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Football Thread 2020/2021


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1 hour ago, Adrock said:

Anyone watching the Southampton vs Wolves game? Danny Ings is an excellent striker, I would be happy if Liverpool signed him again, it's not gonna happen though.

 

Is Coady struggling with the change to a four man defence? He has been lauded in recent seasons but it looks, to my limited viewing admittedly, he doesn't know how to play in a central defensive pairing.

Wolves played three centre backs today. 
 

Didn’t think he did too badly today personally 

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15 minutes ago, dr_manhattan^ said:

Wolves played three centre backs today. 
 

Didn’t think he did too badly today personally 

 

In fairness the second half Wolves controlled the game and I probably should have waited until the game was finished, it was just an observation of his recent form. Coady did well, I suppose the question after this game is whether they revert to the back three as the season continues.

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25 minutes ago, Adrock said:

 

In fairness the second half Wolves controlled the game and I probably should have waited until the game was finished, it was just an observation of his recent form. Coady did well, I suppose the question after this game is whether they revert to the back three as the season continues.

That is the question, I have a definite opinion on this but it does split people.

 

I don't know if people on here care enough so I'll not discuss it unless you're interested :) 

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8 minutes ago, dr_manhattan^ said:

That is the question, I have a definite opinion on this but it does split people.

 

I don't know if people on here care enough so I'll not discuss it unless you're interested :) 

 

Yeah I'm interested. I may support Liverpool but I watch just about any football whenever I can. That includes taking an interest in the workings of teams.

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Just now, Adrock said:

 

Yeah I'm interested. I may support Liverpool but I watch just about any football whenever I can. That includes taking an interest in the workings of teams.

Sweet, I find this sort of stuff interesting too.

 

So in my opinion a move to a back four is essential, and I've thought that it would have to happen at some point as long as Nuno has been at Wolves.

 

My reasoning is, with a back three with wing backs we have already hit a glass ceiling of seventh.  Really we should have got sixth last season but over the last two seasons the gap in goal difference between us in seventh and the top six is huge, and to get into that group you really need to be able to score the goals.

 

Now the problem with our formation is we essentially sacrifice an attacking player for stability at the back.  As a result, almost all our attacking play comes from our wing backs with support from our wide forwards (Jota, Cavilero, Adama, Podence, and Neto in the main during Nuno's time).  Our midfield in this formation usually consists of two deep lying defensive midfielders in Saiss, Neves, and Moutinho.

 

This midfield is not very forward thinking and is unable to make runs in to the box to support the main striker who is left isolated too often when the wide players make crosses.

 

This leaves our main attack over the first seasons being most effective when we surrender position, keep a good shape with our five man defense and two defensive midfielders and then break at pace when we have the opportunity.  Over the course of the season this leads to the glass celing I mentioned.

 

We saw this problem illustrated in the Europa LEague quater final against Seville when we lost late on 1-0 with about 27% possesion.

 

What we need to do is get in better defenders to allow us to play with a back four, and allow us to have an offensive minded midfielders to play between the lines in front of Neves.

 

This would make us less predictable going forward.  We would still have powerful wide players, but a defending team at the moment can just put men on them and we're mostly neutralised.  With the ability to make things happen through the middle they would have to spread the defense.

 

Wolves are aware of this clearly.  We've been playing with a back four at points during the season and we tried to sign Ruben Dias in the summer of 2019.  We didn't want to pay 50m and he signed a new contract with Benfica.

 

Apparently a high quality centre back is the priority for the summer.  I hope so, because I'd love to see us play the way described.

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I would pretty much agree with all of that, the challenge is getting the defenders who can work in the back 4. Modern full backs look to get forward, so maybe it would require a box to box player or two in the midfield to cover those, like Liverpool in the recent past.

 

I'm unsure Neves can be the deep lying midfielder who can effectively shield the defence whilst also dictating play with his excellent distribution of the ball alone, he would probably need a partner. Moutinho is excellent but is never going to get up and down the pitch throughout the game so he needs replacing sooner rather than later. Saiss I don't know too much about.

 

Wolves need a very good center back to partner with Coady, if he is to be part of the future. I think Coady has shown the adaptability to suggest he could learn to work in a central defensive pairing.

 

The next step that Wolves are taking is the most difficult, they are probably one of the best positioned to attempt it, they have the financial clout and links to find the players they require.

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1 hour ago, Adrock said:

 

Is Hodgson's time at the club coming to an end? They've been streaky in recent seasons but this feels a bit different.

 

I think so, even the most optimistic/rose tinted of the Palace fans on our main forum have switched over to the "Hodgson out" camp (Current vote 65 "In" to 536 "Out" when it's been much more 50/50 even up to a few weeks ago)

 

It's not the losses, we are used to losing, it's the manner of loss whereby we just roll over. Burnley going 2 up so quickly should have resulted in 80 minutes of us going at them but we end up being passive for most of the game and give away an atrocious 3rd in terms of defence.

 

Nobody knows why Milivojević is still favoured every game, he's weak and continues to give the ball away and pick up a stupid yellow lalmost every week, yet always is there as an ever present (a known Hodgson tactic tostick with his favourites no matter what)

 

Hodgson's continued inability to be explicit around how shit we are is aggravating see below tweet, and I don't mean it as a disrespectful comment against Burnley as they played well but we should be able to go toe to toe with them (losing 3-2 with a fighting performance rather than what we got).

 

 

Redknapp on Batshuayi's was both funny and accurate:

 

 

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38 minutes ago, Adrock said:

I would pretty much agree with all of that, the challenge is getting the defenders who can work in the back 4. Modern full backs look to get forward, so maybe it would require a box to box player or two in the midfield to cover those, like Liverpool in the recent past.

 

I'm unsure Neves can be the deep lying midfielder who can effectively shield the defence whilst also dictating play with his excellent distribution of the ball alone, he would probably need a partner. Moutinho is excellent but is never going to get up and down the pitch throughout the game so he needs replacing sooner rather than later. Saiss I don't know too much about.

 

Wolves need a very good center back to partner with Coady, if he is to be part of the future. I think Coady has shown the adaptability to suggest he could learn to work in a central defensive pairing.

 

The next step that Wolves are taking is the most difficult, they are probably one of the best positioned to attempt it, they have the financial clout and links to find the players they require.

Agree with all that. Will be interesting for sure. 

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The brass neck on Maguire to complain that Utd aren't getting the decisions and it was a nailed on penalty - its like nothing that went before for months ever happened.

 

He should have been booked for simulation.

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1 hour ago, skadupuk said:

 

I think so, even the most optimistic/rose tinted of the Palace fans on our main forum have switched over to the "Hodgson out" camp (Current vote 65 "In" to 536 "Out" when it's been much more 50/50 even up to a few weeks ago)

 

It's not the losses, we are used to losing, it's the manner of loss whereby we just roll over. Burnley going 2 up so quickly should have resulted in 80 minutes of us going at them but we end up being passive for most of the game and give away an atrocious 3rd in terms of defence.

 

Nobody knows why Milivojević is still favoured every game, he's weak and continues to give the ball away and pick up a stupid yellow lalmost every week, yet always is there as an ever present (a known Hodgson tactic tostick with his favourites no matter what)

 

Hodgson's continued inability to be explicit around how shit we are is aggravating see below tweet, and I don't mean it as a disrespectful comment against Burnley as they played well but we should be able to go toe to toe with them (losing 3-2 with a fighting performance rather than what we got).

 

 

Redknapp on Batshuayi's was both funny and accurate:

 

 

 

The Hodgson interview tactic of saying not much and trying to drive straight down the middle is really bloody annoying, he did the same at Liverpool.

 

The danger, of course, is that Palace try to get another manager and end up getting relegated. Hodgson is pretty steady and usually he steers his team's to safety.

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21 minutes ago, Adrock said:

 

The Hodgson interview tactic of saying not much and trying to drive straight down the middle is really bloody annoying, he did the same at Liverpool.

 

The danger, of course, is that Palace try to get another manager and end up getting relegated. Hodgson is pretty steady and usually he steers his team's to safety.

 

This is where we have a problem, the one thing you rely on with a Hodgson team is a rock solid defense that counter attacks, we now have conceded the 2nd most goals in the EPL, Hodgson got the arse when questioned on it and suggested the Liverpool game was distorting it (I'm sure if we discounted every teams worst result you'd come up with a similar poisition).

 

Our problem last season was not scoring many (2nd worst again),and whilst better it hasn't improved enough to offset the defensive collapse.

 

It's shit football to watch and isn't getting better, there  have been glaring issues (bad corners, poor passing completion %) for 4 seasons now that he still hasn't addressed and his aversion to making substitutes until the 70th minute no matter how bad the performance is baffling.

 

I don't think it would be rash to make a managerial change, we are in a position of needing a squad revamp in the summer and giving that to Hodgson feels like the worst option given his usage (or lack of) new/younger players, I think we go down next season if we keep him. 

 

 

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To add, it's Brighton next Monday.

 

I think we lose regardless, but would rather Hodgson's tenure ended before/now whilst the fanbase still retains an appreciation for all he has done previously, rather than him completely lose the fans with a heavy defeat with no fight in us.

 

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Impossible to leave Saka out of the England squad if he keeps this level up, so I wonder if Southgate might be tempted to choose between Shaw and Chilwell, then just use him as LB cover too to free up another squad place.

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1 hour ago, skadupuk said:

To add, it's Brighton next Monday.

 

I think we lose regardless, but would rather Hodgson's tenure ended before/now whilst the fanbase still retains an appreciation for all he has done previously, rather than him completely lose the fans with a heavy defeat with no fight in us.

 

As a Brighton fan I'm honestly not sure it's that cut and dried. It's a local derby so the rules seem to be that the in form team (which I think over the last 6 games has probably been us) somehow lose catastrophically. 

 

I kind of get Palace's current form. They always finish above us but also around mid-table. I don't think there's any danger of them going down given we're in another weird COVID season coupled with the performance of the bottom 3, so there might be a sense that the team has done enough, which I appreciate for fans isn't good enough.

 

It's probably just a case of having a target to work towards over a number of seasons. I assume Palace have that although I don't know.

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24 minutes ago, DirkCrisis said:

As a Brighton fan I'm honestly not sure it's that cut and dried. It's a local derby so the rules seem to be that the in form team (which I think over the last 6 games has probably been us) somehow lose catastrophically. 

 

I kind of get Palace's current form. They always finish above us but also around mid-table. I don't think there's any danger of them going down given we're in another weird COVID season coupled with the performance of the bottom 3, so there might be a sense that the team has done enough, which I appreciate for fans isn't good enough.

 

It's probably just a case of having a target to work towards over a number of seasons. I assume Palace have that although I don't know.

 

I get where you are coming from and that may have been true in previous seasons, but It's very different this time as there's nothing there in terms of effort or bite, it feels like a team that has reached a natural dead end rather than one 'on the beach already'

 

12 players are  out of contract at the end of the season, why would they risk their livelihood over the next few weeks with no certainty, this all falls at the feet of the owners and Hodgson (to a lesser degree)

 

No Zaha for the derby game and it's not just my natral pessimism this time, I just cannot see us doing anything against you of note and really fear a big loss.  

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FWIW we may have only conceded one goal in our last 6 games but we haven't scored that many. We had 26 shots against Villa yesterday and failed to score (although that was partly due to Martinez having a worldie).

 

I envisage us battering you with shots but our finishing letting us down. Realistically, think it's going to end up either 0-0 or 1-1 because whilst we create chances, Maupay, Trossard and Mac Allister and ... uh ... Dan Burn aren't quite ruthless enough to put them away.

 

What I hope is that Potter is wearing his lucky old lady scarf which has served us well recently.

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5 hours ago, The Fox said:

Impossible to leave Saka out of the England squad if he keeps this level up, so I wonder if Southgate might be tempted to choose between Shaw and Chilwell, then just use him as LB cover too to free up another squad place.

 

I think there's arguments that it's also impossible to leave out Maddison, Barnes, Grealish, Foden, Mount, and yet probably only four of them (including Saka) can go. And that's not even taking into consideration Sancho, Hudson Odoi and Greenwood. England are fucking stacked.

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On current form I don’t think Hudson Odoi or Greenwood have any chance, but there’s still time to turn it around. Maddison I think we’ve seen enough squads to show that for whatever reason, Southgate doesn’t rate him, and I don’t think he’ll be in the Euros squad. I think Sancho, Grealish & Foden are all locks to get in though.

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7 hours ago, Mike1812 said:

Yeah, we miss Kalvin Phillips. 

 

We're impressively inconsistent. 

 

I think it's worth bearing in mind our injury list is actually quite big at the minute. Beyond Philips, we're down to pretty bare bones. 

 

Koch and Llorente are going to be like new signings when (if) they come back. Strujik is developing off the back of that though, which is a bonus. 

 

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6 hours ago, The Fox said:

Maddison I think we’ve seen enough squads to show that for whatever reason, Southgate doesn’t rate him, and I don’t think he’ll be in the Euros squad.

 

He should take Maddison for his interviews alone. Makes a pleasant change to see a footballer who talks like a proper human.

 

I think you are right though, I think the time he pulled out of the squad due to sickness then got snapped in a casino probably didn't help garner trust.

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Talking of internationals David Ornstein put this up today on the Athletic about an impending bust up on releasing players - and how there is no exemption for sportspeople on their return to the UK from red list countries.

 

Spoiler

 

Growing belief Premier League clubs will clamp down on international travel next month

New COVID-19 variants have already impacted football as countries close their borders to international travel and some European ties in the club competitions have been moved to neutral venues. But this particular issue could become pertinent again ahead of the March international fixtures.

Last week, FIFA extended the exemption that means clubs do not have to release players where there is a mandatory quarantine period of five days or more on their return. And The Athletic has been told there is a growing belief that Premier League clubs have a case for telling FIFA players will not be released next month on a much wider basis.

The UK’s current rules mean anyone returning from a “red list” country, such as Portugal, all of South America and parts of southern Africa, will need to undergo a 10-day quarantine in a hotel. There is no exemption for elite sports stars.

With the likes of Colombia, Brazil and Argentina, for example, involved in World Cup qualifiers, there are concerns that players could travel abroad and then not be allowed back into the UK, leaving them unable to perform the work they are contracted to do. This could impact a host of clubs, including Liverpool (Alisson, Roberto Firmino), Manchester City (Gabriel Jesus) and Everton (James Rodriguez, Richarlison, Allan).

While it has not yet been discussed at Premier League meetings, clubs have raised it privately and there is hope the top-flight clubs’ stance would be backed by the FA.

One Premier League executive added that every club wants to avoid giving themselves a disadvantage this season and so if one club denies permission to travel, they all will. Another club insider told The Athletic they are hoping to know in the next week whether they can pull players out based on travel advice.

There are also serious fears that players could bring back new strains of COVID-19 from international duty — despite many clubs paying for private jets to transport their players, which they fear could prove to be incubators for the virus.

 

 

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