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deKay
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The licence fee outdated in terms of consumers choice!? Sky and its massively expensive service that's still includes adverts is the outdated one.

My renewal's coming up and I'm boracic, so I've decided to knock it on the head. But even so, in all other walks of entertainment, being forced to pay a single corporation for access to unrelated others is an outdated model. I haven't watched anything with my Freesat box for around two years. I never mentioned Sky.

Subscribing for live TV content doesn't have a future.

I can't see any other viable future for high-quality programming. Start the ten-year countdown to see who's right...

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I like Nintendo overall, even though I'm not that big of many of their IPs.

When Sega stopped making consoles back when the Dreamcast died I went for a Gamecube as my next choice and thoroughly enjoyed it - it was the perfect step after the fall of the DC (my favourite console). And then I went on to 360 and eventually exclusively PC!

I really wanted to have a Wii U as well as my PC, but I just found the severe lack of third party titles very offputting for someone who predominantly enjoyed those titles on the Gamecube. My top played GC games were Phantasy Star Online, Sonic Heroes and similar.

So, anywho, I hope the NX has enough power (assuming power is what is needed - personally I don't actually care much about graphics) to support third party developers. If so... who knows maybe even I'll pick one up! :)

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So, trying to get my head around this, is NX in fact the new Nintendo operating system which could feasibly span mobile, handheld and console games? With Nintendo launching a new handheld probably followed by a under the TV console? With theoretically the ability to play lowest common denominator games (ie mobile) on all three types of hardware? Ignoring mobile for a minute this could by default make their under the TV console overnight have a far wider range of third party games in that the 3DS (and therefore it's NX replacement?) has always been good at third party, especially Japanese rpgs and the like.

So if nothing else the next Nintendo console could have access to a big library of (perhaps low res) third party (Japanese?) rpgs?

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I just use Now TV. Most of Sky's best content with few or no ads for a fee that makes a normal Sky sub seem like a scam for morons.

Subscribing for live TV content doesn't have a future.

The only reason really now is Sport and other big live events.

Which presumably is the reason BT have very much led with it.

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Nintendo missed a trick in not evolving the Wii beyond being a games device and into being a much more general-purpose set-top box, much like how Apple evolved the iPod beyond a music player. I'd guess it was Nintendo's lack of ambition coupled with Nintendo's weakness in software (not games, but software - something that seems to be common with many big East Asian companies for whatever reason).

Sony and Microsoft committed (and, indeed, over-committed) to the vision of being media consumption devices, but neither became as ubiquitous as the Wii, didn't really have a comfortable input device and neither really encouraged software on their platforms.

Nintendo is now stuck between two diverging markets, struggling to appeal to either tablet/phone gamers or core gamers. It's a real dilemma.

Nintendo did attempt some media stuff, it was just typically a bit of toe in the water attempt. The PS3 was at one point the most popular device to use for Netflix so the consoles must be doing something right when it comes to media consumption.

Why not try saving yourself some time by typing "Nintendo Annual Profit" in Google, then looking at this

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2015-02-04/sony-narrows-annual-loss-forecast-on-image-sensors-playstation

As I said, your numbers are off... (you aren't comparing the same thing), actually reading the reasons for the results would help too. Sony are doing better than Nintendo now. You mentioned Nintendo did 24B JPY last year, Sony's overall number for the same performance metric was 68.5B JPY (largely driven by the outperformance of the gaming division which had an operating profit of double the amount Nintendo managed), the final net loss stems from writedowns on mobile phones. If you really wanted to highlight how much better Nintendo were, you should have picked the net income figure for that year, where currency gains flattered the results by another 17B JPY...

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Another article about the AppleTV, this time from an actual impartial professional news website, the first quote sounds eerily reminiscent of something else which relied on a motion controller, that analyst must have been living under a rock since 2005 to come out with that one ;)

I think Apple’s going to create a big new category in gaming, one that others have tried and failed to create before,” said Jan Dawson, chief analyst at the technology research firm Jackdaw Research. “What the Apple TV has the potential to do is to bring casual gaming to the living room and make it a much more social activity.

Most game executives and analysts see little chance that Apple will be able to woo hard-core fans of the leading high-end game consoles, the Xbox One from Microsoft and the PlayStation 4 from Sony — both of which will most likely still have better graphics than the new Apple TV. Gamers who fancy big-budget games like Call of Duty and Destiny will probably not be easily persuaded to switch systems.

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/09/07/technology/personaltech/new-apple-tv-is-said-to-focus-on-games-challenging-traditional-consoles.html?_r=0

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I really wanted to have a Wii U as well as my PC, but I just found the severe lack of third party titles very offputting for someone who predominantly enjoyed those titles on the Gamecube. My top played GC games were Phantasy Star Online, Sonic Heroes and similar.

So, anywho, I hope the NX has enough power (assuming power is what is needed - personally I don't actually care much about graphics) to support third party developers. If so... who knows maybe even I'll pick one up! :)

There's a divide-and-conquer mentality among a lot of console gamers, with yer sizbiz shootmans on one side and cutesies on the other, and never the twain. The SNES pretty much had it all, and it was an amazing console for that.

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It still aggravates me to no end that there are so many people who automatically think Nintendo games are for 'kidz' because there are no gruff marines and shooting people in the face

But then GamerGate happened and it made me realise that loads of gamers are clearly fucking stupid in more ways than one.

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It still aggravates me to no end that there are so many people who automatically think Nintendo games are for 'kidz' because there are no gruff marines and shooting people in the face

They don't exactly go out of their way to dispel that image with their marketing or game output though, do they?

Even when they make an online shooter, they dress it in cartoon clothing, or in the case of Metroid, chibi it. What game did Nintendo decide to spend serious money on obtaining exclusivity for the Wii U launch?

LEGO City Undercover, which was originally going to be a PS3/X360 game. They focus on kids and families as their primary target market, expecting people to ignore that fact and think they make games for the sort of customers targeted by the typical PC/PS/Xbox game is a bit too hopeful in the face of reality.

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Yeah, there's absolutely nothing wrong with making games that are family oriented, but there's no point pretending that they don't do it.

Of course, choosing to ignore their output because "it's for kids" is about as sensible as avoiding Pixar's output for the same reasons; i.e. pretty bloody stupid: the fact that there are companies dedicated to putting out high-quality, family-friendly games and films is something to be celebrated, not criticised!

Except when it means turning Metroid into cutesy multiplayer bollocks :angry:

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Well yeah, OK but I'd argue that they are aimed at 'family audiences' rather than just kids, much like Pixar movies are - technically 'for kids' but with stuff that the grown ups will appreciate. I'd be surprised if there are many under 10's which got all the stars in Mario 3D world or what have you.

Either way, it's a shame that loads of people wouldn't even buy them because of that blinkered view but again, it doesn't surprise me as a chap I used to work for refused to watch any animated movies because 'they were for kids' which is that same idiotic mind set.

EDIT: Or liek wat Wiper sed :P

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The vast majority 1 of the console 2 industry used to be openly for kids though, lots of making Saturday morning cartoon mascots for under-10s in the SNES era, moving away from that in PS1 and especially PS2.

As it went through an age transition, Naughty Dog abandoned that market, and Rare and Sega had a really difficult time, deciding that they needed to have their animal mascot get drunk and swear with blood and tits or give them a gun and have them assassinate the President, with the result of making bad games that appealed to no-one.

I'd say by sticking to the same quality games they'd always made Nintendo dealt with the transition better than most.

Honestly, it's not like Nintendo fans are immune for hating on kids stuff, the Donkey Kong games got some shit because despite being good platformers they're Saturday morning cartoon mascots instead of cool scifi bounty hunters, and it was interesting to see many Nintendo fans complain of the kid-appeal of Splatoon - perhaps they noticed it more because it didn't have any nostalgia to tint those goggles?

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The whole industry used to be openly for kids though, lots of making Saturday morning cartoon mascots for under-10s in the SNES era, moving away from that in PS1 and especially PS2.

As it went through an age transition, Naughty Dog abandoned that market, and Rare and Sega had a really difficult time, deciding that they needed to have their Saturday cartoon mascot get drunk and swear with blood and tits or give them a gun and have them assassinate the President, with the result of making bad games that appealed to no-one.

I'd say by sticking to the same quality games they'd always made Nintendo dealt with the transition better than most.

Honestly, it's not like Nintendo fans are immune for hating on kids stuff, the Donkey Kong games got some shit because despite being good platformers they're Saturday morning cartoon mascots instead of cool scifi bounty hunters, and it was interesting to see many Nintendo fans complain of the kid-appeal of Splatoon - perhaps they noticed it more because it didn't have any nostalgia to tint those goggles?

Thing is most of the consoles then were considered kids games. The graphics were usually cartoon like (mostly down to the hardware capabilities) and whilst there were some games that were aimed at adults, they where niche.

I think due to 3d graphics, the newer consoles were taken a bit more serious. They appealed more to adults and well, adults have more cash to spend than kids.

Mario still does well as the games are mostly always enjoyable and have a lot of nostalogia attached to them. I honestly feel as well that having Mario as a human isn't as bad as an adult playing sonic games. I think if Mario was an animal mascot he wouldn't be doing anywhere near as well.

What's weird is there seems to be about 10% of games aimed at kids nowadays , especially from the ps3 and xbox 360 era. The rest seem to be aimed at adults and teens.

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Kids are on tablets. It's not about the rights and wrongs, just that Nintendo don't reach as far into the others' territory as they could, and vice versa. So lots of people buy two consoles, because they can't get all of their favourites on one.

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Er, there were a huge amount of games aimed at an older (or at least more 'serious') demographic during the 8-bit and 16-bit generations. It wasn't all mascot platformers. Games like Elite, Mercenary, Stunt Car Racer, Zork, the Lucasfilm games, text adventures, war strategy games, Lords of Midnight, Tir Na Nog, Beneath a Steel Sky etc etc. I think some of you have fallen into the 'everything was NES' trap.

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But back then games had barely evolved beyond hobbyist level. I doubt demographic was even a word.

It wasn't until 32bit consoles where Sony started targeting young adults rather than the traditional kids market. Like Mushashi says Nintendo stayed where they were in terms of image and content, only really broadening it during the 'touch generations' phase with the original DS and Wii. Recently they seem to have fallen back just to targeting kids again. I don't see those family adverts anymore.

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Yeah, but we're talking about Nintendo and that means talking about their consoles, which did start off explicitly as a kids present with the NES.

What PCs and minicomputers were doing during the same time is irrelevant to the conversation about Nintendos family friendliness.

Oh ok.

The whole industry used to be openly for kids though

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Ok I added "console" to the original post for the pedants.

But back then games had barely evolved beyond hobbyist level. I doubt demographic was even a word.

Pac Man pulled in a billion dollars, if you don't think people were doing basic market analysis on something like that I don't know what to tell you.

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Ok I added "console" to the original post for the pedants.

Pac Man pulled in a billion dollars, if you don't think people were doing basic market analysis on something like that I don't know what to tell you.

Were you literally laughing?! I don't think a group of MIT students who wrote Zork were considering their 'market'.

You knew what I was talking about.

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Who mentioned laughing? I mean people do business analysis when opening a cafe, it's not exactly an expensive or complex thing.

I'm sure there were a few solo creators who got lucky, just as there are today, and far, far more who didn't, but even the old publishers looked at what was selling and what they had that was similar with basic expectations for sales.

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