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Formula One 2021 - DRAMA - No refunds for you!


T Pot
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17 hours ago, marsh said:

What crumpets did HHF butter to get that drive? or did Hill really ask for too much dosh?

 

HHF was quicker than Schumacher in sportscars and to be fair, stomped 99 Hill into the ground.

 

His biggest problem is he was one of those drivers who very much performs to how comfortable he is with a situation.  He didn't get on at Williams, so he didn't "get on" at Williams.  At Sauber and Jordan he was very good but ended up fucking up the latter of those too.

 

The decision made some sense.

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Frentzen's one of those guys who you can almost point to a particular moment in his career that probably changed the trajectory that it took. He'd just taken his debut win at Imola in 1997 and then pulled a bloody great lap out of the bag to take pole at Monaco. Had it not pissed down with rain overnight, his team wouldn't have taken a really rather silly risk with the wrong tyres, he'd have had a great chance of winning the race and then who knows how 1997 plays out. As Dudley points out, he was very much a confidence/comfort kind of driver. I mean, looking back on it he was bloody unlucky at the start of that year. Would have probably won Australia had his left-front brake not been dodgy and finally imploded, and almost certainly would have done the same in Argentina but his car broke down there too.

 

I was quite the Frentzen fan back then. I'd actually supported him and JV since the start of 1994, so having them both join up in the same team for '97 was really great for me. 

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His shot at the title in 1999 wasn't to be sniffed at either. I think it was the European Grand Prix where he maybe should have won and could have drawn level with Irvine and Hakkinen with only a few races left to go. Apparently he left the anti-stall on when leaving the pits, his engineer didn't remind him about it, and they thought they'd lost power.

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24 minutes ago, wev said:

His shot at the title in 1999 wasn't to be sniffed at either. I think it was the European Grand Prix where he maybe should have won and could have drawn level with Irvine and Hakkinen with only a few races left to go. Apparently he left the anti-stall on when leaving the pits, his engineer didn't remind him about it, and they thought they'd lost power.

 

He won two races that year, at least we wouldn't be having this conversation if he had bagged a WDC, because he'd be front and center as candidate number 1. I put him in the same box as Thierry Boutsen.

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3 minutes ago, marsh said:

 

He won two races that year, at least we wouldn't be having this conversation if he had bagged a WDC, because he'd be front and center as candidate number 1. I put him in the same box as Thierry Boutsen.


I think he looks more like David Duchovny. 

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9 minutes ago, mexos said:

Boutsen was the Perez of his day. But with amazing hair.

Little known fact.

 

George Russell carries a picture of Boutsen with him every time he goes to the barbers and says "like this but with less volume".

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12 minutes ago, mexos said:

Boutsen was the Perez of his day. But with amazing hair.

 

I don't think Boutsen was that bad. Thing about drivers of that era is they either got old, or ran out of money and talent. This lot seem to have no idea what to do outside of F1. Riccardo Patrese is nearly 70, and he was nearly that old when he stopped racing. At least he walked away with some form of dignity.

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8 minutes ago, wev said:

Little known fact.

 

George Russell carries a picture of Boutsen with him every time he goes to the barbers and says "like this but with less volume".

 

Little known fact.

 

Thierry Boutsens hair style is used as the standard issue hairpiece for all male lego figures.

 

 

Bc6dW9wISxhdt6PUbo-nFUIjDpLLE-zegwTSJvoOfqY.jpg

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I was never convinced about Boutsen, but that might be because James Hunt spent 1990 taking every opportunity he could to say how much of a waste of a Williams seat he was. He was good, but... hmm. I don't really think there's a current driver who I could equate him to! Maybe Carlos Sainz? You know if they get into a good position they will probably bring it home, but you aren't ever quite sure if they're capable of making that good position happen by themselves.

 

EDIT: Maybe also Kvyat too.

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7 hours ago, marsh said:

 

Little known fact.

 

Thierry Boutsens hair style is used as the standard issue hairpiece for all male lego figures.

 

 

Bc6dW9wISxhdt6PUbo-nFUIjDpLLE-zegwTSJvoOfqY.jpg

 

He doesn't need a crash helmet. 😄

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22 hours ago, kiroquai said:

I was never convinced about Boutsen, but that might be because James Hunt spent 1990 taking every opportunity he could to say how much of a waste of a Williams seat he was. He was good, but... hmm. I don't really think there's a current driver who I could equate him to! Maybe Carlos Sainz? You know if they get into a good position they will probably bring it home, but you aren't ever quite sure if they're capable of making that good position happen by themselves.

 

EDIT: Maybe also Kvyat too.

 

Hungary 1990 justifies his entire career.

 

Got himself pole and in an era where it was legal, decided to just put concrete tyres on the thing and try to do the whole race.

 

They all came for him, they all failed. Several cracked.  Senna took out Nanini trying to get to him, Berger took out himself and Mansell.  Boutsen held off Senna with failing brakes for the last 5 laps.  He'd never drive as well before or since.

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1 hour ago, Dudley said:

 

Hungary 1990 justifies his entire career.

 

Got himself pole and in an era where it was legal, decided to just put concrete tyres on the thing and try to do the whole race.

 

They all came for him, they all failed. Several cracked.  Senna took out Nanini trying to get to him, Berger took out himself and Mansell.  Boutsen held out Senna with failing brakes for the last 5 laps.  He'd never drive as well before or since.

 

I just went and found the highlights on F1TV. 

 

The cars don't even look real. 

 

1990benetton.thumb.png.164db01e28d7f69e95d59902d491d2b2.png

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I actually really liked the only-twice-raced B190B!

 

40BBA932-B66F-4552-964E-B4DE2E5BB3AB.jpeg.700b7eb360dea4e950fd83ffa27fde4a.jpeg

 

Oh, and @Dudley - yes, you made an excellent point regarding Hungary 1990. A fine race by TB indeed, and showed he was more than just a dab hand in the wet.

 

Apparently at Detroit in 1988 the circuit PA couldn’t pronounce his name so just called him ‘Terry Boston’.

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Hill could absolutely drive the car on its limit lap after lap after lap. He was the very definition of solidly reliable. And in a day and age when consistently was king, he won.  He never once made the pulse race. 

 

But he was a better drive than Boutsen. Who was the very definition of wing man that wasn't required to drive the car on the edge or grab pole by a 10th of a second. His job was to make Nigel look good and have European hair. 

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I did wonder if that was the confusion.

 

I do wonder sometimes if Williams replaced the wrong driver, not because Boutsen was better normally than Patrese, he absolutely wasn't but that Patrese never liked the active cars and Boutsen might well have been quicker in those.

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If anything RP is Bottas. Handful of wins in decent cars - one of which is arguably one of the all time best (92 Williams obvs). One win in that car. One.
 

Number two to a vastly superior driver. Sometimes there to pick up the pieces when the op presented itself but sometimes absolutely nowhere. 

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2 hours ago, Sidewaysbob said:

I could have sworn they were at Williams together. But he replaced Mansell and partnered Patrese :facepalm: 


Imagine the mental gymnastics they went through to come up with that as their conclusion. 
 

Chalk another one up for the crazy choices Williams made over the years.

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40 minutes ago, mexos said:

Oh god I just remembered Alesi and Williams. I tried to forget.

 

Why Frank, why.

I love Alesi, he was my favourite driver growing up, but I have no doubt in my mind that the universe would have still conspired against him being successful if he was driving the 92 Williams

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1 hour ago, mexos said:

If anything RP is Bottas. Handful of wins in decent cars - one of which is arguably one of the all time best (92 Williams obvs). One win in that car. One.
 

Number two to a vastly superior driver. Sometimes there to pick up the pieces when the op presented itself but sometimes absolutely nowhere. 

 

That was really the special set of circumstances that Patrese could never learn to drive the active cars.  Patrese beat Piquet over a season at Brabham, although to be fair so did Mansell once at Williams.

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