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31 minutes ago, simms said:

 

PSVR shows there is a market for VR.  Enthusiasts like us would lap up things like Elite & Forza 7 in VR which I assure you are not experiences as you put it.   I'm sure there is not a mass market for the Xbox X itself, the £150 elite pad or expensive steering wheels but the is a market for them.  What have you played in VR?

I'm not so sure about that. They've sold a million headsets? Kinect sold 17 million units before the world gave the collective shrug.

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8 minutes ago, ashmatuk said:

I would like xbox to have a VR headset when it's ready.

 

Another feature that Sony offer that ms don't. What are these other features? Non cross network play for the safety of our children. No backwards compatability as no one plays it. No ea access. Thanks Sony! 

 

I'm no console warrior. It's easy to see that VR isn't resonating. 

 

You'd like VR when Phil tells you it's ready. It's akin to Sony dropping rumble from their pads back in day and claiming it was a last gen feature. 

 

VR is in the early stages of development, but it's there and it's affordable

 

The other features Sony offer are games. I'm no console warrior either, Nintendo pisses on them both from a great height right now, but currently MS' first party output is disappointing to say the least. Offering me a load of old Xbox games just doesn't make up for that I'm afraid. 

 

Grabbed by the Ghoulies vs Resi 7 VR, anyone?

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14 minutes ago, ashmatuk said:

 

I agree VR is a great experience but it's lacking software. Look at E3, what's coming? Final fantasy fishing and some warping Doom mini game. 

 

Developers are not bringing full games to it as there isn't the market. Fallout being the exception. 

 

Nice way of trying to sway the argument by picking arguably the two worst VR examples from E3 ;) 

 

I do not think VR will ever overcome the issue of not being suitable for long play sessions (Resi 7 achieved it but only due to having to take regular breaks to to high stress levels) but that's not to say it's a non starter. There is no reason they can't continue to focus on shorter/arcade experiences and the likes of Farpoint and Superhot prove that the FPS genre is on the brink of being VR ready.. this without a doubt will be the game changer for VR.

 

 

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Just now, ashmatuk said:

I'm not trying to sway any argument. Those are the only Vr games I heard mentioned on a podcast. 

 

I would love VR to be a success of course I would.  I didn't say it's a non starter, just that the mass market don't care about it yet. 

 

Have you tried VR?

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2 minutes ago, ashmatuk said:

I'm not trying to sway any argument. Those are the only Vr games I heard mentioned on a podcast. 

 

I would love VR to be a success of course I would.  I didn't say it's a non starter, just that the mass market don't care about it yet. 

There were lots of games shown at E3, and there's loads of VR stuff in development generally.

 

The mass market doesn't need to embrace it fully right now for it to be exciting.

 

I was really looking forward to MS' plans for VR, because let's not ignore they announced Scorpio/X support for it during last year's E3. 

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All I'm hearing is it's not mass market, no compelling games.  I'm telling you VR is absolutely ready for us enthusiast gamers.  There are games available now that are massively elevated by the use of VR in particular any cockpit type games, but there all other genres are accounted for.  

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Ill spell it out for you. I was not saying They should not release a VR headset.

 

I like the Vr stuff I have played. There is potential there.

 

I also understand why MS have not yet revealed a VR headset, in my opinion they should wait for wireless headsets and to make it as attractive as possible to get the massmarket interested leading to more games being developed.

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42 minutes ago, ashmatuk said:

 

I agree VR is a great experience but it's lacking software. Look at E3, what's coming? Final fantasy fishing and some warping Doom mini game. 

 

Developers are not bringing full games to it as there isn't the market. Fallout being the exception. 

 

Very reductionist to say Doom VFR is a mini game.  It is fully fledged VR Doom but with the warp mechanics intergrated into the gameplay to keep the frantic pace of Doom 2016.  Granted lots of developers are not wanting to take a risk on Vr but to say there are no full games is untrue.

 

32 minutes ago, SweatyTravolta said:

I'm not so sure about that. They've sold a million headsets? Kinect sold 17 million units before the world gave the collective shrug.

 

Dont put Kinect and VR into the same sentence ever again.  Next thing you'll be saying VR is the same as 3D TV's.

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16 minutes ago, ashmatuk said:

Ill spell it out for you. I was not saying They should not release a VR headset.

 

I like the Vr stuff I have played. There is potential there.

 

I also understand why MS have not yet revealed a VR headset, in my opinion they should wait for wireless headsets and to make it as attractive as possible to get the massmarket interested leading to more games being developed.

Why not just offer support for Oculus Rift, as was expected? 

 

The games are already being developed. VR brings new experiences and new types of games, not everything has to be expensive AAA sluggathons. 

 

Perhaps we should have waited for wireless pads before making consoles at all. Or telephones.

 

The point of Xbox X, to me, was that it was supposed to be a premium console offering support for high end features such as 4K HDR, and VR. They fell short of their promise.

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7 minutes ago, ashmatuk said:

Ill spell it out for you. I was not saying They should not release a VR headset.

 

I like the Vr stuff I have played. There is potential there.

 

I also understand why MS have not yet revealed a VR headset, in my opinion they should wait for wireless headsets and to make it as attractive as possible to get the massmarket interested leading to more games being developed.

 

And all I was saying it's disappointing that they are going to wait potentially years to get in on VR when they have the hardware to power it with a their flagship racing game which would of wowed everyone.  Gran Turismo is potentially going to steal the limelight in the regard (if it is being made to support VR). I'm a VR evangelist and I love people's reactions to trying it for the first time.  Wireless Vr is potentially years away from being able to reliably ready for the console space.

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I don't see why they'd support the Rift on the Xbox if they are partnering with companies like Acer and Dell to release VR headsets on the PC this winter. I think they'll eventually add support for those headsets and controllers to the Xboxone X. 

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Not convinced that releasing a £450 console and a £400 VR headset that only works with that console is a good idea.

its not as though the original bone will be able to do it, so you'd be selling an install base of about four people to developers.

 

Same applies for Rift support, except those people already have the PC. I can't think of anything that'd make me disconnect it from the Pc, take it downstairs, set it up again, then play VR on console when I have a perfectly good PC for doing that upstairs.

 

much more sensible to wait until next year when there's a chance at an install base, and not worry about the competition: the original bone means they don't have a choice.

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None of this really matters. In twenty years we'll all be putting on our VR onesies that provides an all-over-body immersion experience, spend hours on end waving, gyrating and dry humping our way through our favourite games, then at the end of the day logging onto Rllmuk to argue the toss that Sony has better groinal attachments than MS. 

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58 minutes ago, simms said:

 

And all I was saying it's disappointing that they are going to wait potentially years to get in on VR when they have the hardware to power it with a their flagship racing game which would of wowed everyone.  Gran Turismo is potentially going to steal the limelight in the regard (if it is being made to support VR). I'm a VR evangelist and I love people's reactions to trying it for the first time.  Wireless Vr is potentially years away from being able to reliably ready for the console space.

 

Project Cars 2 will be better in VR (because it runs on PC, and it's their second go at it) than GT. Calling it now...

 

You'll just need £££££

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2 minutes ago, PeteBrant said:

GT is going to have a separate VR mode to the main game , so the whole thing won't be playable in VR anyway. Which is terrible news .

 

It isn't. It means that the main game isn't compromised by the need to render the same assets at twice the speed and resolution.

 

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13 hours ago, Fully Aspel said:

But how the fuck would improved framerates and shit even work, especially factoring in online play? Are we talking about possibly having people racing in 60fps against others in 30fps? Hahaha. Some people having slowdown in the middle of a match, whilst others have things run flawlessly? JaJaJaJa. :) Have they actually even thought all this shit through properly or what? 

 

Guessing you've never played online on a PC. Gamers have different resolutions, different frame rates, different graphics settings, different control systems, and guess what. It works absolutely fine.

 

I can play Forza Horizon 3 on my PC at 1080p 60FPS, while my mate plays it at 1080p 30FPS, while another plays at 4k 30FPS and then @PC Master Race comes along with his beast and joins us at 4k 60FPS. Yet it works fine! Imagine that eh?

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20 minutes ago, footle said:

Not convinced that releasing a £450 console and a £400 VR headset that only works with that console is a good idea.

its not as though the original bone will be able to do it, so you'd be selling an install base of about four people to developers.

 

Same applies for Rift support, except those people already have the PC. I can't think of anything that'd make me disconnect it from the Pc, take it downstairs, set it up again, then play VR on console when I have a perfectly good PC for doing that upstairs.

 

much more sensible to wait until next year when there's a chance at an install base, and not worry about the competition: the original bone means they don't have a choice.

 

Good point.  Sony is hamstrung in the same way I guess as they'd probably have Elite in VR on the pro.

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6 minutes ago, footle said:

 

It isn't. It means that the main game isn't compromised by the need to render the same assets at twice the speed and resolution.

 

i guess. I just think once you play in VR with a wheel , playing on a 2d screen feels somewhat lacking .

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8 minutes ago, PeteBrant said:

i guess. I just think once you play in VR with a wheel , playing on a 2d screen feels somewhat lacking .

 

Project Cars 1 with my G29 Logitech wheel and VR was my first car racing experience in VR which was incredible.  It would of been amazing to play Forza 7 in VR.  Hoping MS support win 10 versions in VR :P

 

Going back to 2D racing feels flat.

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1 hour ago, footle said:

Not convinced that releasing a £450 console and a £400 VR headset that only works with that console is a good idea.

its not as though the original bone will be able to do it, so you'd be selling an install base of about four people to developers.

 

Same applies for Rift support, except those people already have the PC. I can't think of anything that'd make me disconnect it from the Pc, take it downstairs, set it up again, then play VR on console when I have a perfectly good PC for doing that upstairs.

 

much more sensible to wait until next year when there's a chance at an install base, and not worry about the competition: the original bone means they don't have a choice.

I think this is a problem facing Xbox X anyway. What's the point in spending £450 on a machine which is more restricted than a PC, and has no exclusive games? Might as well put the money towards a PC which offers a much bigger library of games including Xbox One titles. And it has VR support. 

 

I do think it would have been great if it offered Rift support from the off with the promise of a cheaper more integrated headset some time down the line. 

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11 minutes ago, Stanley said:

I think this is a problem facing Xbox X anyway. What's the point in spending £450 on a machine which is more restricted than a PC, and has no exclusive games? Might as well put the money towards a PC which offers a much bigger library of games including Xbox One titles. And it has VR support. 

 

I do think it would have been great if it offered Rift support from the off with the promise of a cheaper more integrated headset some time down the line. 

 

It's small.

It'll sit neatly under a TV.

It's currently, and for the foreseeable future, far more powerful than a "much more capable" PC at anywhere near the same price point. Particularly given that for any given game it's far more likely to be optimised for the xbox1x specs than a particular combination of cpu, motherboard, graphics card and mass storage system.

 

I mean, the argument you're giving can be applied to any games console. Why buy one rather than a PC that'll be a bit more expensive for the same functionality and a bit more powerful?

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2 hours ago, Stanley said:

The point is that you can play Xbox One games on a PC. You couldn't apply that argument to, say, PS4.

 

You can't play all Xbox One games on the PC though :unsure: I'd be giving up on my Halo 5 buddies! 

 

It's a strange situation. Offer me a gaming PC that can achieve everything the Xbox One X can for similar price and I'd decline. I guess I'm just not interested in buying a PC. 

 

It is fantastic that Xbox and Windows are effectively the same for more games going forward. Choice is a good thing :)

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If given the choice between a PC or an Xbox at £450 with similar levels of performance I'd go for the Xbox. 

 

I find PC gaming more trouble than it's worth these days. There seem to be just as many bad PC ports as console ports and in my case if I want to play games on my TV, I've got to boot up windows, launch steam, roll out the HDMI. Too much hassle. 

 

The big advantage of PC is you can run things at whatever framerate you want so you're not stuck with 30 fps if that's what the developer wants but I'm honestly too lazy to care these days. I just want to boot a console and play.

 

That's a complete u-turn for me over how I used to feel. But the market has changed a fair bit, too - I built my PC in 2012 and the upgrade from a 360 in games like Far Cry 3 was enormous. With these new consoles that's sort of been turned on its head.

 

 

Edit: Another thing to consider when saying the Xbox no longer has any exclusives is performance. Until recently, Forza Horizon 3 performed really erratically on most enthusiast tier PCs, Halo 5 is all over the place for me, etc and so the Xbox One was still my preferred place to play them. Horizon has been fixed, thankfully (and is incredible at 60fps) but how things will be going forward isn't clear. I'm hoping Crackdown 3 runs well. 

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1 hour ago, Wallace said:

It is fantastic that Xbox and Windows are effectively the same for more games going forward. Choice is a good thing :)

 

It also plays into the whole crossplay thing about expanding the playerbase for faster and more skill accurate matchmaking which we have seen in a limited fashion in Gears4, moreso in RL and I suspect will very much feature in Forza7. Stanley appears to be on a mission to tell everybody in as many ways as possible not to buy the X. I'm not really sure why we are meant to be upset that PC gamers get to play Xbox games? Why is that a problem? He is making out it is but doesn't seem to grasp the fact we don't all want to play on PC never mind the fact that if we do the games and all progress transfer across seamlessly.

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