Star Wars: Andor

[Benny]

On 16/11/2022 at 00:26, Benny said:

I've had a word with myself today. It was a difficult conversation, but I've both decided we're going to save up tomorrow's episode until next week and go out with a bang.

 

God speed until next week, Andor thread.

 

Fuck you Benny, you aren't the boss of me.

 

This weeks felt like:

 

Spoiler

A "deep breath" kind of episode.

 

All the "pieces" are being put in place for something big to happen. There's the upcoming raid on Spellhaus, Mon Monthma's finances getting noticed, Andor reacting to his mother, her funeral, sad old dog droid, Evil Dale Cooper getting a tip, Luthen's ship being confirmed as a James Bond style gadget cornucopia...

 

Need the next episode stat.

 

[Darren]

BEST STAR WARS

[Benny]

On 16/11/2022 at 18:55, The Grand Pursuivant said:

 

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I am becoming increasingly convinced that Luthen will turn out to be a Gray Jedi or an ex-Jedi. His certainty that Andor needs to join the rebellion, the unbelievably complex network he seemingly manages on his own, his dual identities, his complete and utter self-certainty and assuredness in all situations. Then the speech from last weeks episode where he talks about using the tools of his enemies to defeat them. And in this episode Saw Gerrera's henchman takes what looks a hell of a lot like a lightsabre off him. Then he singlehandedly escapes a fucking Battlecruiser without even breaking a sweat. Got to be.

 

 

Spoiler

I really really really really hope that you're wrong.

 

I mean honestly the show has been so good thus far I probably won't mind, but Luthen is already interesting enough without any of that sort of crappy Jedi baggage added as well.

 

One of the things I've liked so much about the show is that the word, or even the concept of "Jedi" has never come up once, as far as I can remember. It makes the show so much better without any of that, and by extension makes the idea of the long forgotten space wizards actually more mysterious and potentially cooler again.

 

So yeah. Please lets not have Luthen be a Jedi. He's just a badass spy, and that's all he needs to be, because badass spies are cool on their own. If they have so little confidence in their audience that that is not enough and the Jedi card has to be played at some point, the show will instantly lose a certain something which it will never get back, and be lesser for it.

 

[Vulgar Monkey]

Actually, is it too late to change my vote to 

Spoiler

Space Batman?

 

[Phantoon]

Just now, Vulgar Monkey said:

Actually, is it too late to change my vote to 

  Hide contents

Space Batman?

 

It's never too late

[Benny]

Luxe Luthen.

[sid]

Spaceship lightsabres ❤️
 

if that don’t get you hard you are dead inside

[Alan Stock]

1 hour ago, Benny said:

 

  Hide contents

I really really really really hope that you're wrong.

 

I mean honestly the show has been so good thus far I probably won't mind, but Luthen is already interesting enough without any of that sort of crappy Jedi baggage added as well.

 

One of the things I've liked so much about the show is that the word, or even the concept of "Jedi" has never come up once, as far as I can remember. It makes the show so much better without any of that, and by extension makes the idea of the long forgotten space wizards actually more mysterious and potentially cooler again.

 

So yeah. Please lets not have Luthen be a Jedi. He's just a badass spy, and that's all he needs to be, because badass spies are cool on their own. If they have so little confidence in their audience that that is not enough and the Jedi card has to be played at some point, the show will instantly lose a certain something which it will never get back, and be lesser for it.

 

 

I definitely agree with this and the others who have been saying it for a while. I doubt we'll see it though, I think the creators/writers have the focus narrowed down here and a clear vision.

Spoiler

The only way I think it could work is something like Andor or other rebels seeing a Jedi/Sith just slaughter a load of people in the distance, or somehow dominate. This would help to show the gulf between the 'little guy' and the OP force users. And the normal guys would probably be bitter, or they might talk about how its them who have to deal with the consequences, or loads of them die whilst the force user emerges unscathed. Either that or Luthen uses a Jedi as basically a living weapon in an operation and its Andor and co who have to sacrifice and do the grind to facilitate it. But you'd have to treat it really carefully. I still think its quite unlikely given Rogue One and the series so far whole identity is to focus on the non-force forces (perfect English). I suppose Mandalorian showed that it can still work to introduce force stuff but lets be real, as soon as that happens your attention immediately goes to the shiny Jedi or whatever on the screen, and you'd hope they'd want to differentiate themselves from that.

 

[sid]

This is proof that disney can really manage Star Wars.

 

Now go do knights of the old republic. Take your time, make it great. Go big game of thrones style. Throw up old 70s looking tech in the mix. 
 

you don’t even need much Jedi.

 

hire great male actors. Hire great female actors. Mostly English and Scottish.

 

expand the universe to fuck.

 

Don’t pander any to the tofu eating wokerati. Major fan service. One person in charge of story  and screenplay , no minging pc sounding boards. Hire Chris Nolan’s squad. Or Ridley .

 

Most people love it job done.

 

Now go do a Jedi trilogy about Jedis before the emperor. Way before

[Stoppy2000]

23 minutes ago, sid said:

This is proof that disney can really manage Star Wars.

 

Now go do knights of the old republic. Take your time, make it great. Go big game of thrones style. Throw up old 70s looking tech in the mix. 
 

you don’t even need much Jedi.

 

hire great male actors. Hire great female actors. Mostly English and Scottish.

 

expand the universe to fuck.

 

Don’t pander any to the tofu eating wokerati. Major fan service. One person in charge of story  and screenplay , no minging pc sounding boards. Hire Chris Nolan’s squad. Or Ridley .

 

Most people love it job done.

 

Now go do a Jedi trilogy about Jedis before the emperor. Way before

Tofu eating wokerati? Get to fuck. 

[Darren]

24 minutes ago, sid said:

Don’t pander any to the tofu eating wokerati

Don’t be a cunt.

[Benny]

Don't take the bait.

[Stoppy2000]

Sorry should have known...

 

 

[womblingfree]

23 hours ago, Alan Stock said:

Not much really happened this episode but I enjoyed it, especially some of the performances:

 

  Reveal hidden contents

Mothma probably being the highlight, followed by Forest Whittaker (Guerra). Her silent breakdown whilst still trying to maintain the mask was brilliant, and Whittaker's mannerisms and energy really make Saw come to life.

 

I'm also curious how series 1 will conclude, they're setting up for a funeral showdown of some kind so that will probably be the big climax. They have been focussing a lot on Mothma's side story without much movement, so I'm wondering if something will kick off there, like the inspectors coming in early or her husband betraying her. 

 

Sadly, I too think BB will be going the way of the junk heap via tragedy, although maybe his brain lives on in the droid from Rogue One?

 

I agree with whoever said that there might be blowback from the raid that Luthen is going to sacrifice to preserve his ISB mole. They have put quite a bit of attention on it over the season and although it reinforces the tough decisions the rebels must make, I feel like they've focussed on the raid a little too much for it not to have consequences.

 

The score's really grown on me, but the musical intro this week I didn't really get the reference with those strange-sounding instruments, usually the intro ties into the theme or location of the episode. Did I miss something there?

 

 

I especially noticed this week how many Scottish actors they have on the cast, which is great. At first in the show I thought it was just them diversifying the Evil Posh English Empire a bit, but then more Scottish actors popped up in other roles as well. They are drawing on a broad international pool of accents in Andor, but I just can't remember an American show with this many Scottish folks in it, I wonder if the casting director or some other higher up has some Scottish connection?

A lot of it’s filmed in Scotland and England. Local talent, same reason the Death Star is operated by British character actors.

 

https://www.en-vols.com/en/inspirations-en/andor-filming-locations/#item=5

 

Predictions for the final episode…

 

Spoiler

Mummy’s not dead.

 

Spoiler

Luthen’s either a Jedi or Jedi adjacent.

 

[sid]

😂

[Stoppy2000]

59 minutes ago, womblingfree said:

A lot of it’s filmed in Scotland and England. Local talent, same reason the Death Star is operated by British character actors.

 

https://www.en-vols.com/en/inspirations-en/andor-filming-locations/#item=5

 

Predictions for the final episode…

 

  Reveal hidden contents

Mummy’s not dead.

 

  Reveal hidden contents

Luthen’s either a Jedi or Jedi adjacent.

 

I predict - neither of these things happen. 

[fragglerock]

In some wrap up podcast I listened to the director was saying that in some ways the casting benefited from covid... they were in the UK and we have a deep pool of character actors essentially from coronation street etc... and a lot of them were looking for work so they had a surfeit of talent to draw from.

This also changed some scenes that were meant to be thousands of rando extras to be cut down to just a few people... with a general increase of the quality of the scenes.

[Vulgar Monkey]

Honestly I hadnt even thought of covid til now, so they obviously did a good job working around it!

[Kodamarama]

My favourite aspect of this being filmed in the UK was the exotic, Rio-esque resort planet being equally exotic Thornton Cleveleys. 
 

 

You can really see that slatey cold Irish Sea once you know 🤣

[Benny]

4 hours ago, Kodamarama said:

My favourite aspect of this being filmed in the UK was the exotic, Rio-esque resort planet being equally exotic Thornton Cleveleys. 
 

 

You can really see that slatey cold Irish Sea once you know 🤣

 

 

Spoiler

I particularly liked when they were back on the resort and it was completely deserted and much more like the seafronts of Brexit Britain we all know and love.

 

[Benny]

I can't stop thinking about this bloody show.

 

It's an example of writers who really understand what they're doing and it's actually "about" something. Nearly everything in the show, from the visuals, the dialogue/script and the actions characters take is both stimulated by and affects the world and people around them in a believable and organic way.

 

All the small things in the show informs everything else (an ode to Mon Mothma follows):

 

Spoiler

Take the way Mon Monthma's powerlessness in the face of her daughter going back to the "old ways" is such a heart-breaking scene. She has spent her life fighting injustice as a politician and sees the inexorable encroachment of the Empire assailing everything from without, and yet here, despite and with no relation to the Empire, is her daughter willingly giving herself up to a much older and more entrenched set of subjugating societal values, from her own specific culture, within.

 

And the tragedy of that is that you know Mon Mothma maybe worries that, deep down, she might feel like it has actually been her political life and career fighting for justice which has pushed her daughter away. Hence the earlier in the series scene where her daughter is pushing back at exactly that.

 

In her own way, Mon Mothma's daughter is having her own small rebellion, teenagers being teenagers or not, but it's informed by and pushing back against what she cannot understand or know about that is going through her mother's life. For Mon Mothma, it would also be so easy, so convenient to accept her new banking partner's proposal, as indecent as it might be: it's the solution to her problems, it helps the Rebellion, and her own daughter would probably play right into it willingly. But she can't do that, because she really does love her daughter and wants a more idealised life that is best for her, and unlike Luthen, she is not willing quite yet to sacrifice everything for the cause.

 

Because that is what it would mean, sacrificing her own sense of self, morality and even family. Even if ironically it could also bring her and her daughter closer together, in the twisted way in which it would allow her daughter to explore her people's faded traditions.

 

It's fascinating. And the fact I can even write about this in this kind of detail, about just one facet of a character in this show, I think demonstrates that it's firing on so many levels above and beyond what has ever been in Star Wars before, let alone most sci fi shows you get these days. They always seem to drop the ball somewhere, or have so little confidence in themselves or lack such a consistency of vision. 

 

[Benny]

And that's before I even start talking about the incredible Dedra/Syril scene where he is clearly drawn to and worships the power and twisted "justice" that she represents:

 

Spoiler

Far from being a creepy stalker or whatever, his interest in her is likely anything but sexual - it's the pure and terrifying passion of a true believer. And you can see in Dedra's eyes, no matter how disgusted she initially looks with him, seeing him as a pathetic sort, there is just a small glimmer of interest to see such fervour and passion for the Empire, and the way he is so clearly awestruck by her and what she represents. So for all her jackbooted competence, you imagine that maybe that small scene could have sparked a little bit more of the lust for power and the pride of ideology that clearly exists within her.

 

This is demonstrated in the interrogation scene: her mask slips and we see she clearly loves people to grovel and suffer at her feet. It is horrifying and almost sexual in her attitude and dominance.

 

They could well both be effectively drawn to each other for those reasons, in a sort of twisted Nazi fairy tale.

 

[Unofficial Who]

Regarding Luthen's countermeasures on his ship...

 

Spoiler

...I'm pretty sure they weren't missiles or explosives but just metal spikes designed just for this purpose right?

I mean it's a sound tactic.

 

-Get caught in tractor beam.

-Accelerate to counter tractor beam,

-Open rear doors and just let the tractor beam turn the tiny bits of metal into fast moving impact missiles.

 

Makes sense. There's plausible deniability if his ship is ever searched "Ah, that's just some old scrap metal I was going to sell to scrappers." And let loose suddenly it's like throwing utensils into an MRI.

 

[Girth Certificate]

yeah that's what I took it to be. Like when some raving lunatic is trying to open your car door you hold on to it until he's pulling as hard as he can and then you let go so it knocks him down and then you peel out running over his legs with your rear tyres.

[Grobbelboy]

Yes, when watching the Luthen scene that was EXACTLY the familiar incident I was reminded of as well. 

[cavalcade]

51 minutes ago, Girth Certificate said:

Like when some raving lunatic is trying to open your car door you hold on to it until he's pulling as hard as he can and then you let go so it knocks him down and then you peel out running over his legs with your rear tyres.

 

mondays am i rite

[Vulgar Monkey]

6 hours ago, Unofficial Who said:

Regarding Luthen's countermeasures on his ship...

 

  Hide contents

...I'm pretty sure they weren't missiles or explosives but just metal spikes designed just for this purpose right?

I mean it's a sound tactic.

 

-Get caught in tractor beam.

-Accelerate to counter tractor beam,

-Open rear doors and just let the tractor beam turn the tiny bits of metal into fast moving impact missiles.

 

Makes sense. There's plausible deniability if his ship is ever searched "Ah, that's just some old scrap metal I was going to sell to scrappers." And let loose suddenly it's like throwing utensils into an MRI.

 

 

 

Spoiler

Saw a yt vid the other day on Spacedock that mentioned a detail I'd missed - the reason he accelerates before launching them was to bait the imps into turning up their tractor even higher, meaning the flechettes hit even harder. Using their own strength against them, like any good insurgent.

 

[Steve McQueef]

Luthen's one stone-cold straight up, badassed motherfucker. 

[sid]

On 20/11/2022 at 11:33, Benny said:

I can't stop thinking about this bloody show.

 

It's an example of writers who really understand what they're doing and it's actually "about" something. Nearly everything in the show, from the visuals, the dialogue/script and the actions characters take is both stimulated by and affects the world and people around them in a believable and organic way.

 

All the small things in the show informs everything else (an ode to Mon Mothma follows):

 

  Hide contents

Take the way Mon Monthma's powerlessness in the face of her daughter going back to the "old ways" is such a heart-breaking scene. She has spent her life fighting injustice as a politician and sees the inexorable encroachment of the Empire assailing everything from without, and yet here, despite and with no relation to the Empire, is her daughter willingly giving herself up to a much older and more entrenched set of subjugating societal values, from her own specific culture, within.

 

And the tragedy of that is that you know Mon Mothma maybe worries that, deep down, she might feel like it has actually been her political life and career fighting for justice which has pushed her daughter away. Hence the earlier in the series scene where her daughter is pushing back at exactly that.

 

In her own way, Mon Mothma's daughter is having her own small rebellion, teenagers being teenagers or not, but it's informed by and pushing back against what she cannot understand or know about that is going through her mother's life. For Mon Mothma, it would also be so easy, so convenient to accept her new banking partner's proposal, as indecent as it might be: it's the solution to her problems, it helps the Rebellion, and her own daughter would probably play right into it willingly. But she can't do that, because she really does love her daughter and wants a more idealised life that is best for her, and unlike Luthen, she is not willing quite yet to sacrifice everything for the cause.

 

Because that is what it would mean, sacrificing her own sense of self, morality and even family. Even if ironically it could also bring her and her daughter closer together, in the twisted way in which it would allow her daughter to explore her people's faded traditions.

 

It's fascinating. And the fact I can even write about this in this kind of detail, about just one facet of a character in this show, I think demonstrates that it's firing on so many levels above and beyond what has ever been in Star Wars before, let alone most sci fi shows you get these days. They always seem to drop the ball somewhere, or have so little confidence in themselves or lack such a consistency of vision. 

 

One of my favourite things about Star Wars is peoples passion for it ❤️ Great post

[FishyFish]

The Guardian calling it as one of the best shows of the year...

 

https://www.theguardian.com/tv-and-radio/2022/nov/22/andor-how-a-star-wars-deep-cut-became-one-of-the-best-tv-shows-of-the-year?CMP=Share_AndroidApp_Other

 

Quote

Andor: how a Star Wars deep cut became one of the best TV shows of the year

 

The article contains spoilers, so don't read if you've not watched it yet.