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Starfield - Coming to an Xbox/PC/GamePass near you soon


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Its a tough one. Massively lowers immersion for me but it would have posed many headaches like how do they deal with players accidentally (purposely) crashing into their city hubs, full of npcs.

I guess that means it's highly unlikely you'll be piloting at surface level and having dogfights over sci fi landscapes which is also a big shame.

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To be fair, the more I've read about this and looked into this with some more detail after the reveal, the more I'm convinced Bethesda have learnt some good lessons with some pretty brave decisions, the biggest being a silent protag dialogue wise in 2023 meaning a good commitment to the writing.

 

That and they're not wasting resources on faff like seamless transitioning from space to planet. For an immersion sim like Elite D that makes sense to do it and NMS it was part of the original gimmick, but I'd rather they focus on things like quests/dialogue and interesting things to do than work on something that would be cool the first two times and then I wouldn't given a fuck again.

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12 hours ago, monkeydog said:

If you can level up by spending 40 hrs resource collecting on the galaxy's blandest moon, a fair selection of players will being doing just that.  And then complain that the game is too grindy

Ah, good memories of Destiny 1.

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Todd on Fallout 76:

 

Quote

All new rendering, lighting and landscape technology, it allows us to have sixteen times the detail... 

"... more handcrafted content..." means extremely little. Could mean there's 2 more crates.

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"...  it allows us to have sixteen times the detail..." is deliberately used to trigger a reaction. Your and my immediate thought was "wow, sixteen times the detail, this is going to be amazing". It's the "it allows us... " part I choose to not read or acknowledge, and that's the vital part. It can have sixteen times the detail, it allows them to use sixteen times the detail, the engine could support sixteen times the detail. Where? In what capacity? Particles, polygons, weather? Draw distance? Characters on screen at the same time?

 

It's empty marketing blabber. Pardon me for rolling my eyes when I see a quote like "... more handcrafted content... " especially coming from Todd/Bethesda. We'll see how it turns out, I for one hope it's a massive success for everybody involved.

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OK? I don't know why you're complaining about vague marketing for Fallout 76 now when they did offer specific examples for Starfield where they have more handcrafted content like the cities are larger, they mention New Atlantis is the biggest one they've ever done, for instance.

 

Also 200,000 lines of dialogue with non of those being from a voiced protagonist, New Vegas had 65,000.

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I'm all for the meme of saying don't believe Todd's lies lol but that is a list of fairly not outlandish things in this situation and one of the things in the list is a very candid "we don't have this feature!" 

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I'm one of the weirdos that liked NMS at launch and really enjoyed watching its continued evolution. I also love flying from space, into a planets atmosphere and watching as it randomly cooked up the surface in front of me, then cruising around looking for stuff. That was pretty much the game for me and I found it strangely addictive. Starfield clearly isn't going to be that sort of experience, you've got set areas on planets that you're taken to with a click of a button where all the action will take place. It's looking super focused in comparison and I'm sure lots of people will prefer that tighter approach. I'm keen to give it a look on GamePass for sure, probably for the spaceship building aspect at least, although the limited use of them does take some of the shine off that for me. 

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I think my big mistake was thinking the purchase of ID was going to level up the core engine tech at Bethesda so we would be seeing a real next gen leap. Think Demon Souls (PS3)  to Demon Souls (PS5). That they were going to abandon the terrible engine they use. Also that this exists in the shadow of Elden ring is a problem most games will face now. 
 

But that was foolish of me and I’ve accepted that now.
 

This should be great fun, and I’m delighted that eurogamer’s announced the main game is ‘only’ 30-40 hrs, which is a perfect length for something like this. A more focused campaign based Elite sounds great to me. 
 

 

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Being able to seamlessly transition on to a planet isn't really a big sell for me - either it is tediously realistic (Elite Dangerous) or immersion-breakingly unrealistic (No Man's Sky). It is just never going to be that fun as a gameplay mechanic particularly if your game is an RPG and not a Sim. It is just unnecessary window-dressing.

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Quote

 Howard said the feature (seamless space travel) is "really just not that important to the player".

 

For THIS player it adds a lot to the immersion. I don't get how he can claim to speak for everyone, it's bollocks. If he wants to explain why it wasn't worth the time, great. Like this:

 

'Game development is often a trade off, and we felt that the technical challenges of seamless space travel would take up development time that could be better spent elsewhere in Starfield. Our existing gameplay systems are more than enough to immerse the player in this world, and we're excited to reveal more soon.' There you go, Todd. Easy. That'll be £1,000, please.

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Thousands content-dense worlds wouldn't just be impossible to do from a technical point of view, but it also wouldn't make much sense. If every world would be teeming with life and things to do, none of them would be special. I actually quite like the idea of tons of planets without life. To me it's part of the world building. It won't be diamond hard sci-fi but it's clearly going for some realism. Just let an ice ball be an ice ball where you can mine some stuff if you want to. And if you don't want to do any of that stuff, just follow the critical path.

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2 hours ago, ChewMagma said:

Being able to seamlessly transition on to a planet isn't really a big sell for me - either it is tediously realistic (Elite Dangerous) or immersion-breakingly unrealistic (No Man's Sky). It is just never going to be that fun as a gameplay mechanic particularly if your game is an RPG and not a Sim. It is just unnecessary window-dressing.

This is my thinking exactly. I just want a good RPG, not Elite or NMS - which are definitely *not* RPGs. Way I see it, I loved Mass Effect, KotOR, and The Outer Worlds but I always wondered whether actually being able to fly between the various planets would add to the immersion. I see it as wandering between big dungeons and towns in sandbox RPGs, having that feeling of a bigger world (in this case a universe) instead of the "planets" being separate selectable levels from a map like in the games I listed. Choosing a location on the planet to land after arriving there and letting the autopilot handle it is fine by me. The actual journey adds to the immersion. Not the act of landing manually - I would resort to autopilot every time anyway after doing it once or twice. I'd rather they focus on making the handcrafted locations worth it rather than add an arguably superfluous feature that's nowhere near as relevant to this genre as it is to space sims.

 

Reading this thread I'm slowly coming around on this game after having almost no hype at all ever since it was announced. If they listened to the feedback on the weak dialogue and rpg aspects of Fallout 4, and use that to give us an Elder Scrolls like sandbox spin on Mass Effect et al - a space RPG which actually feels like you're exploring a universe - this could be rather fun.

 

And hey, it's on Game Pass so why not? I'd probably be far more worried about deciding whether I should pay 70 quid for it on day one or not because of FOMO. But GP means I'm way more open to seeing what it's about and deciding for myself.

 

 

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I'm actually quite looking forward to this still — I doubt it'll live up to Morrowind, as those days of high-friction Bethesda RPGs are clearly long gone, but I'm hoping for fun exploration for a few tens of hours.

 

All that said, with people talking about the potential for the writing/story/characterisation side of the game, all that popped into my head was this

 

333532083_ArrestedDevelopmentStarfield2.jpg.83e3350bcccd50deea2115a802edc922.jpg

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Morrowind in SPAAAAAAACE would make me a very happy nerd indeed.

 

But @Wiper the writing was never ever the thing that made any Bethesda game special. So I'm not asking for them to suddenly develop decent writing skills. We have other RPG studios for that. I'm just asking for the dialogue and the player's engagement with said dialogue to not be as sparse and superficial as in Fallout 4. Dialogue and associated options of a similar level to Oblivion and Skyrim is all I'm asking for. Juuuust about acceptable enough to add to the immersion if the rest of the game is good.

 

Any nerd hoping that Bethesda will someday turn into Obsidian or Larian should instead go play Obsidian and Larian games.

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On 15/06/2022 at 10:01, LaveDisco said:

I think my big mistake was thinking the purchase of ID was going to level up the core engine tech at Bethesda so we would be seeing a real next gen leap. Think Demon Souls (PS3)  to Demon Souls (PS5). That they were going to abandon the terrible engine they use. Also that this exists in the shadow of Elden ring is a problem most games will face now. 
 

But that was foolish of me and I’ve accepted that now.
 

This should be great fun, and I’m delighted that eurogamer’s announced the main game is ‘only’ 30-40 hrs, which is a perfect length for something like this. A more focused campaign based Elite sounds great to me. 
 

 


I wonder if it’s really possible for them to change engine at this stage. Most first person game engines aren’t really set up to handle millions of interactive items or cities full of NPCs you can talk to. 

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On 15/06/2022 at 10:01, LaveDisco said:

I think my big mistake was thinking the purchase of ID was going to level up the core engine tech at Bethesda so we would be seeing a real next gen leap.

 

 

Pie in the sky we all know iD engines don't allow you to talk to the monsters

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