Slay the Spire - Roguelike Card-em-up

[Lovelyman]

Any good beginners instructional videos out there to explain the systems and stuff?

 

I'm not after a building guide, just what all the stuff does and how to think about it. 

[imp]

12 minutes ago, bradigor said:

Fair enough. Seeing @Zael videos before, I have been eager to add it (not building around getting it though, that'd be dumb). My last run above ended in abject failure in the 3rd act, after making mistakes. I also think I am too scared to just say 'no' to card pickups. 

 

I keep getting the card that deals bonus damage for each 'Strike' card you have, which means i am wary or getting rid of them. Yet I know I need to ditch some cards, as having 40+ in the deck measn you a hoping for cards to come in your hand at the right tine, rather than strategising around it. 

 

In act 3 you really need to be selective with your picks to make sure you’re not just bloating your deck. In my experience, if you make it to act 3, there’s already a pretty good chance your deck is strong enough to win already, and it’s more a case of maybe rounding out a couple of elements and shoring up your weaknesses. 

 

Case in point I had an event I’d never seen before earlier today, in which the game asks if you want to be skipped to the act 3 boss. At first I thought that would be crazy, I was literally only half way through, and was planning on going to the shop and fighting at least one more elite. But looking at my deck and relics I realised the only cards I would take at that point were luxuries as my base deck was already solid, so I might as well just have a crack, and it paid off! 

[bradigor]

Yeah, I definitely bloat my deck by the end. 

[strawdonkey]

Just lost a run by skipping through two turns in a row by pressing Y to view what an upgraded card looks like.

 

Very smart. Was a really good Ironclad block deck too.

[JLM]

My special move is to discard fight-saving potions instead of drinking them. I'm really good at it.

[Nobuo's Organ]

I'm forever hitting Y by mistake and skipping a turn, wish there was a setting to ask for confirmation if you do that with full energy. At least you can save and quit when that happens to restart the fight.

[Paulando]

3 hours ago, Horribleman said:

Any good beginners instructional videos out there to explain the systems and stuff?

 

I'm not after a building guide, just what all the stuff does and how to think about it. 

 

With these kind of games, I find the best way to learn is from your own mistakes. Just play it, fuck it up, and you’ll learn everything gradually. It’s all about discovery for me, and finding things out yourself is the best part.

 

This is a really good video to give you an idea of what’s possible though:

 

 

[Paulando]

I also picked this up on Switch and it’s got its teeth in me! Played for a few hours already. Messed up my run with the third character, which seemed a bit rubbish, but I’m sure I could get a lot more out of it (focus more on blocks and rely upon the orbs for damage perhaps?).

 

It’s similar to Meteorfall on iOS, which I loved, but it was a bit too simplistic and easy after a while. This seems to have a lot more depth, and I can see myself playing it over and over like I did with Into the Breach.

[JLM]

I'd say The Defect takes the longest to learn but has the deepest well of sheer madness available to him. The orbs can be your damage, they can be your block, they can be an energy source, they can be cashed in to generate focus, whatever you want them to do really. But then he's got energy generation, artifact shenanigans, card draw, healing, buffers that negate damage entirely, he's arguably the best user of Powers in the game overall, some of the most powerful deck manipulation in seek/hologram, the insanity that is Echo Form.

 

The problem is he's also the most prone to getting murdered while you're trying to figure out exactly what you're supposed to be doing, especially on the higher difficulties. The Silent is my favourite character by some distance but my friends who've played this game as much as I have are waaaay into The Defect and keep sending me screenshots like this:

 

 

 

I've had 999 strength/poison with the other two on the lower difficulties, but Defect is the type of dude to have 999 block on the high difficulties if things go well.

[strawdonkey]

Alright, got there with the Silent at last. Had two copies of the card that gives you one block for every card you play (both upgraded so they were Innate) and a load of Shiv upgrades and generators. If I could survive a couple of turns of setup, "only" generating 6-10 block, a single Blade Dance would deal 36 damage and give 8 block, all for one energy.

 

Of note I also declined to pick a card really frequently, which felt really weird but really paid off.

 

Just the Ironclad to go...

[bradigor]

Couple of runs where I looked like I should be dominating but failed in Act II. 

 

One had two Demon Form cards and a Double Strength but used a card incorrectly that would have given me 3 Block with every exhausted card up against an Enemy that was throwing Unplayable Etheral at me, ended up losing the sprint. 

 

Another just didn't get any Strength bonuses at all, but was gaining Max HP almost every round. Just couldn't whittle down enemies quick enough in one of the battles.

 

What would resident experts say when it comes to choosing cards that offer negatives with the positives? I tend to avoid them, but wonder now if I should embrace them. 

[JLM]

Like the cards that cost HP with Ironclad? They can be very situational but certainly don’t rule them out. Ironclad is the best of the three characters at using health as currency thanks to stuff like his starting relic, feed to increase max HP and Reaper for in-combat healing. Also relics like red skull, centennial puzzle and meat on the bone can all make losing health something of a positive if used correctly. 

 

“Offering” in particular is extremely powerful and works in almost any deck. It’s very very rare for me to see it and not take it. 

 

Stuff like Power Through that puts wounds in your deck just depends on how well you can accommodate it. If you have plenty of card draw, can exhaust the wounds (and even generate block/damage from them if you have feel no pain or juggernaught) or if you have Evolve (draws additional cards when you draw statuses) then go for it. If not it’s a case of weighing up 15 block for one energy (which is very good) against adding troublesome statuses to the deck. Depends what else your deck is good at, how often you’ll need to play it etc. 

 

Immolate is exceptionally powerful and I barely even consider the burns when taking it. It’s another Ironclad card that I take nearly every time. 

 

Any others in particular you’ve been unsure about taking? 

[bradigor]

Nah, that covers most. I am just being a bit too conservative. 

 

I did spend ages weighing up an offer at an event. 

 

Lose 50% HP (I had 115 built up) for 5 Apparition Cards with Intangible. 

 

I declined as I had an Elite at the next turn and no rest for 4 more floors. I ended up losing the floor on the Elite anyway and regret itm especally as I read those cards go well with The Boot, which I had. 

[BeeJay]

Is this completely rogue-like? What, of anything carries over? Is it just unlocking characters?

[imp]

Not quite sure where you got the Boot synergy from - Intangible status doesn't have much to do with the boot, which just boosts any small attacks which deal under 5 damage up to 5.

 

Unfortunately, even though the intangible cards are some of the most powerful/beneficial in the game, like everything else, it's situational whether or not to go for them. Losing HP is definitely a big factor in choosing. But, if you're already under half health, you won't lose any of your current HP by taking them, and may even be closer to your new max, meaning relics like Runic Dodecahedron are more likely to proc.

 

Anyway, the main thing to know about the cards themselves is that they are all ethereal unless upgraded. So putting them into play will take priority as you make your first cycle through your deck, lest you forego the advantage they provide entirely. This first cycle can certainly feel safe, as you'll barely take any damage most likely, but once the cards are all used up you have to make sure you've made all the preparations for the rest of the fight - whether that's setting up for a long-haul defence game or a blitzkrieg attack. I've found with Ironclad the latter approach is usually the more synergistic with 75% of the decks that I end up building. Basically, even though they give you an easy ride in the early fight, don't get lulled into a false sense of security later on!

[Zael]

I won my first A20 with the intangible event carrying me through. I think there are a few things to consider when you get it.

 

1) How high is your max hp and how good are you at mitigation at that point? Maybe your defence game is already so good that the event will make you worse.

 

2) How quickly can you end fights? Are you going to run into many situations where you lose all 5 cards and have to rely just on block alone.

 

3) Have you any way of keeping the intangible cards for when you need them? Can you easily upgrade a few and do you have runic pyramid or well laid plans. Or do you have huge card draw where it's not a big deal if you shuffle them.

 

4) Can you utilize them to not win you the fight before they run out but instead buy you enough time to set up enough things to carry you. An example for Ironclad would be a barricade synergy that once all the intangible cards are gone has 400 block set up.

[imp]

7 minutes ago, BeeJay said:

Is this completely rogue-like? What, of anything carries over? Is it just unlocking characters?

 

Almost completely, but there are a few things that are permanent unlocks.

 

1. Cards and relics are unlocked by playing a few hours with each character.

2. Completing the game unlocks a difficulty modifier for that character (known as ascension). Completing an ascension run will unlock yet another difficulty modifier (up to 20).

3. Once you've completed the game with each character once you can attempt an even harder challenge during each run.

[bradigor]

10 minutes ago, imp said:

Not quite sure where you got the Boot synergy from - Intangible status doesn't have much to do with the boot, which just boosts any small attacks which deal under 5 damage up to 5.

 

Unfortunately, even though the intangible cards are some of the most powerful/beneficial in the game, like everything else, it's situational whether or not to go for them. Losing HP is definitely a big factor in choosing. But, if you're already under half health, you won't lose any of your current HP by taking them, and may even be closer to your new max, meaning relics like Runic Dodecahedron are more likely to proc.

 

Anyway, the main thing to know about the cards themselves is that they are all ethereal unless upgraded. So putting them into play will take priority as you make your first cycle through your deck, lest you forego the advantage they provide entirely. This first cycle can certainly feel safe, as you'll barely take any damage most likely, but once the cards are all used up you have to make sure you've made all the preparations for the rest of the fight - whether that's setting up for a long-haul defence game or a blitzkrieg attack. I've found with Ironclad the latter approach is usually the more synergistic with 75% of the decks that I end up building. Basically, even though they give you an easy ride in the early fight, don't get lulled into a false sense of security later on!

 

Something I read after the run, when looking up what those cards do. Clearly wrong then  

[BeeJay]

10 minutes ago, imp said:

 

Almost completely, but there are a few things that are permanent unlocks.

 

1. Cards and relics are unlocked by playing a few hours with each character.

2. Completing the game unlocks a difficulty modifier for that character (known as ascension). Completing an ascension run will unlock yet another difficulty modifier (up to 20).

3. Once you've completed the game with each character once you can attempt an even harder challenge during each run.

Thanks, so do some cards that you unlock during a run, then become available from the start of a run?

[Gotters]

I just got my first 3 act run today on the daily challenge, took ages and crashed once but luckily auto saved right on the crash.

[imp]

19 minutes ago, BeeJay said:

Thanks, so do some cards that you unlock during a run, then become available from the start of a run?

 

You're being scored as you play, and then once you win or die those points are added to a running tally. Hit certain point thresholds and three cards/relics will be unlocked - always in the same order. And yep, whatever you unlock will be available on your next run.

[footle]

31 minutes ago, BeeJay said:

Thanks, so do some cards that you unlock during a run, then become available from the start of a run?

 

Yes, but your starting deck will always be the same for a given character, and rarer cards are only available from elites and (particularly) bosses.

[Moodmon]

If/when this ever comes to Apple/Android I'm ruined.  Seems practically made for tablet play as it is.

 

I always struggle more with the Silent.  I always seem to take a while to get up and rolling.  Meanwhile I can get a lucky card with Ironclad and Defect and be away.  The Dark orbs can seem a bit meh, but a good dualcast and everything dies.  Alternatively getting all the block like the picture a few posts up is tremendously satisfying.  If you want a series to watch I'd suggest Rhapsody on Youtube.  He started his series again from episode 1 on full game release, and for the first few eps goes into a little bit more depth on the relics and his decisions.

 

 

[RadgyAdgy]

13 Hours in and got my first normal Victory!

 

 

For this run i decided not to focus so much on poison as I had done and instead pretty much picked every Power card I came across. Bird Faced Urn relic coupled with all the power cards I had worked really well getting me through the late game.

 

At the start of the run i decided to gamble and switch my switching relic for a random boss one which got me the +3 attack on every zero cost attack card. This had a nice synergy with Blade Dance and Infinite Blades.

 

I really do love this game!

[footle]

That’s a pretty high score with no ascension bonuses. And a *lot* of relics.

[JLM]

So great to see this thread lively with new people falling in love with the game.

 

Not necessarily the best Twitch stream for brand new players, but Jorbs is currently the best player in the world at this game. His live stream is great for seeing the game played at the highest possible level but perhaps not ideal if you're just starting.

 

However, his Youtube channel has all manner of educational content. Lots and lots of runs with every character, tutorials, in-depth videos on particular cards/relics topics and "over-explain'' runs that he records offline so he can take the time to talk through his decision-making process all the way through.

 

His basics tutorials are a good start:

 

 

 

[bradigor]

Argh... Got to the Act III boss, but had an event that jumped me there two floors in to Act III, should have continued the run instead. But probably my best build.

 

Barricade +

Demon Form +

 

Lots of damage and shield. Probably lacking healing though. 

[strawdonkey]

4 hours ago, JLM said:

 

 

Immolate is exceptionally powerful and I barely even consider the burns when taking it. It’s another Ironclad card that I take nearly every time. 

 

Just had a double Immolate run. I'd hesitate at "exceptionally" powerful as it's a little ropey and expensive against a single enemy at the end of act 3, but I got one at the very start of the game from a relic and it single-handedly massacred most of the first act.

 

Definitely an easy pick whenever you get it.

 

Here's my wins so far:

 

[JLM]

I think it's actually too strong and could perhaps do with a damage nerf in the next patch. On A20 an Immolate+ is enough damage for most of act 1 and annihilates sentries and slime boss, does a massive amount of work against all of the AOE needed in Act 2 (Gremlin Leader and Slavers in particular) and it takes care of Reptomancer in Act 3 on its own when that fight is a frequent destroyer of runs. It solves a lot major problems single-handedly and basically stops you having to think about them once you've got it. As well as being very powerful in its own right, it also stops you having to take cards like Cleave, which end up being reeeeally bad in Act 3. This is under the assumption that you're wanting to hit as many elites as possible though, which you kind of have to on A20 as you need those relics.

 

People always try and get Jorbs to say which cards/relics are too strong/weak and he rarely wants to talk about it as he's more focused on studying the game as it is, but with Immolate+ even he says it does too much damage. I think the only other one I've heard him agree to is  that Fire Breathing needs to be buffed or completely re-worked in some way as it's one of the few things in the game that is bad almost all of the time.  A number of cards (like Crippling Cloud and Corpse Explosion) had their properties and mechanics completely transformed during early access so I'm wondering if they'll re-invent it entirely.

 

I can see how two Immolates might be a bit much though as you'll see too much of it in fights where it isn't that good. Knowing how many of a good card to take is always an interesting one. Piercing Wail with the silent I reckon you can easily have four or five of them and find it beneficial as it's just that good, but the running joke is that you can never have too many Footworks when there obviously is a threshold for that. It's just so hard to turn it down though!

 

Also props for the Reflex+ in that run. Reflex and Tactician are two of the most slept on cards by new players. They're the sort of cards that seem completely garbage until suddenly you have that one deck where they are tremendous and you feel like a super smart guy for picking them.

 

 

[strawdonkey]

You need the discard package in place before picking them up, but yeah - draw/discard/gain an energy feels incredibly unfair.

 

Today's daily was fun - can't Smith? Buy Apotheosis instead, and just upgrade your entire deck at once! Stack + Body Slam = wheeeee