Football Thread 2019/2020

[wev]

The fines need to be increased heavily and the sections of the stadiums closed need to be facing the cameras.  Points should be deducted and maybe even their rankings affected, maybe then the local FAs will take it more seriously.

 

But yes, England should walk off and the bigger nations should refuse to play against racist shits like this lot.

[dizogg]

Ian Wright’s talking like racism has just been solved. Appreciate it’s a step forward but...

[Bacon Horsemeat]

Football wise, that was a great thrashing.

[feltmonkey]

England should have walked off in the second half when the abuse continued. Unfortunately I think Ian Wright is wrong - this isn't a watershed moment. Half a stand was taken, and then we backed down. 

[Stopharage]

Pretty obvious who a lot of the racist perpetrators were today. If the Bulgarians and UEFA have the real appetite to prosecute the racist morons then there’s enough decent video footage to do so. I’d suspect that won’t be the case though; most of those idiots will probably be ultras with links to organised crime.

 

Proud of the team tonight though; no doubt that experience will bring them closer together. 

[wev]

I'm very surprised Ian Wright has given the opinion he has, he's a minority in regards to black pundits (him, Rio and Jenas? I know I'll be missing someone) and he's usually the most outspoken. Though I think the reason he feels it's a watershed moment is because England and the match officials made some threats and people were removed from the stadium.

 

I very much doubt they were arrested or anything beyond a nominal fucking fine for the Bulgarian FA will come of it, and the chanting continued anyway, but as the guy from the FA said, because it was spread in spots throughout the stadium UEFA did fuck all about it. If it's spread into pockets of the stadium then that's more than it just being a group of Ultras

[feltmonkey]

I think Ian Wright was just delighted that some form of stand was taken during the match, and he's right in that regard, definitely.  I can completely understand why he would be happy that there was some response.  He was clearly thinking back to when he was playing and had to ignore the abuse, he had no way of fighting back against it during the match itself.  He would have probably felt quite alone when told to get on with it by his white teammates, as he seemed to be implying happened.  It's fantastic that the whole England team stood together and were prepared to walk off.  Of course, the problem is that in the second half, when there was less racism, nothing was done.  Is the scattered racist chanting around the stadium fine, then?  Is that an acceptable level of racism? 

 

It's great that something was done, that those nazis were thrown out (although they should be arrested and banned for life from every football stadium in the world, but of course they won't be) but this needs to be just the start.  Teams standing together and threatening to walk off, teams alerting the UEFA officials to chanting - this needs to continue, and it needs to happen whenever there is any racist chanting, not just when there is a highly visible section of ultras making some kind of organised pro-racism demonstration, as these cunts appeared to be doing.  

 

The behavior of the Bulgarian management needs to be looked at, too.  When the match was stopped, the manager of Bulgaria was gesticulating, questioning the decision of the UEFA officials.  He seemed to be saying, "what's the problem?"  When this sort of thing happens, we need all the football people to stand together and condemn the racists.  Teams need to be prepared to stand up to their own fans.  Otherwise it looks like some away team trying to nullify the home support.  

 

This is awful.  I hope it's a turning point, but I suspect it will be a one-off, and things will go back to exactly the way they were.  I've just watched England win 6-0 away in an important qualifier, with every goal a thing of beauty, and I feel sick and depressed. 

[neoELITE]

Ian Wright also had kids and relatives who've played professional football so it isn't like his direct experience ended 20 years ago. His son Bradley still plays in the USA. He has a grandchild currently at the Man City academy. He's very much invested in this.

 

FIFA and UEFA need to do something major. If Bulgarian, Croatian, Spanish 'fans' do this, let those nation's play all their fixtures as away fixtures. Both matches Vs England at Wembley for example. 

[Luseth]

9 minutes ago, neoELITE said:

Ian Wright also had kids and relatives who've played professional football so it isn't like his direct experience ended 20 years ago. His son Bradley still plays in the USA. He has a grandchild currently at the Man City academy. He's very much invested in this.

 

FIFA and UEFA need to do something major. If Bulgarian, Croatian, Spanish 'fans' do this, let those nation's play all their fixtures as away fixtures. Both matches Vs England at Wembley for example. 

 

Surely the biggest example would be to expel them from UEFA until they book their ideas up?

 

Or maybe a 3 strike and your out, so that game last night would have been 1, if it happens twice more in the next 10 years they are banned for 10 years or something.

[Boothjan]

Bulgaria and any other nation that allows racism to go unpunished simply have to be expelled from tournaments. What fucking use is a half full ground and a few lousy flags? It's a serious problem and the interview with the Bulgarian coach AFTER that shameful match shows how bad the problem is because he 'didn't hear any racist chanting' and that 'England fans didn't behave themselves'. 

 

This isn't even close to being sorted and won't be until UEFA grow a pair and start dishing out appropriate sanctions. Personally, I don't think they deem it to be that serious an issue. Woe betide it's something mega serious like wearing a pair of Paddy Power pants under a player's shorts  

[neoELITE]

One thing people probably aren't thinking about is if FIFA or EUFA make a high profile issue of it, it's a red flag to the racist minority to turn up and be overtly racist. The no respect sweatshirt held up a prime example. It's not easy stewarding or policing 25,000 people in real time during a game. That can only be dealt with by having no fans present and who wants that?

 

It's a really difficult issue that football probably can't deal with by itself.

[Gotters]

19 minutes ago, neoELITE said:

One thing people probably aren't thinking about is if FIFA or EUFA make a high profile issue of it, it's a red flag to the racist minority to turn up and be overtly racist. The no respect sweatshirt held up a prime example. It's not easy stewarding or policing 25,000 people in real time during a game. That can only be dealt with by having no fans present and who wants that?

 

It's a really difficult issue that football probably can't deal with by itself.

 

Yup, agree - this isn't a 'won't somebody think of the poor racists' post but there are a lot of dead rubbers and pointless international fixtures, a super hardline crackdown will I suspect encourage racism to become a means of minority group protest against national FAs, unpopular managers etc as people will know you can cause huge disruption with just a handful of idiots.

 

That and the fact that genuine racists will see it as a good platform and exposure for their abhorrent views.

 

I don't think UEFA help themselves by saying 'no comment' after last nights match but not sure that bans or empty stadiums helps things.

[Art Vandelay]

Russia were given the boot across the board until they sorted their doping issues out, and were't allowed back until they had shown enough progress to WADA. Now, that's maybe not the best example given how poorly doping is monitored, but the principle should be the same. It's not like we're dealing with an FA who are earnestly trying to solve the issue. The manager, the journalists. the President of the country doesn't give a shiny shite. Just fuck them off in to the wilderness and let the ground rot. This is an issue they need to take to heart, and until they do then frankly who wants them? It's difficult to prove you're being pro-active when you let an army of neo-fascists stroll about like they own the place.

 

UEFA aren't going to solve this issue with timid hectoring and ridiculous stoppages.

[Boothjan]

Are individual nations doing enough though? How strict is ticketing/stewarding in offending countries?

 

In this country we can dish out stadium bans etc - shit like this needs for individual football associations and UEFA to work harder and work together and IMO nowhere near enough is being done. 

 

Comments like Balakov's last night - and certain sections of the Italian media - show that there are far too many people in prominent roles within the game who don't think it's a big deal. This sort of archaic ignorance needs to be stopped because otherwise, it's an issue that will never be fixed. 

[JohnC]

The Bulgarian PM has told their head of football to quit and ordered the sports minister to suspend all involvement with the football association, including financial, until it happens. 
 

https://news.sky.com/story/bulgarian-pm-demands-head-of-football-quits-over-racial-chants-at-england-players-11836131

[Baring]

18 premier league moments

[wev]

It's missing the Lee Bowyer v Kieron Dyer world featherweight match.

[Yobo Ahoy]

Plus Shearer's one should have been when he booted Lennon in the head.

[Gotters]

1 minute ago, Yobo Ahoy said:

Plus Shearer's one should have been when he booted Lennon in the head.

 

after he threatened to never play for England again is was ruled by the FA Lennon flung his face into Shearer's boot

[Boyatsea]

2 hours ago, Boothjan said:

Are individual nations doing enough though? How strict is ticketing/stewarding in offending countries?

 

In this country we can dish out stadium bans etc - shit like this needs for individual football associations and UEFA to work harder and work together and IMO nowhere near enough is being done. 

 

Comments like Balakov's last night - and certain sections of the Italian media - show that there are far too many people in prominent roles within the game who don't think it's a big deal. This sort of archaic ignorance needs to be stopped because otherwise, it's an issue that will never be fixed. 

 

I agree with this, but I think there is a misunderstanding that many people have that whatever UEFA, or FIFA, or the FA does can somehow be the 'right' response, or solve the problem. I was in two minds about what England did last night - my gut feels like they should have left the pitch just before half time and abandoned the match. It would have been a strong response, but at the same time, other people noted that if they had done that, all the talk would have been about when the match was going to be replayed - it would have muddied the focus.

 

So maybe playing on, showing our class and smashing in six goals was the best reply. I'm not sure.

 

As for UEFA, Bulgaria should not only be kicked out of Euro 2020 qualifying - which matters not, given they're not going to qualify anyway - but also qualifying for the World Cup 2022 qualifying as well. This would be a strong, strong statement and force the Bulgarian FA to take responsibility for what happens inside their stadium, but it doesn't actually solve the problem of racism in and of itself, and I think the media inadvertently pushes the idea that it does.

[Hylian]

What's the one with the arsenal players and the referee?

[Fry Crayola]

What happened last night was shameful. UEFA don't do enough, that much is clear - a partial stadium closure is barely a slap on the wrist when the ultras are still getting into the crowd. Sanctions need to be on the level of points deductions, neutral venues (as a preference over playing behind closed doors) and tournament bans.

 

Of course, let's not forget that this isn't something that only applies in Central Europe - England has its own problem with racism, and while I don't think there's anything on the scale of organised abuse and demonstration like last night, there's still work to be done at home.

 

Smashing six goals against them is an excellent response, though I do feel had the game been more delicately poised at half time, England would have been of the mind to walk. 

[Fry Crayola]

1 hour ago, Baring said:

18 premier league moments

 

Tony Yeboah's strike isn't hitting the bar. What is this?

[Timmo]

16 minutes ago, Hylian said:

What's the one with the arsenal players and the referee?

 

Sent off Gibbs instead of Oxlade Chamberlain.

 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/26711403

[Hylian]

1 hour ago, wev said:

It's missing the Lee Bowyer v Kieron Dyer world featherweight match.

If we're going for worst behaviour, Ben Thatcher's assault on Pedro Mendes would get my vote. I still wince when I see it. Just a yellow!

Spoiler

 

[Fry Crayola]

Ireland are in an interesting situation tonight. Beat the Swiss and achieve qualification with a game to spare, while a draw and a defeat will both lead to the same requirement on the final day - a win at home against Denmark. So there's no real value in playing for the draw. 

 

Ireland being Ireland, I can see Mick being cautious enough for 65 minutes or so, staying in the game before rolling the dice on Connolly and other attackers to inject a little something and maybe nick a result. Switzerland were the better side against Denmark on Saturday and but for Schmeichel would have won, yet came away with nothing. That's what McCarthy would be looking to emulate. Much as I'd rather see caution thrown to the wind and an attacking Ireland side take the field, it's not likely to happen. But there's a chance of something big.

 

McCarthy may also be looking to see if Georgia can do him a favour next month and pick a point of the Swiss, a result which is only useful if Ireland draw tonight. It's a bit too bet-hedgey for my liking.

[Dudley]

21 hours ago, dizogg said:

Yep it should be like the job of a boxing ref, if a player appears to lose consciousness then they go off. End of. It would protect genuinely injured players, and it would stop people play acting.

 

Actually expanding this I quite like the "If a player is on the ground for more than 10 seconds he needs to be subbed" idea.

[Plissken]

No. You will get players who need to just stay down getting up again before they should. See the two players who Coleman walloped on Saturday.

 

Ultimately football needs a proper concussion protocol. And referees need a reminder that they can send people off from the opening whistle. Crocking James was clearly a premeditated act.

[JamesTW]

Surely Aguero or maybe even Collymore should be on that premier league moments thing

[Silent Runner]

Switzerland 1 up and it has been coming. Feels like this could be a long night for Ireland. 

 

The pitch is in a shocking state - looks like something from 80's football.