a sound coming from the ornament itself , it was like they were having a conversation with it. Once time I got really brace and picked it up and it was my Fathers voice telling me to stop playing silly buggers and go and get Mummy.

But, and this is the thing that freaked me out. My Father wasn't even there. He was at work.

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Mice don't move from the corner of a 20ft room to the opposite side in a single second behind the walls

Have you considered the possibility it was more than one mouse?

I'm 99.999999% unconvinced of 'proof' given by the TV ghost hunting programmes but to just discount something that just happened in a normal house to a normal person is narrow minded.

Mate. Not believing in ghosts and visits from beyond the grave is not narrow minded.

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