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Thor 4: Love and Thunder - 2022


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12 hours ago, dreamylittledream said:

Honestly you are lot are such a joyless bunch of killjoys at times.

 

This was great fun, felt like an 80s cartoon turned into a movie; frenetic silly and really quite funny in places. I particularly enjoyed Stormbreaker as the jealous girlfriend when Mojinor returned.

 

Not quite as good as Ragnorok but moved at a blistering pace with the jokes coming thick and fast. Loved Crowe’s Zeus and pretty sure the cinematographers have played a bit of Destiny 2…all the sequences in the shadow realm particularly the fight with the kids felt like they were taking place in the Ascendent Realm.

 

Loved it anyway


I’d probably agree with you if I found more of the jokes funny. As it was they were either painful or it felt like the cast were practically slapping one another on the back over how witty and irreverent the whole thing is. 

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Loads to unpick with what went wrong here, but the thing I'm most disappointed with was the cramming-in of (arguably) the two best Thor stories - the God Butcher and Jane's Mighty Thor arc - and doing a major disservice in action, character and emotion to both.  Completely squandered.

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Didn't really enjoy this, and Ragnarok is my favourite of the Marvel films. It's not nearly as funny as the first one,

 

Spoiler

although "half our soldiers are always dead!" is a fantastic line and I enjoyed the jealous axe bits,

 

and it all felt pretty stilted and disjointed. I think it was missing a gloriously camp antagonist like Cate Blanchett - Bale sort of bizarrely hopped from sombre evil to Ron Moody's Fagin and back again, and he completely jarred with the tone of the rest of the film. 50% of his performance would have been perfect for a straight villain role in one of their more traditional Avengers films, seems a shame to have wasted him in this. Russell Crowe was great but it felt like he was only in the film for five minutes.

 

I'm also not sure if I missed a line but I'm a bit confused as to why the gang were so desperate to

 

Spoiler

stop Bale reaching Eternity. Wasn't his plan just to resurrect his daughter? It seemed like a bit of an odd thing for Portman's character to sacrifice herself to (fail to) prevent.

 

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16 minutes ago, PK said:

 

 

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I'm also not sure if I missed a line but I'm a bit confused as to why the gang were so desperate to

 

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stop Bale reaching Eternity. Wasn't his plan just to resurrect his daughter? It seemed like a bit of an odd thing for Portman's character to sacrifice herself to (fail to) prevent.

 

 

Spoiler

I think until he reached the gate his plan was to use the wish to kill all the gods.

 

I'm not sure why Bale didn't think he could use the power to do this before - possibly the corruption of the dark blade or whatever?

 

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To @PK & @Delargey

 

Spoiler

The plan was for him to kill all the gods, using the power of the wish granted by Eternity.

 

And the reason he couldn't just use the power from the blade was because it was killing him - so he wouldn't have time to go around and kill them all.

 

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5 minutes ago, Gabe said:

To @PK & @Delargey

 

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The plan was for him to kill all the gods, using the power of the wish granted by Eternity.

 

And the reason he couldn't just use the power from the blade was because it was killing him - so he wouldn't have time to go around and kill them all.

 

 

Yeah, I just don’t quite get why Bale s

Spoiler

Plan wasn't to use the wish to bring his daughter back from the off.

 

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Just now, Delargey said:

 

Yeah, I just don’t quite get why Bale s

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Plan wasn't to use the wish to bring his daughter back from the off.

 

Spoiler

The blade corrupted him and made him evil (plus he knew it was killing him, so he wouldn't get to be with his daughter regardless), but it was the Power of LoveTM  that made him all happy again and change his goal from destruction to happy things.

 

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5 minutes ago, HarryBizzle said:

The other odd/crap thing about this movie is that it does an awful job of explaining why we should care if Gorr kills all the gods. Every one of them is depicted as selfish and unpleasant except for Thor.

I suppose it's to be an analogy of the Greeks (in the eyes of the Romans) becoming too interested in the finer things in life, which caused their civilisations to fall into decline. Which is then an analogy for current times. Or perhaps it isn't that clever and was just to add some sympathy to Blae's cause

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3 hours ago, Gabe said:

To @PK & @Delargey

 

  Reveal hidden contents

The plan was for him to kill all the gods, using the power of the wish granted by Eternity.

 

And the reason he couldn't just use the power from the blade was because it was killing him - so he wouldn't have time to go around and kill them all.

 


I don’t think it was killing him, unless I completely missed that. He dies if the sword is destroyed. 

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There's a deleted scene doing the rounds that makes it look like a lot was changed at the last minute plot wise.

 

 

It's a good point about all the gods being selfish arseholes. Even the Asgardians with all their technology so advanced it might as well be magic are just using it run a chintzy tourist trap and shill cheap aftershave. The film feels like it’s on the verge of something thematically where the god characters we've been following realise they are squandering their gifts and should be helping civilisations instead. But it never materialises and you get a tacked on feeling power of love ending.

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6 minutes ago, Harsin said:

There's a deleted scene doing the rounds that makes it look like a lot was changed at the last minute plot wise.

Haven’t see that deleted scene myself (yet), but makes a lot of sense that much of the film was changed at the last minute. Really felt like that was the case; like the film we saw released in the cinema wasn’t finished somehow, and (IMO) needed more time and reshoots to get it half-decent.

 

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Quote

"There were whole sequences, planets, characters, and worlds that didn't end up in the movie that were hilarious and amazing and [that] we spent a lot of time and energy on, and certainly the entire crew also designing and conceiving. It's just amazing how much great material is not in the film, considering how much great material is in it. Usually, it's like, you're just trying to get enough good stuff to put in the film, and this had overflow. So that was really surprising."


I bet the artists were well pleased that all their work ended up on the cutting room floor because Chris Hemsworth was playing Whole Line Is It Anyway.

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1 hour ago, HarryBizzle said:


I don’t think it was killing him, unless I completely missed that. He dies if the sword is destroyed. 

It was mentioned that the sword poisons as well as corrupts and kills its user after a while - I can't recall if Thor says it when explaining to Jane and Valkyrie or if it is part of the sequence near the beginning - but it does get stated.

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1 hour ago, Harsin said:

Even the Asgardians with all their technology so advanced it might as well be magic are just using it run a chintzy tourist trap and shill cheap aftershave.

 

I don’t think your run of the mill Asgardians are gods - like the Valkyries aren’t, I don’t think.


The whole thing is a bit weird. It’s not clear what a God actually is. In Thor 1, the Asgardians are basically powerful aliens who ancient Vikings thought must be Gods when they helped them out once. But this seems to tie Gods into belief systems and what not and it’s not really clear what makes someone a God or not. My understanding was that apart from Thor’s family, the only other possible Asgardian who might be a god is Heimdall.

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There's basically too many things going on at once. The previous Thor films expected you to accept: what if Norse gods real but space aliens. The sequel brought in more Norse mythology, as did Ragnarok (with a side quest to a trash planet).

 

This one just throws bloody everything at you.

 

Spoiler

You have the space shit, but then also Norse shit, but then also all other gods were also space aliens, but unlike the Norse gods they all hang out on The Citadel from Mass Effect or something. And also Eternity is not a "god" like those but more like an actual omnipotent god... And like, just slow down, introduce concepts more slowly. Don't just throw the entire contents of several runs of comics into a film all at once and expect them to work together because of quick and dirty improv gags being smeared all over it by the actors.

 

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15 minutes ago, Benny said:

There's basically too many things going on at once. The previous Thor films expected you to accept: what if Norse gods real but space aliens. The sequel brought in more Norse mythology, as did Ragnarok (with a side quest to a trash planet).

 

This one just throws bloody everything at you.

 

  Hide contents

You have the space shit, but then also Norse shit, but then also all other gods were also space aliens, but unlike the Norse gods they all hang out on The Citadel from Mass Effect or something. And also Eternity is not a "god" like those but more like an actual omnipotent god... And like, just slow down, introduce concepts more slowly. Don't just throw the entire contents of several runs of comics into a film all at once and expect them to work together because of quick and dirty improv gags being smeared all over it by the actors.

 

 

Waikiti doesn't give a fuck. 

This is an arrogant shrug of a film.

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3 hours ago, HarryBizzle said:

 

I don’t think your run of the mill Asgardians are gods - like the Valkyries aren’t, I don’t think.


The whole thing is a bit weird. It’s not clear what a God actually is. In Thor 1, the Asgardians are basically powerful aliens who ancient Vikings thought must be Gods when they helped them out once. But this seems to tie Gods into belief systems and what not and it’s not really clear what makes someone a God or not. My understanding was that apart from Thor’s family, the only other possible Asgardian who might be a god is Heimdall.


Gods in Marvel are all powerful, long living space people of various persuasions.

 

Although when you dig down, even the most powerful beings in the Marvel Universe usually started out as a janitor called Dave.

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Made me laugh out loud more than any other Marvel movie I can remember.  

 

Spoiler

Ninny-Nonny,

Maybe your arm’s in Valhalla? Meditating just made me more angry.

Jane Fonda/Jodie Foster.

The jealous axe creeping up.

Killer bunny.

 

Are some of the ones I was still giggling about when the film was over.

 

Didn’t think it detracted from the drama of the finale, which brought a tear to those of us watching.

 

Then 

Spoiler

“Love” being a smart-mouth brat, was spot on. And the crescendo of G’n’R as they leapt up to clobber the monsters as the neon titles kicked in..


…just left me happy.

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