Star Trek: Picard - Season 3, Everyone loves the D

[layten]

ummm ok then....

[Jg15]

Michael Dorn is so good as Worf, its like he's never been away from the role.

[MK-1601]

On 03/03/2023 at 21:07, Hamus said:

 

Riker the Hiker

Walking journeys with Will.

 

Riker on Rails

Interrailing across 25th Europe.

 

Collapsing the Wormhole

Riker travels to the past and during je finds out he requires Colon surgery. With 21st century medical technology it isn't quite the the good old new old days!

 

Data my data

Riker takes up painting and starts getting flashbacks about Data.

It transpires that Data stuck some kind of mind flash into him in some kind of episode that we get to learn. Probably the first one where he's doing that song and it means something now.

Seems that Data is now in Riker and Riker finds Tasha Yarr for some more sex (in some other dimension) and Troi finds out.

Troi is furious but understands it's driven by Data, so she has to go into Will's brain to understand it.

There she replays that Wild West one, and meets Worf. As revenge she has sex with him, and time speeds up...she has a child which turns out to be Data.

That wraps up episodes 1-3 of Data my Data, what happens next? Probably something to do with Q.

 

 

Come on man, Riker's Island is right there.

 

...

 

I'm not convinced that Michael Dorn can still play Worf reeeally. But he manages to make cheesy Whedonesque / TNG movie-esque quipping dialogue actually funny, which is no mean feat.

 

[LaveDisco]

Episode 3

 

The Good:

Spoiler

Worf is Worf. That's the same character. He's become some stupid secret agent, super hero, because of course he has, but the character is the same. Dorn doing superb heavily lifting with terrible plot and only Ravi to bounce of (who, to be fair to has now three seasons of making the best of being giving the worst material in the show, put her in something decently written and I bet she's good)

 

They've spent 3 hrs trying to give Riker a Ship, and they should have done its before the credits of the first episode. Immediately, felt 100% more Trek, and the disagreement between Picard and Riker (whilst against the spirit of the show) worked. Picard being out of touch, Riker, being the experienced one. It's what S1E1 should have been. Grumpy Captain has being developed well, so I expect he'll get his ship back though.

 

 

 

The Bad:

Spoiler

Beverly's mental gymnastics to explain the existence of her Son, is pure garbage of the highest order. "You're a constant assassination target Picard, from all that time spent cruising around in a gigantic ship filled with children and family that had a  fucking school on it. How could he be near you?!"

 

That said, the argument they had, felt like the real characters. They even gave Picard some real Picard lines. "You don't get to condemn people before the fact!". It was properly the old school method of plot being philosophy that TNG did all the time. Except with the now Classic modern inability to believe that the high road could be taken.

 

For example, buckets more 'the Federation has forgotten worlds' awfulness of the highest order. It could easily have been re-written to 'I can't stand around waiting for the federation to reach these worlds, and bring sanity to them' but instead it attacks the purity of the show.

 

The Ugly:

Spoiler

Picard saying he needs to apologise to Grumpy Captain for the mistake of saving his son, because he now knows the son doesn't like him, doesn't just double down on the republican trek, but goes further. It fundamentantally misunderstands so much, and how so many people let it happen for the sake of plot arc. Just ugly.

 

[Garwoofoo]

Captain Shaw is easily the best new character this show has introduced (though I do have a soft spot for S2 Rios) so he’s undoubtedly going to get killed off sooner rather than later. 

[Sprite Machine]

Christ, I don't know what character Patrick Stewart was playing in that episode, but it sure as hell wasn't Jean-Luc Picard. 

 

Worf was OK. I mean, Michael Dorn is fantastic and he's slotted back into the role nicely. But him saying he's changed his ways from violence etc., rings hollow following what just happened in the previous episode. It also ignores all the nuanced character development he had on DS9. Simply put, Worf has not been a violent rage monster for a very long time (if ever), and it feels like they're glossing over everything Worf is to give us a simplistic take on his character instead. Not really surprising, mind you.

 

Also, how many TNG characters are we missing now? Geordi has to turn up at some point. Are we seeing Troi again or was that brief appearance all we're getting? Will there even be a full reunion on screen at the same time, because it feels like that's slipping away with each passing episode.

 

As for the plot, 

Spoiler

I don't know whether to assume there's a good reason for why a Changeling was on the Titan, or if I should abandon hope of a logical explanation now and save myself from disappointment later. There's no way the plot is gonna make sense, is there? They have form for this, it's gonna be a farcical tangle of nonsense again, isn't it?

 

Spoiler

EDIT: The mysterious dude in the bar from episode 1 was probably a Changeling, and followed them to the Titan. Was possibly tracking Picard. Or maybe the Changelings are everywhere. But then is it Picard they're really after or is it still Jack? And if it's Picard, why go to the trouble of following him to space?

 

Spoiler

EDIT2: And how are Lore AND Moriarty still going to get introduced without this all becoming a confusing mess?

 

Edited March 5 by Sprite Machine

[LaveDisco]

On that:

 

Spoiler

You're spot on with Worf, it's just his acting and voice, and manners are lifting it beyond the words he's saying. The fact that he looks incredible for a 70 year old man helps too.

 

And the changelings being brought back really brought home to me 

1) How much great world building and plot was available to use from TNG era Trek. Changelings, DS9, The Wormhole, Bajor 30 years later, transformed and brought into the federation whilst still being uniquely itself. Empowered and free, but part of something bigger. It game them the positivity they should champion and. a reason for cynicism, because

2) Changelings give them as much 'The Federation' are evil as they wanted without undermining what the Federation is. Changelings are corrupting from within. We've gotta go rogue. No need for an alternative timeline, or Robot Hate from the first two seasons. It could still have shown people at their best.

 

What a phenomenal waste of Canon. 

 

 

[Thor]

This one's too niche for the funny pics thread, but should get a laugh here. 

 

[Garwoofoo]

20 hours ago, Sprite Machine said:

Also, how many TNG characters are we missing now? Geordi has to turn up at some point. Are we seeing Troi again or was that brief appearance all we're getting? Will there even be a full reunion on screen at the same time, because it feels like that's slipping away with each passing episode.

 

Spiner's in it, I think, and I wouldn't bet against Wheaton showing up again. I'm sure LeVar Burton will show given that they've specifically included his character's daughter. That's everyone, really, unless they're really going to give the fans what they want and have a Miles O'Brien cameo.

[LaveDisco]

35 minutes ago, Garwoofoo said:

 

Spiner's in it, I think, and I wouldn't bet against Wheaton showing up again. I'm sure LeVar Burton will show given that they've specifically included his character's daughter. That's everyone, really, unless they're really going to give the fans what they want and have a Miles O'Brien cameo.

She his daughter? I wasn’t sure. It’s not like she mentioned him in every sentence she spoke. 

[Garibaldi]

Appreciate all the impressions thus far. I’m not going near this, at least not until the entire season is completed and I’m able to judge whether it all hangs together and doesn’t have the ‘it’s due tomorrow?! Fuck fuck fuck!’ conclusions of S1 & 2. 
 

So far we seem to have a mix of ‘hey, that’s not bad!’ and ‘ugh, they haven’t learnt a thing.’ Which actually makes it an improvement on the first two seasons, so I guess there’s that. 

[Jg15]

3 hours ago, Thor said:

This one's too niche for the funny pics thread, but should get a laugh here. 

 

 

 

For those that don't know!

[Thor]

Have to be honest, I kinda tee'd that up for another meme straight from this show.

 

3 hours ago, Thor said:

This one's too niche for the funny pics thread, but should get a laugh here. 

Spoiler

But no-one bit. 

[DeciderVT]

1 hour ago, Garibaldi said:

Appreciate all the impressions thus far. I’m not going near this, at least not until the entire season is completed and I’m able to judge whether it all hangs together and doesn’t have the ‘it’s due tomorrow?! Fuck fuck fuck!’ conclusions of S1 & 2. 
 

So far we seem to have a mix of ‘hey, that’s not bad!’ and ‘ugh, they haven’t learnt a thing.’ Which actually makes it an improvement on the first two seasons, so I guess there’s that. 

 

I'm rolling my eyes every week but Frakes is still great as Riker, despite some duff lines. It's easily better than the trainwreck of S2 so far.

[Mogster]

Oh yeah, it's much better than season 2 so far, in spite of my issues with it.

[Exidor]

Against my better judgement I have been roped into watching this. As has already been said, Shaw is the only one making this watchable at the moment. It's nice to have Frakes and Dorn along but they're fighting an uphill battle against their dialogue. 

 

Spoiler

The chain of events that led them from "give Pat a character moment where the weight of fatherhood hits home" to "de-age Pat and Frakes so they can explain what's going to happen in the lamest bit of shoehorned-in foreshadowing you've ever seen" to "let's just name the sodding episode after it and have done" should be taught in film school. It's like poetry - it rhymes.

 

And whoever wrote that "You've killed us all" line at the end wants firing into the sun. Hands up everyone who's captain and actually running the bridge and giving the orders to fire everything we've got? That's who killed everyone. The one who listened to the doddery old man whose judgement has been all over the place for the last three episodes.

 

It continues to be the Mitchell & Webb lazy writers sketch stretched out to 10 hours.

[RFT]

Also re Riker's last line

Spoiler

Even if he thought it, he would, as a long serving and highly respected and professional officer, know you don't shout out words to the effect of "we're all going to die"  in front of the rest of the crew you're supposed to be leading.

 

[Purin]

On 03/03/2023 at 22:11, GwiDan said:

The TNG theme music elevates this show. Much better than callbacks to TOS like they’ve been obsessed with for years. 

 

Took me until the third episode to hear it. Absolute mad lads put it at the very end.

[IcEBuRN]

That was great! It had its flaws, but you've all pointed them out already. Is the picture really dark for anyone else, seems awfully dim and part of the reason I didn't even notice the de-aging at all!

 

There is also just something I can't unsee now, and it throws me out of some scenes a bit...

 

Spoiler

Sorry.

[sir podger]

i dont know what tv you have, but on my samsung i noticed a lot of modern stuff is very dark, and then found out that the technology to compensate for motion blur was causing it

[Hexx]

This continues to be so fucking frustrating. There's some really good bits, but then there's absolute clunkers. There's some really well made bits, and then there's terrible choices. You still have to completely ignore it's "Star Trek" though - it's still leagues ahead of S1 and S2 though, but I'm still not sure it's close to good.

 

Spoiler

I liked the flashback. I like the framing of every shot. It's Picard putting on a show - it's almost theatrical in it's lay out, and JLP is laying the ham on thick. It's Patrick Stewart playing a character who is acting the part and it shows. It's really well done. The audience cheers, and then Picard eats alone. It's a lonely old man who likes the attention - not for ego or vanity, but just because it's probably the only attention he gets.

 

Frakes also continues to knock it out of the park.

 

But then there's dumb. Just some examples

The holodeck power source has plot armor. The crew are in desperate dire straights, but loads of them can listen to Picard. Shaw is...wounded? But well enough to

changeling hunt and engineer stuff (does anyone know about what a retrofit is? Because they seem to change what it means each time)... but not to be in charge of his ship? The bit where he's teaching Seven Changlings for Dummies is clunky exposition even for this show. (And now every changling brings their own bucket on secret inflitration missions ) His entire character for 3 episodes has been, whilst a dick, concerned about his crew. So his benching and then holodecking feels weird.

 

Was Vadic's hand a changling, or a changing communication device?

Do we think one of the characters is going to be a secret "changeling all along" at some point. It feels just like this show that a TNG character will be at some point as a "shocking" reveal.

 

It still remains slow. 4 episodes in and we could have covered all of this in one easy episode. Filling and taking your time isn't bad, if you have some good stuff to fill it out with

 

Then again by 4 episodes into season 1 and season 2 we off the rails and mid-dumpster fire so there's that.

[Hexx]

 

[Exidor]

5 hours ago, Hexx said:

 

  Hide contents

Do we think one of the characters is going to be a secret "changeling all along" at some point. It feels just like this show that a TNG character will be at some point as a "shocking" reveal.

 

 

Presumably...

Spoiler

Raffi, as her not being able to get back to the lake or whatever it is they have to do might explain her weird fidgety acting over the last 3 years.

 

Didn't the early reviews say it starts getting good around ep 5/6? That's something to look forward to I suppose.

[Vespa Alex]

Did anyone else’s “broadcast” have absolutely abysmal picture quality? I couldn’t watch it, it was so compressed. 

[Hexx]

2 hours ago, Exidor said:

 

Presumably...

  Hide contents

Raffi, as her not being able to get back to the lake or whatever it is they have to do might explain her weird fidgety acting over the last 3 years.

 

Didn't the early reviews say it starts getting good around ep 5/6? That's something to look forward to I suppose.

I think the critics only saw the first four

[Alex W.]

Maybe they meant the rest of the episodes have to be better.

[Harsin]

Spoiler

Wasn't a big plot point of DS9 that sensors couldn’t identify Changelings? You can fanwank that way with maybe they developed tech in the intervening years. Maybe it’s such a power draw it’s why all their starships are now lit like strip clubs. The bucket thing is so dumb. It’s not like Changelings have to have a special Apple brand bucket to regenerate in that looks exactly like Odo's and that is apparently so ubiquitous that Starfleet keeps pictures of it in their database. Any old receptacle will do, Odo's bucket was just something that was knocking about on Bajor. The leaving a pile of goop thing behind them as well, they're not snails!

Also lol at the tortured explanation for why they can use the holodeck. Just have them have a conversation in the ship's canteen or something.

 

[Pob]

I'm on the verge of signing up for another month of Prime so I can watch along with the RLM guys. Is that stupid? I've only seen eps 1 and 2 so far and I fell asleep by the end of episode 2. I'm of course curious to see the whole TNG band reassembled but I hated season 1 and didn't watch season 2.

[GwiDan]

12 minutes ago, Pob said:

I'm on the verge of signing up for another month of Prime so I can watch along with the RLM guys. Is that stupid? I've only seen eps 1 and 2 so far and I fell asleep by the end of episode 2. I'm of course curious to see the whole TNG band reassembled but I hated season 1 and didn't watch season 2.

Paramount+ is probably cheaper?

[Alex W.]

17 minutes ago, Pob said:

I'm on the verge of signing up for another month of Prime so I can watch along with the RLM guys. Is that stupid? I've only seen eps 1 and 2 so far and I fell asleep by the end of episode 2. I'm of course curious to see the whole TNG band reassembled but I hated season 1 and didn't watch season 2.

Don’t hate watch things unless you really want more money to be spent on making the exact same content. We’ve built a tidy little loathing economy of YouTube channels and poorly run media conglomerates but a large amount of that is coming at the expense of projects that could’ve been, y’know, good.

 

Paramount doesn’t look at this and say “gosh, people don’t like Picard, we should double down on SNW”, they see “engagement with Picard is through the roof, we need more of this, trim it from the SNW budget”.