Elden Ring - chortlesome japes

[Vemsie]

22 minutes ago, BadgerFarmer said:

Nameless King and Abyss Watchers too (and probably some in the DLC). Can't stand them. When the bosses are the kind that take time to learn, the last thing I want is to have to repeat a long sequence I've already figured out every time I want to get to the bit I haven't. There were also too many big guy in a square room type fights in DS3. And, yeah, I just found them really hard, like it wanted me to play like Bloodborne but without the moves to do it.

 

Capra Demon? That's one of the best of all. Just the kind of leftfield, ballsy design I like, and guaranteed to have me on edge every time I enter that room. I'd love something as smart as Capra Demon in ER, rather than variations of things we've done a dozen times before. 

I don't really like Capra Demon because of how cramped that area is and I don't think the art direction is anything special either. On the other hand, I absolutely adore Abyss Watchers. Using the AI to fight each other is great and the presentation and music are phenomenal.

[Oz]

20 minutes ago, Vemsie said:

I don't really like Capra Demon because of how cramped that area is and I don't think the art direction is anything special either. On the other hand, I absolutely adore Abyss Watchers. Using the AI to fight each other is great and the presentation and music are phenomenal.

The real demon is the arena and the camera. you are figthing yourself (as you are the viewer/camera). this is some meta shit From is doing. 

[Vemsie]

1 hour ago, robdood said:

Well this spiralled off into an interesting tangent.  I don't think the bosses are bad (especially in the more recent games), though I'd agree with Vemsie that Sekiro's bosses are their best.  Last boss Isshin is freakin' amazing in that game.  It's long but I loved it. 

 

Elden Ring seems very interesting in terms of the new block/attack mechanics, things like heavy attacks, the attack-after-blocking, and jumping attack dealing big posture damage is really cool, bosses being reliably, repeatably knocked for crits is definitely a good thing.  If anything my biggest gripe with bosses in games prior to Sekiro was that the mechanics like parrying don't really work against them. 

Yes, Isshin is the best.

I must say I never really tried parrying much in earlier Dark Souls games, though it is how I beat Gwyn, but I though gun parrying worked very well in Bloodborne against smaller-sized opponents like Bloodletting Beast, Orphan of Kos (one of my other all-time fave bosses) and Lady Maria.

Looking forward to the new stuff in Elden Ring, especially since I haven't played the network test. Can't wait really.

[amorenod]

6 minutes ago, Vemsie said:

Bloodletting Beast

 

I asume you mean Blood Starved Beast, the Bloodletting Beast is a giant MOFO

[Mike S]

For those complaining about the difficulty of bosses in Sekiro there is a video out there of some lad speed running it in a few hours so it can't be all that hard. Also, he was blindfolded.

 

As for bosses in all the other games, I have never really understood the complaints as summoning players and/or NPC's will render them trivial (at least on the two or three I have tried it out on when rushing, or not being in the mood, on replays).

[df0]

I tink Isshin is utter trash, worse than that hateful demon prick.

 

Other people can kill him in 37 seconds, cool. Some do it blindfolded, cool. I think he's rubbish. Four phases, fuck fight off. I don't have the time or patience (or heck, resources) to start over from scratch every god damned time I make the slightest mistake.

[kensei]

1 hour ago, Vemsie said:

I don't really like Capra Demon because of how cramped that area is and I don't think the art direction is anything special either. On the other hand, I absolutely adore Abyss Watchers. Using the AI to fight each other is great and the presentation and music are phenomenal.

 

Capra Demon epitomises the tightness of Dark Souls design. One of the patches made the fight easier by moving the dogs back slightly. This means you'd a split second before they were on you once you were in the fight, which was crucial.

 

It also deliberately limits your options - no kiting here - and uses the environment as an important aspect of the fight. I am with @BadgerFarmer, it's one of the best in the series.

[Kevvy Metal]

Just like to add my two pence that hating on the bosses in these games make the littlest sense to me. They are the game and the meat to it all that the levels are leading you to. Playing these games while disliking... the concept of bosses is just completely bamboozling to me. 

But horses for course and all that. 

[Parappa]

Gone Gold ... - New footage. 

Spoiler

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=upLIsQjhHKE

[df0]

Capra one of the best in the series? Out of morbid curiosity, who do you rank higher?

[Wiper]

51 minutes ago, Kevvy Metal said:

Just like to add my two pence that hating on the bosses in these games make the littlest sense to me. They are the game and the meat to it all that the levels are leading you to. Playing these games while disliking... the concept of bosses is just completely bamboozling to me. 

But horses for course and all that. 

 

The games do also get widely praised for their world-building, level design, generic encounter design* and enigmatic storytelling, so it's not as though the boss fights are the only appeal; I'd certainly enjoy the Souls games more if I could keep all of those qualities and drop (or drop the difficulty of) the boss fights.

 

*as in, encounters with generic enemies, not me calling the encounters generic in design

[dizogg]

Any news on if this will be better on PS5 of Series X? Currently swaying towards PS5 as it seems like the more natural ‘home’. 

[Number 28]

I think this is your video;

(I cba to watch it again, but IIRC PS5 came out on top. Correct me if wrong.)

[Uncle Mike]

16 minutes ago, Wiper said:

The games do also get widely praised for their world-building, level design, generic encounter design* and enigmatic storytelling, so it's not as though the boss fights are the only appeal; I'd certainly enjoy the Souls games more if I could keep all of those qualities and drop (or drop the difficulty of) the boss fights.

 

Indeed. I got to completely finish and love the PS5 Demon's Souls remake precisely because the bosses are mostly easier, have a gimmick and aren't these crazy oversized massive swipe monsters. And it's the levels, the world, the bread and butter encounters that make these games for me.

[HarryBizzle]

28 minutes ago, dizogg said:

Any news on if this will be better on PS5 of Series X? Currently swaying towards PS5 as it seems like the more natural ‘home’. 

The only way to get a locked 60fps on consoles is to play the PS4 Pro version on PS5. Luckily, the PS4 version comes with a free PS5 option, so you have access to both. 

[Fargo]

Hopefully it’s seen some optimisation across all platforms since the beta 

[Number 28]

Yeah, things might have been optimised. I'm glad I never had to deal with those Bloodborne loading screens when that first launched.

[Strafe]

For those that want the difficulty of the game lowered, Hidetaka Miyazaki designed the games around giving the player “accomplishment by overcoming tremendous odds”.

 

That’s the rationale behind the game’s difficulty. That’s what the man said. That’s his vision.

 

I now expect anyone who moans about the difficulty to be given a permaban.

 

I also expect there will be more than one occasion post release that I will walk back on this comment quite hard so the rule does not apply to me.

[Popo]

2 hours ago, Wiper said:

or drop the difficulty

[Jolly]

I see the bits between the bosses in From games to be exactly that - the bits between the bosses. It's the big dudes that I remember and love and everything else is just build up. I think you could remove the non-boss sections entirely and it would still function and fundamentally have the same spirit. Not so convinced it would work the other way round..?

 

Happy to be convinced otherwise though - what an interesting chat! Good work, forum. 

[Kiwi Cake]

For me Souls games are all about exploring strange, new worlds and uncovering all the mad lore therein. I can take or leave actual boss fights, though bosses in Souls games are usually excellently designed and have plenty of mad lore associated with them.

 

Even the Bed of Chaos, one of the worst bosses ever designed by man, has a cool backstory.

[Popo]

28 minutes ago, Jolly said:

I see the bits between the bosses in From games to be exactly that - the bits between the bosses. It's the big dudes that I remember and love and everything else is just build up. I think you could remove the non-boss sections entirely and it would still function and fundamentally have the same spirit. Not so convinced it would work the other way round..?

 

Happy to be convinced otherwise though - what an interesting chat! Good work, forum. 

That would be like having pudding for breakfast, lunch and dinner. For a month. 
 

Everything in moderation. You need the exploration and smaller enemies to make the bosses feel special and different. 

[Oz]

6 hours ago, df0 said:

Capra one of the best in the series? Out of morbid curiosity, who do you rank higher?

Maneater obviously 

[Melon_Bread]

Never really understood the dislike of bosses, bosses are awesome. Prob why I like MH so much, cuz it's non stop boss battles.

Cannot wait for this game, I am in a sort of gaming holding pattern at the moment playing anything just to pass the time until this comes out.

[Vemsie]

8 hours ago, amorenod said:

 

I asume you mean Blood Starved Beast, the Bloodletting Beast is a giant MOFO

 

I do indeed. It's been too long.

[Oz]

8 hours ago, df0 said:

I tink Isshin is utter trash, worse than that hateful demon prick.

 

Other people can kill him in 37 seconds, cool. Some do it blindfolded, cool. I think he's rubbish. Four phases, fuck fight off. I don't have the time or patience (or heck, resources) to start over from scratch every god damned time I make the slightest mistake.

Maybe you were hesitating with isshin? 

[Mike S]

1 hour ago, Popo said:

That would be like having pudding for breakfast, lunch and dinner. For a month. 

 

 

This sounds amazing.

 

Please let Elden Ring be all these puddings!

[kensei]

7 hours ago, df0 said:

Capra one of the best in the series? Out of morbid curiosity, who do you rank higher?

 

In no particular order:

 

Smough and Ornstein

The Griffin that opens the DLC

Sif

Artoris

Flamelurker

 

Gascoigne and Amelia if you include Bloodborne. I have a soft spot for Dark Souls 2, but the entire game is janky and I never got on with Dark Souls 3, where the phases really began to annoy me. Dancer maybe qualifies.

 

But mostly, it's what was memorable for me. Capra was a test you did not forget in a hurry particularly in early patches. And it wasn't just a big thing in a room and had some thought into it.

 

Plus it has spawned a few excellent memes. Do ya like dags?

[Majora]

I'm also in the 'I prefer the non-boss sections' camp. Sure, there are some great bosses in the From games, but for me they're all about exploration, atmosphere and sense of place. Picking your way methodically through an evocative new area, finding secrets and items and wondering what lurks around every corner with equal measures of anticipation and dread.

 

When I think of Dark Souls I immediately of the paths you take through Undead Burg and Undead Parish, Anor Londo, the forest, the sewers, Blight Town, Sen's Fortress and so on. All amazing levels whose brilliance has very little to do with the big fights right at the end. The bosses are pretty much an afterthought in my fond memories. It's all about location.

[Doctor Shark]

The bosses in souls game are mostly amazing, mostly very memorable, but for me it’s the world and the exploration, same as @Kiwi Cake, that make the games. Seeing how the areas link together in dark souls is still an amazing memory, more than any boss in the game. I can remember every area in that game, but not every boss.