Star Wars: The Last Jedi

[Wroth]

I figured the third lesson was

Spoiler

The allure of the dark side. After Rei went for it without hesitation he abandoned teaching her out of fear of creating another Kylo.

 

[buizel]

5 hours ago, The Hierophant said:

 

  This is nuts. 

 

Jar Jar has to be the worst thing about any Star Wars film. 

 

Jar Jar is the unfortunate scapegoat of the prequels. The main problem with those films was basically everything except plot, it was an interesting plot (or it couldve been) but executed so so poorly (so was writing, most of the acting, cinematography, and like everything). I think Jar Jar is honestly fine, prettty entertaining and totally quotable (how wuude) and basically non-existant in Ep2/3.

 

The BEST thing to come out of the prequels is the Phantom Menace Making-Of, it plays out like an episode of The Office it's just so so bizzare. Under Disney and the iron-fist of Kathleen Kennedy we won't see 'raw' Making-Of's again.

 

 

 

[Wroth]

Ah ok, my memory of the film is hazy. I thought he basically stopped teaching her after that and that's why

Spoiler

she started talking to Kylo more and finally investigating that sith butthole by herself.

 

Maybe that was the second lesson then, did he verbally number them? It just seems like

Spoiler

teaching Rei about the dark side would be a pretty important lesson since his goal was to ensure he didn't create another Kylo

 

[Darren]

Yes he did explicitly number them, which is why we noticed there was no lesson 3.

 

Of course in the next film he could always do a ROTJ Yoda and tell her she's already learned lesson 3 by

rejecting Kylo

and so "your training is complete." And then further echo Yoda by telling her she must

face Kylo again, and kill him, and she can insist there's still good in him etc. etc.

 

Basically I am coming to the conclusion that Ep IX is going to "rhyme" with ROTJ, especially with JJ back in the driving seat.

 

The finale will feature force ghosts of Yoda, Obi-Wan (McGregor),

Luke, and Kylo/Ben after he's sacrificed himself saving Rey.

[K]

The finale should have the force ghosts of

Qui-Gon Jinn, Yoda, Obi-Wan, Anakin, Luke, Han, Leia, Kylo Renn, Admiral Ackbar, C-3PO, Jar Jar Binks, Lando Calrissian's bald white slave, and a handful of ewoks, all doing a Mexican wave in the background of the shot where Poe Dameron is beaten round the head with a stick by a woman for bollocksing up another vitally important mission through his own idiocy.

[ZOK]

This is the only Lesson One I’m interested in:

 

Spoiler

 

 

[Sardan]

3 hours ago, buizel said:

 

Jar Jar is the unfortunate scapegoat of the prequels. The main problem with those films was basically everything except plot, it was an interesting plot (or it couldve been) but executed so so poorly (so was writing, most of the acting, cinematography, and like everything). I think Jar Jar is honestly fine, prettty entertaining and totally quotable (how wuude) and basically non-existant in Ep2/3.

 

 

The prequels were terrible as was Jar Jar. The fact he isn't in 2 and 3 is probably because they released how awful he was. 

 

Hes far far far worse than Rose. 

[SeanR]

3 minutes ago, The Hierophant said:

 

 

The prequels were terrible as was Jar Jar. The fact he isn't in 2 and 3 is probably because they released how awful he was. 

 

Hes far far far worse than Rose. 

 

he was in 2, and, oyster valorium, and proposed special executive powers for chancellor trumpatine during the crisis, leading to the formation of a grand army, to fuck over the seperatists. 

 

remember? Or was that 3?

[buizel]

6 minutes ago, The Hierophant said:

 

 

The prequels were terrible as was Jar Jar. The fact he isn't in 2 and 3 is probably because they released how awful he was. 

 

Hes far far far worse than Rose. 

 

Not sure I could make any sort of relevant comparison between Rose and Jar Jar - I mean as bad as points were in TLJ, nothing really compares to the atrocities of the prequels. Though I enjoy the prequels (to a degree) even though theyre terrible shlock.

 

3 minutes ago, SeanR said:

 

he was in 2, and, oyster valorium, and proposed special executive powers for chancellor trumpatine during the crisis, leading to the formation of a grand army, to fuck over the seperatists. 

 

remember? Or was that 3?

 

I can't remember much of jar jar in episode 2 because I really try to avoid that film, worst of the prequels by far. It was episode 3 I think where he gave the chancellor powers. Maybe your right actually, the only jar jar i remember in episode 3 is when he's walking in the parade, celebrating padmes death.

[Jammy]

Episode 2 was when Palpatine manipulates Jar Jar in pure panto fashion by discussing how he could get his emergency powers and lamenting that Padmé wasn’t there because she would definitely propose it.

[SeanR]

 

PALPATINE

But what senator would have the courage to propose such a radical amendment?

BLUEHORN GEEZER

If only... Senator Amidala were here.

PALPATINE

Mmm.

BOTH TURN TO CAMERA AND RAISE A EYEBROW

[Tourist]

All this talk of Rose reminds me of the fucking awful bit at the end where

Spoiler

she crashes into Finn to prevent him from sacrificing himself to save everyone so that she can sacrifice herself (and, in any rational universe, Finn too) to not save anyone. So that she can tell him 'love not hate'. 

 

So, so, stupid. 

[Sardan]

12 hours ago, buizel said:

 

Not sure I could make any sort of relevant comparison between Rose and Jar Jar - I mean as bad as points were in TLJ, nothing really compares to the atrocities of the prequels. Though I enjoy the prequels (to a degree) even though theyre terrible shlock.

 

 

Thats exactly my point.  (Apart from your last sentence.)

 

 

 

[MDY]

6 hours ago, Tourist said:

All this talk of Rose reminds me of the fucking awful bit at the end where

  Hide contents

she crashes into Finn to prevent him from sacrificing himself to save everyone so that she can sacrifice herself (and, in any rational universe, Finn too) to not save anyone. So that she can tell him 'love not hate'. 

 

So, so, stupid. 

 

 

Spoiler

I think that could have worked.. but Poe should had been the one to stop Finn. He'd been too willing to let people throw their lives away (to little end) all film - his friend being about to do the same would have been a logical point for him to realise he couldn't keep doing that..

 

[buizel]

11 hours ago, SeanR said:

 

PALPATINE

But what senator would have the courage to propose such a radical amendment?

BLUEHORN GEEZER

If only... Senator Amidala were here.

PALPATINE

Mmm.

BOTH TURN TO CAMERA AND RAISE A EYEBROW

 

Lol I love that bit, when Palpatine goes Mmmm and thats the end of the scene. I saw this recently and said aloud 'what'

[SeanR]

8 minutes ago, MDY said:

 

 

  Reveal hidden contents

I think that could have worked.. but Poe should had been the one to stop Finn. He'd been too willing to let people throw their lives away (to little end) all film - his friend being about to do the same would have been a logical point for him to realise he couldn't keep doing that..

 

 

[Darren]

3 minutes ago, buizel said:

 

Lol I love that bit, when Palpatine goes Mmmm and thats the end of the scene. I saw this recently and said aloud 'what'

 

Unless I'm remembering it wrong (and I might well be) I'm sure the end of that scene is a shot of Jar Jar, who this conversation was aimed at of course, having a Les McQueen-style “Eeehh...” moment of realisation as the penny drops that - yes! - HE is there on behalf of Padme and so he should be the one to bravely propose this motion. We should just be grateful George resisted the temptation to have a lightbulb come on over his head.

[Boothjan]

6 hours ago, Tourist said:

All this talk of Rose reminds me of the fucking awful bit at the end where

  Reveal hidden contents

she crashes into Finn to prevent him from sacrificing himself to save everyone so that she can sacrifice herself (and, in any rational universe, Finn too) to not save anyone. So that she can tell him 'love not hate'. 

 

So, so, stupid. 

 

But isn't that the whole underlying message of the film for The Resistance?  That they have to survive to spread the word?  That senseless sacrifice isn't the way?

 

We're clearly never going to agree on this film but of all the things to pick up on, I found this a bit odd!  (Not quite as odd as comparing Rose to Jar Jar fucking Binks mind you )

[K]

Yeah, I read that bit as her

preventing him from making a futile sacrifice, not preventing him from destroying the thing and saving everyone.

[Treble]

I'm amazed anyone chooses to make these things, now. It's like the most poisonous of poisoned chalices. If I was asked to direct, I'd laugh and run away. If Ii capitulated and said yes, I'd immediately hide afterwards, to escape the fanboys. You'd find me looking disastrously unkempt on some deserted Irish island somewhere. You know, like this guy:

 

 

 

 

[Darren]

Or this guy?

 

 

Is that what really really happened? “I tried to make a decent Star Wars film but the manbaby fanboys just wouldn’t stop whining. I came here because it’s the only place in the galaxy with no wifi.”

[Treble]

37 minutes ago, Darren said:

Or this guy?

 

mcbain.gif

[Tourist]

1 hour ago, K said:

Yeah, I read that bit as her

  Hide contents

preventing him from making a futile sacrifice, not preventing him from destroying the thing and saving everyone.

 

 

Spoiler

But the obvious, obvious outcome of her taking him out in front of a big long line of big heavy things shooting a ton of stuff at them is that the two of them are going to die without saving anyone. The only reason FIn survives is because by this point in the film the director has abandoned any nod towards logic or reason.

 

I don't mind that theme or (gasp!) women or anything. It's just really poorly implemented/executed. Mostly, it seems to me to be yet another example of fake peril in a bid to insert another fake crescendo to whizz the plot along with such speed and schmalz that the audience doesn't notice the gaping plot holes.

 

Well not this audience member, buddy. I'm on to you Johnson. I know your game.

 

[K]

26 minutes ago, Tourist said:

 

  Hide contents

But the obvious, obvious outcome of her taking him out in front of a big long line of big heavy things shooting a ton of stuff at them is that the two of them are going to die without saving anyone. The only reason FIn survives is because by this point in the film the director has abandoned any nod towards logic or reason.

 

I don't mind that theme or (gasp!) women or anything. It's just really poorly implemented/executed. Mostly, it seems to me to be yet another example of fake peril in a bid to insert another fake crescendo to whizz the plot along with such speed and schmalz that the audience doesn't notice the gaping plot holes.

 

Well not this audience member, buddy. I'm on to you Johnson. I know your game.

 

 

 

I'll be honest, I saw that as absolutely real peril. The film had subverted my expectations so many times by that point that I genuinely thought they could kill Finn off, so I was on the edge of my seat. I saw her sacrifice at the end as risking both their lives for a chance of them both surviving, as opposed to Finn absolutely, definitely dying by kamikaziing his rickety space lawnmower straight down the barrel of the massive gun thing for no apparent gain.

 

 

It does strain credibility that they'd make it back after crashing directly in front of the invading imperial forces, but I'm happy to let that slide as I was so into the buildup, and was so relieved when Finn survived. 

 

[Kevvy Metal]

1 hour ago, Treble said:

I'm amazed anyone chooses to make these things, now. It's like the most poisonous of poisoned chalices. If I was asked to direct, I'd laugh and run away. If Ii capitulated and said yes, I'd immediately hide afterwards, to escape the fanboys. You'd find me looking disastrously unkempt on some deserted Irish island somewhere. You know, like this guy:

 

  Reveal hidden contents

 

 

 

I recently went on a full on Lord of the Rings Extended Edition marathon over the Xmas holidays. Something that was - annoyingly - in the back of my mind while watching it, was that if these films were released now-a-days, they just would not survive the pedantic-flaw-nit-picking-police.

They'd be unfairly torn to shreds for the tiniest things that didn't matter while the over-all themes of the film were completely missed. 

[Boothjan]

3 minutes ago, Kevvy Metal said:

 

I recently went on a full on Lord of the Rings Extended Edition marathon over the Xmas holidays. Something that was - annoyingly - in the back of my mind while watching it, was that if these films were released now-a-days, they just would not survive the pedantic-flaw-nit-picking-police.

They'd be unfairly torn to shreds for the tiniest things that didn't matter while the over-all themes of the film were completely missed. 

 

I think that'd be the case with the Original Star Wars Trilogy TBH. 

[Kevvy Metal]

1 minute ago, Boothjan said:

 

I think that'd be the case with the Original Star Wars Trilogy TBH. 

 

...or literally absolutely anything. 

[Boothjan]

Just now, Kevvy Metal said:

 

...or literally absolutely anything. 

 

Except Transformers the Movie, obviously. 

[Kevvy Metal]

2 minutes ago, Boothjan said:

 

Except Transformers the Movie, obviously. 

 

If that's the 1987 film you're referring to then, yes! It's an absolute masterpiece. 

The finest film Orson Wells was ever involved in. 

[Mr Cochese]

31 minutes ago, Kevvy Metal said:

 

I recently went on a full on Lord of the Rings Extended Edition marathon over the Xmas holidays. Something that was - annoyingly - in the back of my mind while watching it, was that if these films were released now-a-days, they just would not survive the pedantic-flaw-nit-picking-police.

They'd be unfairly torn to shreds for the tiniest things that didn't matter while the over-all themes of the film were completely missed. 

I watch the extended editions every December during the lead up to Christmas, and it really pisses me off every single time when the Rohirrim completely fuck up their tactical advantage on the battlefield by choosing to charge headlong at the oliphaunts in a massive line. I may only ever have played Command & Conquer and read Sun Tzu, but I know to divide my forces and encircle in that situation. King Bernard is such a dick.