Jump to content
rllmuk
Jug McKenzie

Star Wars Episode IX: The Rise of Skywalker (December 2019)

Recommended Posts

54 minutes ago, Mugman said:

Can we please drop all of this "you know the prequels have a cohesive narrative" shit? The narrative is "the little boy becomes Darth Vader." The poster for the Phantom Menace had that genius flowing narrative through it from beginning to end. And if we want to go any further into it the prequel trilogy is a mess of nonsense politics, tax nonsense, and a plan by Palpatine that only works due to a series of unbelievable coincidences and Jar Jar Fucking Binks being fooled. They're terrible movies with terrible plots/dialogue/narrative/everything. So they follow Campbell pretty well in places, good luck to them. 

 

The sequel trilogy had the set up there to not be completely shat on by a terrible third movie that tried to do a whole trilogy in one and ended up being a bloated, unsatisfying mess. TFA set up characters, TLJ explored interesting themes, all Skywalker needed to do was choose someone that knew how story worked and didn't just imitate what they'd seen before and they'd have been in business. It's a shame they flunked the ending but that doesn't ruin what came before. TFA is solid good fun and TLJ is a straight up masterpiece of theme and storytelling. There are two set pieces in the prequels that are really great, both in the first movie. Everything else is a complete waste of time. Even Rise of Skywalker has a couple of flashy fun bits, and that was a total turd. It's still a damn site better than anything in the prequel trilogy. 

Nah. Each to their own. Opinions and all that. But, I definitely prefer the prequel trilogy to the new one. You can argue it as much as you like, but you won’t change my mind.

  • Upvote 3
  • Empathy 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

To be fair to Disney etc, Lucas made the originals up as he went along and they turned out great. He planned the prequels (a bit) more carefully and we all know how they turned out. So perhaps they can be forgiven for thinking that Star Wars works best without a long-term plan.

 

Their mistake was not having a single person making it up as they went along, and squeezing the films so close together that their production schedules effectively overlapped. The result was that they ended up being written using the equivalent of the old write a line, fold it over and pass it to the next person technique. Hopefully next time things will be a bit more coherent.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
10 hours ago, Sidewaysbob said:

 

Wow, broad sweeping statement there. Anymore hot takes on my personality you feel you can offer up? 

 

Clearly you haven't read the entirety of the thread since the movie's release. Nor have you read any of the news stories about previous versions of the script, re-shoots etc. And it also appears that one of your biggest criticisms of the movie was the Rey-Finn relationship.

 

That certainly gives me enough info to make assertions about your Star Wars personality!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Oh right. Sorry I didn't realise we weren't allowed to talk about stuff already mentioned. My bad. 

 

I'll fuck off then. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 hours ago, Sidewaysbob said:

Oh right. Sorry I didn't realise we weren't allowed to talk about stuff already mentioned. My bad. 

 

I'll fuck off then. 

 

You can remain, but just need to accept that on this topic you are outclassed. Watch, and learn.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

:huh:

 

Check out Mr Big balls. If that was supposed to be funny, it isn't. If it was supposed to be insulting consider it a hit. 

 

Whatever, carry on being a dick in here all you like. Life's too short for this shit. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

@Sidewaysbob,its not you. Almost everyone in this thread turned into a colossal wank stain since this film was released. This thread is a fucking cesspool, so the few people who really enjoyed the movie have basically left it alone. 

  • Upvote 5

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 hours ago, Sidewaysbob said:

:huh:

 

Check out Mr Big balls. If that was supposed to be funny, it isn't. If it was supposed to be insulting consider it a hit. 

 

Whatever, carry on being a dick in here all you like. Life's too short for this shit. 

 

I genuinely thought that your challenge to make an assessment of your personality would be a challenge.

 

A quick Google finds loads of articles about the Finn and Rey storyline. Here's one:

https://www.indiewire.com/2019/12/john-boyega-finn-rey-loves-her-rise-of-skywalker-1202199045/

 

Not sure I've seen this reported, but John Boyega has been scrubbed from the Star Tours Disney Parks ride. His bit has been replaced with Daisy Ridley.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 hours ago, Stigweard said:

 

"Did you know..."

 

NO, because none of that was in the fucking movie.

 

And like all science in all of Abrams movies- it simply isn't possible. Imagine the harm he could do with Superman!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 hours ago, Stigweard said:

 

"Did you know..."

 

NO, because none of that was in the fucking movie.

 

Best response

 

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
10 minutes ago, Festoon said:

 

Best response

 

Kind of sums it all up really. It feels like a big difference between this trilogy and the original trilogy is that while the OT did expand out of the storyline in the film in books and comics (and certainly the imagination of my 8 year old self!), it didn’t need you to source additional information to understand the basic story of the films. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
11 hours ago, Thor said:

@Sidewaysbob,its not you. Almost everyone in this thread turned into a colossal wank stain since this film was released. This thread is a fucking cesspool, so the few people who really enjoyed the movie have basically left it alone. 


...add to that obviously the TLJ thread. Don’t think I’ve ever seen a more toxic thread on the forum and this one is - generally speaking - a bit of an extension of it. 

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
25 minutes ago, Kevvy Metal said:


...add to that obviously the TLJ thread. Don’t think I’ve ever seen a more toxic thread on the forum and this one is - generally speaking - a bit of an extension of it. 

Serious question: What’s so toxic about them? I thought it was just a bunch of lifelong Star Wars fans who’ve landed on different opinions of the latest trilogy, discussing what they like and don’t like about them? There hasn’t been any racism or sexism or wishing Kathleen Kennedy dead or anything so ridiculous, has there?

 

I’ve been active in all the threads of the latest trilogy, just like yourself, and we definitely have opposing views, but i don’t think you’ve ever gone too far with your opinions and I hope you feel that way about me. I know we’re all invested, as it’s been with us since childhood, but it’s just a few films at the end of the day and not something I’m particularly arsed about in the grand scheme of things. I just thought it was fun and interesting to hear everyone’s theories on what’s gone right or wrong. I honestly didn’t realise it was affecting anyone that much.

  • Upvote 5

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
45 minutes ago, Kevvy Metal said:


...add to that obviously the TLJ thread. Don’t think I’ve ever seen a more toxic thread on the forum and this one is - generally speaking - a bit of an extension of it. 


You were one of the main causes of that toxicity though.

  • Upvote 6

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
14 minutes ago, Harsin said:


You were one of the main causes of that toxicity though.


Well congratulations! So were you! 

My positivity towards both films was met with constant mocking and yes, negs which I didn’t really feel were for my post content and more that people found a view point of enjoying these films wasn't welcome at all. 
 

The film folder is very different to the likes of Discussion. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

My main argument in that thread was that it’s fine to disagree with people's views on the films and explain why, but please, please, stop attacking the posters themselves. 
 

On the other hand you were the ableist, who claimed people who didn’t like a blockbuster as much as you were autistic.

 

You weren't getting negged by loads of people because you liked the movie, it was because of your constant stream of vitriol and character assassinations aimed at anyone who had a different view about a film than you.

  • Upvote 7

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, drmick said:

 

And like all science in all of Abrams movies- it simply isn't possible. Imagine the harm he could do with Superman!

 

I mean, I'm not gonna get too wrapped up in the science behind stuff in Star Wars but at least just give us some exposition. It would have taken 10 seconds for the Emperor to say what was in that tweet and that would have explained A. How the they built and manned the fleet and B. Who all those hooded figures in the stands were.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
9 minutes ago, Harsin said:

My main argument in that thread is that it’s fine to disagree with people's views on the films and say why, but to stop attacking the posters themselves. 
 

On the other hand you were the ablist who accused people who didn’t, like a blockbuster as much as you of being autistic.

 

My point again, that you're painting me out as a villain because you don't like my tone or opinion adding to this toxic and hostile environment. 

Yes, I flippantly used the word "sperg" when trying to make the point that people were getting far to bogged down in detail rather than the meaning behind it all which I didn't even realise I'd done and instantly apologised for. I'm not an Ablist in any way and you're again trying to perpetuate this. 

 

Much like another forumite accused me of stating that "only racists and woman haters hate TLJ" which I didn't even say, they could provide no evidence for and ate a ban for it. 

People are particularly shitty to each other in these threads. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I’d honestly forgotten you calling people ‘spergs’ for not liking a film. Maybe stop being shitty to people in these threads then Kevvy and they won’t feel as toxic.

  • Upvote 6

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'll post the exchange and if people think I'm misrepresenting you and being toxic, then fair enough. I'll happily eat a ban if you want to report it and the mods agree.

 

I think the below may have been addition to the 'sperg' comment you referenced yourself, as I didn't see the term in these posts?

 

Worth noting there were quite a few posters (not just me) asking you to try and restrain yourself and attempting to explain to you why your posting was causing offence across a bunch of pages.

 

Quote

How is nerds wanting to edit out character development out of films? Because they have no patience? Because nerds are often a bit on the spectrum and can’t associated with emotive related subtext?

 

Quote

You basically accused people who had issues with the film and made their own plot suggestions of being autistic earlier in the thread. I thought it was an absolutely horrible post. A) So what if they're autistic (which you have no way of knowing)? It doesn’t automatically make their opinions worthless. B) Using disabilities to as a tool to put people down and score internet points is fucking awful. Hey, why not go all out and just call people who disagree with you 'spackers' or 'mongs'

 

Quote

That's absolutely not true and your putting words in my mouth, most likely to be irate for the sake of it. I was not in any way mocking anyone or using any kind of derogatory language to mock someone with a disability, and I would never do so. I said that nerd traits are often from people who are a little on the spectrum, which is often true. It's also a generalisation that men are a little further on the autistic spectrum than woman, and is stating this going to also make you abusive?

 

Quote

I'll just quote the post.

Certainly reads to me like you trying to discount people's opinion on the basis of a disability. 

Every other post post from you in this thread is you moaning about 'nerds' and that anyone with any issues with the film simply doesn’t understand it as well as you. Because of course a 'normal' person couldn’t possibly have any issues with the films, any criticism can just be handwaved away because it's from 'nerds'. Obviously this thread is just full of salty 'nerds' instead of individual people with individual opinions. Of course the guy who's constantly getting upset about critcisms of the film is the Fonz.

Plenty of people who loved the film in here who are arguing its merits well and expressing what they liked without resorting to the stream of ad hominem attacks and making assumptions about the motives of anyone who didn’t like it as much as you are.

 

Quote

Well, it certainly was a flippant comment that wasn't intended to be mocking of someone with a disability. I was maybe getting a little irate myself regarding - as I mentioned - a lot of really silly nitpicking that's going on in this thread, so my comment might have had a bit of a sting in it. 

I'm not even remotely upset about a few of the criticisms here, I just think most of them are missing the point completely. But people are free to endlessly debate why no one previously thought about using light-speed to smash through objects and what not.

 

I think this is the 'apology' you mentioned, after Smitty took offence to your posting?

 

Quote

Me saying 'fucking' because i'm frustated is not offensive, but saying that people who disliked some movie are [LONG LIST OF INSULTS HERE] actually is. It's weird that you're argitated by my 'challenges' but you're completely blind to the real offense caused by having some rando guy that you have never met on the internet unsubtly suggesting that you're insane/sad/sexist/racist/pathetic/autistic/etc because you had the temerity to criticise a film that he liked.

 

Quote

I might have lot my temper a little, and I do hold up my hands for the autistic comment much earlier in the thread, but I think you're amplifying this all you know just a tad. 

...but anyways, I hope you critique that Star Wars film real good Smitty. Go analyse that thing right up!


I’ll apologise for using the term 'ableist', I don’t know you in real life and can only judge the online persona you present on here, so can’t really make that call. 'User of ableist language' would have been a better description.

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 minutes ago, JPL said:

I’d honestly forgotten you calling people ‘spergs’ for not liking a film. Maybe stop being shitty to people in these threads then Kevvy and they won’t feel as toxic.

 

Again, in context I said it flippantly when making a point that people were getting bogged down in details and not the meaning behind certain things. I then edited it out and apologised.

 

What's the point in your piling on as well? An opportunity to take the Kenobi high ground? Well done you! 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
20 minutes ago, Kevvy Metal said:

 

Again, in context I said it flippantly when making a point that people were getting bogged down in details and not the meaning behind certain things. I then edited it out and apologised.

 

What's the point in your piling on as well? An opportunity to take the Kenobi high ground? Well done you! 

I’m not piling on. In fact I was the first to ask why you were describing the Star Wars threads as the most toxic on the forum. I was genuinely wondering, when I really don’t see a difference of opinion over a film series as anything to get too wound up about.

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
42 minutes ago, Harsin said:

I'll post the exchange and if people think I'm misrepresenting you and being toxic, then fair enough. I'll happily eat a ban if you want to report it and the mods agree.

 

I think the below may have been addition to the 'sperg' comment you referenced yourself, as I didn't see the term in these posts?

 

Worth noting there were quite a few posters (not just me) asking you to try and restrain yourself and attempting to explain to you why your posting was causing offence across a bunch of pages.

 

 

 

 

 

 

I think this is the 'apology' you mentioned, after Smitty took offence to your posting?

 

 

 

No, I literally apologised for it, I was aware that I had riled up a few members not just with a heated debate about some film, but with the inappropriate language I had used, which was not me literally deriding people with autism. I also don't really appreciate this all being dumped here out of context of the actual discussion in the thread. 

 

Quote

Well -- to be honest -- I had no idea that I had written that, when I did. Just a word that flowed out, and of course in context, I'm not intending on mocking someone with a disability. My vitriolic response was in response to being told what to do in a totally abrupt manner. 

I was unaware that this sort of language is against the forum rules. It was not my intention to cause offence and I'll refrain from doing it in the future. 

 

I've also edited out that word, and in response to "You're fine with the use of ableist language", no I'm not and don't put words in my mouth. 
 

 

 

 

Also, the conversation involving Smitty was from a whole other time, which was when the whole thread plunged into utter chaos. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 hours ago, drmick said:

 

And like all science in all of Abrams movies- it simply isn't possible. Imagine the harm he could do with Superman!


:lol: the science! Won’t somebody think of the realism in a kids film where space wizards and mainly humanoid shaped aliens fly around in spaceships to fight an evil empire capable of extraordinary infrastructure project building. 
I’ll bet that’s what’s on everyone’s mind going into these films. What’s scientifically possible. Let’s do an audit. 
 

I’m now really worried about superman. I mean how much harm could he do to the film if he ignores the very serious science of a godlike invulnerable flying alien? Maybe he’ll get Batman to do another pumping iron training montage to get him ready to take on his all powerful enemy space jesus. 
 

fucking hell. 

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
53 minutes ago, Darren said:

That Rise of Skywalker, eh?

 

Now the fuss has died down a bit I think I view the new trilogy as fun, certainly better than the turgid prequels, but a bit of a missed opportunity. With just a little more planning, and spending a little more time writing and making them rather than rushing them out on what it now turns out was an insane schedule, they could have been much better. But I'm a glass of blue milk half full type person and so I live in hope that lessons will be learned by the people in charge and that the inevitable next iteration will be better again.

 

In retrospect TLJ is still my favourite of the bunch, despite the entire Finn & Rose subplot. It's probably inevitable as the Rey/Ben/Luke triangle is at the heart of this trilogy, but one of those characters is basically absent from Abram's episodes. It all just works so perfectly in their scenes in TLJ.

I think that’s all we can hope. I’m sure they’ll have learnt some big lessons from this trilogy and the next one will be back on top form. I’m looking forward to it already!

  • Upvote 1
  • Empathy 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'd be quite interested in a different time line where we had both a Rian Johnson and JJ Abrams complete trilogies. As much as I preferred TLJ in general, I can totally understand that it wasn't what some people were after which then stuck out more amongst the other two and the fact JJ just made 8 & 9 in the one film. Although even what he chose to do with 9 makes it seem like he intended 7 to just be his usual mystery box shenanigans rather than the first part of a trilogy where he (or anyone) had an overall plan. 

Personally I think what rian did with the awkward middle film was thematically more interesting in regards to star wars and the characters and setup he was given so I wonder what he would have done with all 3.

Trevorrow's script for 9 sounded pretty crap too imho but it also seemed to be slightly less daft than what we got in some ways. 

I think in hindsight and going from what some people wanted from the films and characters that it was pretty much doomed from the start unfortunately. 

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

To be honest I probably think TLJ is the best of this new bunch, even though I slated it at the time. I think the tonal shift from Episode VII to VII was a big factor in that and it really felt like Rian Johnson wanted to ditch the majority of JJ’s plot strands and do his own thing, which really didn’t work for me. It might work as a standalone film, but It didn’t feel like a continuation of VII. Then we got Episode IX which swung back the other way and felt like absolute mayhem, with JJ trying to pull things back in his direction, while trying to wrap up the trilogy as well as create a satisfactory conclusion to the entire saga. He didn’t manage it.

 

Saying that though, I still don’t rate TLJ. It just isn’t what I wanted from a Star Wars film and it lacked the fun and adventure of any of the original trilogy. It just didn’t feel Star Wars to me, as intangible as that sounds.

 

When’s the next one then? Have they even said yet?

 

 

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

We have placed cookies on your device to help make this website better. You can adjust your cookie settings, otherwise we'll assume you're okay to continue. Use of this website is subject to our Privacy Policy, Terms of Use, and Guidelines.