Metroid: Dread - October 8th

[dug]

I'm liking this so far, but not loving it. Not sure how far into it I am, but the grapple beam was the latest upgrade I got. It's not very challenging so far, none of the bosses or EMMI sequences have been difficult, but that may well change. 

 

There hasn't been much of a focus on exploration so far either, which seems a bit off to me for a metroid game. In fact in the early game, it flat out doesn't let you explore. It's always obvious where you need to go next, and most of the time you're blocked from going anywhere else. Having said that, since getting the grapple beam it really seems to have opened up. For the first time I had to look at the map to try and figure out where to go next. So I guess it's only the early game which lacks exploration, so that's forgivable.

 

Less forgivable is the way it doesn't let you sequence break. Or at least in this specific way: I picked up a power bomb before I was apparently supposed to and it didn't let me have them! Gave me a "nope, you're not allowed to have these yet" message. Fuck off! I picked up a power bomb, give me a god damned power bomb! Makes me wonder if any sequence breaking is possible at all.

 

Still, I am having fun with this. It's no Super Metroid (or Zero Mission, or Fusion), but it's leagues ahead of Other M. Haven't played the 3DS Metroid 2 remake, so don't know how it compares to that.

 

I haven't finished yet though. Maybe my opinion will improve after I've completed it.

[dataDave]

Yeah, that happened to me with a Power Bomb pick-up. I don't even think it granted me the additional count once the Power Bomb did finally unlock! It started me with 3.

 

Your thoughts mirrored mine, although exactly like you're suggesting my opinion changed after it was completed. Trying to get through hard mode as fast as possible is great, and the most fun I'm having with the game. It's definitely stream-lined for this kind of approach as repeat plays of sections are much more enjoyable than previous games - partly because it's so linear, but mainly because of how fluidly Samus moves about, even during the early game.

[dug]

Yeah I think the controls and movements are the best thing about this so far. I would imagine that of you become expert at it, you could make samus absolutely fly around.

 

One other thing that looks like it's going to be fun is working out how to get some of the upgrade items. Like one missile upgrade I saw was behind speed boost blocks, but there was nowhere nearby with a long enough platform to get a speed boost. So you must have to do some ridiculous sequence of shinesparks to get it. I do enjoy that puzzle aspect of Metroid games. I can see an energy tank, but how the balls do I get it?

[Mogster]

On 26/11/2021 at 21:30, dug said:

Less forgivable is the way it doesn't let you sequence break. Or at least in this specific way: I picked up a power bomb before I was apparently supposed to and it didn't let me have them! Gave me a "nope, you're not allowed to have these yet" message. Fuck off! I picked up a power bomb, give me a god damned power bomb! Makes me wonder if any sequence breaking is possible at all.

I think that would have been a power bomb upgrade rather than the actual ability. You can't pick up upgrades before you have the ability they relate to.

[Number 28]

I think you do actually pick it up? It just doesn't do anything until you have the upgrade.

 

You can actually sequence break btw. It was mentioned earlier in the thread that one of the boss fights is designed to let you one shot it if you managed to get an upgrade early. Granted it's not something you're likely to stumble across without a guide.

[Cyhwuhx]

On 26/11/2021 at 22:30, dug said:

Less forgivable is the way it doesn't let you sequence break. Or at least in this specific way: I picked up a power bomb before I was apparently supposed to and it didn't let me have them! Gave me a "nope, you're not allowed to have these yet" message. Fuck off! I picked up a power bomb, give me a god damned power bomb! Makes me wonder if any sequence breaking is possible at all.

Yes. Yes it is possible. Planned for and everything. It’s pretty insane really. They’ve done a very good job hiding the breaks though. 

[Alex W.]

I think one of the bosses has 2 or 3 different QTEs that you can only do if you sequence break?

[dug]

Well, that's cool then. But I still want my power bombs.

[Kevvy Metal]

On 26/11/2021 at 21:30, dug said:

Less forgivable is the way it doesn't let you sequence break. Or at least in this specific way: I picked up a power bomb before I was apparently supposed to and it didn't let me have them! Gave me a "nope, you're not allowed to have these yet" message. Fuck off! I picked up a power bomb, give me a god damned power bomb! Makes me wonder if any sequence breaking is possible at all.

 

This isn't true, You do get Power Bomb capacity upgrades before you get the actual Power Bomb ability, but you absolutely do collect the upgrade. It's just something that you can't yet make use of because you haven't yet got the ability. 

 

I'd go one further and say it's totally a deliberate design decision to create intrigue, as it's basically an unavoidable situation where you get the ammo first (btw sequence breaking isn't a design focus of any of these games, more an extra). You collect ammo for some cool weapon that you don't know what it is yet but are curious to find out! It's barely any different to finding wall blocks with weapon markings that you have no clue what they are yet. It makes you think "Can't wait to get whatever will let me get through here!"  

[dug]

Thing is in previous Metroids (well, Super Metroid anyway, I can't remember how it works in Fusion or Zero Mission), the first power bomb you collect gives you the ability, regardless of which one it is. None of this 'ah well that's only an upgrade, not the ability itself' gubbins. 

 

I completed a reasonably tricky piece of using the right ammo to destroy different kinds of blocks while simultaneously manoeuvring Samus to the right place skill, and thought I was going to be rewarded with a power bomb. But nope. I mean, sure, once I get the ability, I'll have an extra one to play with, but it's not the same.

 

I felt like I'd been a little bit cunning and had done something the game didn't 'want' me to do, only to find that the devs had anticipated it and preemptively blocked me off. Just felt a bit disappointing.

[Vemsie]

Finally saw the alternative way to 

Spoiler

kill Kraid

 

That's pretty funny.

 

Also, a nice video on how good the animation is in Dread.

 

 

Spoilers obviously.

 

[dug]

The more I play this, the more I like it. I think at at or near the end now. I have the 

Spoiler

Screw attack and power bomb (finally )

and I'm at the fight with 

Spoiler

Ravenbeak

or whatever his name is.

 

I said in an earlier post that it wasn't very challenging; well that changed! Some of the bosses in the second half of the game are much trickier than the early ones. Which makes sense. But they're fun and not frustrating.

 

I like the music. It keeps the Metroid feel without just being tired rehashes of Super Metroid tunes, something which other games in the series have definitely been guilty of. I like the graphical style as well. I wasn't convinced at first, but I've really got into the 2.5d-ness of it.

 

If Samus Returns is reasonably priced, I might play that as well.

[scottcr]

Samus Returns is worth a play - but I imagine it'd feel really quite clunky if you play it after Dread.  For everyone complaining about how hard the final boss is in Dread is, I completed it fairly easily... I still haven't beat the last boss in Samus Returns.  TBF, the 3DS control pad doesn't really help.

[makkuwata]

I love Metroidvania’s but I’m terrible at them. This game is hard as nails. I’m only up to that first Scorpion boss and want to kill myself. Clock time it was only a little less than 2 hours. Actual time…more.

 

Watched an oxtra up that point. What took me 4+ hours real-time I watched him do in 90 minutes while talking. So I know early on it’s me…but I don’t fancy my chances later.

[davidcotton]

£35.99 at Amazon uk.  Ordered it for that price.  

[Alex W.]

Pins for 500 Platinum Points plus £2 postage:

 

https://store.nintendo.co.uk/en_gb/metroid-dread-pin-set-000000000010009001.html?utm_source=My_Nintendo&utm_medium=news_uk&utm_campaign=MNS_Rewards_Metroid_Pins&utm_content=Link

[Alex W.]

You're at the one bit of the game that is iconically obtuse.

 

Spoiler

Go back to the bit in Cataris where you find the elevator; go down and to the left and shoot the "solid" wall.

[MikeBeaver]

8 minutes ago, nightwaxon said:

I am afraid this is a no from me. Frustrating. Obtuse. Ridiculous controls that are slippery. I have been stuck all evening getting burnt to a cinder when going to Cataris.I assume I need a suit to stop me from burning. I am going round in circles in Artaria in the same 4/5 rooms. All exits blocked. Getting there was bad enough. The EMMI's are an exercise in frustration. Utter trial and error what to do with them.

 

I do worry about Nintendo's output these days. The Paper Mario game had a ridiculous battle system and was plain boring. This is just a baffling idea for a metroid game. I really want to love it, but I can't.

I've finished 2 Metroid games... EVER!! This is one of them, the other, it's prequel.

I got stuck a lot, I just went and found YT walkthroughs for the bits I was stuck at.

 

The last boss was really pissing me off, to the point I was just going to give up and watch the ending oline, but the thread convinced me to keep trying... I gave up for the evening and went to bed, came back at it the next day and smashed that sodding boss first time.

 

Soooooo, give t a break and come back with fresh eyes, the amount of times I had to shoot a wall I had no idea I needed to shoot though... yeah, obtuse isn't the word 😛

[IR354Lifeqhybot]

10 minutes ago, Alex W. said:

You're at the one big of the game that is iconically obtuse.

 

  Hide contents

Go back to the bit in Cataris where you find the elevator; go down and to the left and shoot the "solid" wall.

Wow. Thanks. I would never have tried that. I will persevere. Usually stuff like that is for "secrets". Not how to progress the main branch of a game. Perhaps I am just getting too long in the tooth for this video game malarky.

[Alex W.]

Yeah, it's not a great moment, given that the rest of the game is so fluid. Conversely, once you get past it, the game is basically just a non-stop rollercoaster of exploration, platforming and shooting huge things in the face so it's worth giving it another chance.

[IR354Lifeqhybot]

nt

[Don Wiskerando]

4 hours ago, nightwaxon said:

And I'm back to wandering around. This is not for me. I spent over an hour wandering around the second world to find one little gap opened by "thermal reversal"  (I have no idea how this fits into the story). This lead me to the third world where I'm instantly stuck on the opening bit. So back to the second world I go. But, exploring over the same area to find that little gap comes to my major gripe with the game. The EMMI sections. What a load of bollocks those sections are. My god avoid a robot that you can't kill until you find something you need to explore all over the world again to find. Ahhhhhh..

 

I think I'll give this to my daughter as an additional Christmas present. I've tried. But it's really winding me up. Life's too short.

 

Oh and the controls (on the pro controller) are awful. I dread to think what this is like on the joycons.

I've completed it using joycons.  It's fucking ace in my opinion but maybe not for everyone.

[Cyhwuhx]

16 hours ago, nightwaxon said:

And I'm back to wandering around. This is not for me. I spent over an hour wandering around the second world to find one little gap opened by "thermal reversal"  (I have no idea how this fits into the story). This lead me to the third world where I'm instantly stuck on the opening bit. So back to the second world I go. But, exploring over the same area to find that little gap comes to my major gripe with the game. The EMMI sections. What a load of bollocks those sections are. My god avoid a robot that you can't kill until you find something you need to explore all over the world again to find. Ahhhhhh..

 

I think I'll give this to my daughter as an additional Christmas present. I've tried. But it's really winding me up. Life's too short.

 

Oh and the controls (on the pro controller) are awful. I dread to think what this is like on the joycons.

 

If you don't like exploration and environment puzzles, I find it difficult to even understand why you started playing this.

Conversely to me, this contained far too few of those elements.

 

As for the controls... yeah, no d-pad and too many functions on the shoulders can require a bit of mental gymnastics to control this at places.

[Majora]

Playing through this at the moment and generally enjoying it but the control scheme can be a bit like rubbing your stomach and patting your head at the same time. 

 

I'm up to the 4th main area and I think the main weakness for me is that it never really feels like I'm diving deeper and deeper into a weird and dangerous alien world. There's little sense of mystery or danger. I mostly feel like I'm working my way through some abandoned factories and laboratories. 

 

There are some nice touches here and there like doors being pounded in the background or the section where you're in (near) darkness that add to the atmosphere but it doesn't have much of a sense of foreboding or discovery to it. C/c with Hollow Knight.

 

It's still pretty good though. Perfectly playable and controls fluidly despite the control scheme. But it's missing a spark that separates the good from the great.

[dumpster]

I've really enjoyed this so far and I can see what they're going for with the EMMI robots.  They're like the clickers in The Last of Us.  You enter an area you hear that noise and... tension.  But my actual response is "aw fuck it" because the EMMIs are not just annoying, they're ruining it.  Metroid should be about exploration and these things actually chase you through the section you're in, straight into somewhere else.  They are entirely at odds with what you normally do in a Metroid game.  But outside of that, this is my game of the year.  Smooth and fluid, loads of fun, some good ideas.  I just hate the EMMIs. They kill you, you get a game over screen, you wait 10 seconds for loading and the game drops you right back where you were and you do the same thing again and again.  It's like a pointless interruption, a game over for the sake of it. When there's no EMMI around this game is outstanding. As soon as one turns up I switch off.

[Corranga]

On 17/12/2021 at 11:46, dumpster said:

Metroid should be about exploration and these things actually chase you through the section you're in, straight into somewhere else

This annoyed me too. Once you get the Omega cannon activated and have to kill one, I enjoyed the action/ puzzle element of trying to blast it while avoiding it, but afterwards they just leave huge voids in each map area with no secrets.

Anyway, I think I might be passed that problem now as I’m facing off against the final boss (we’ll actually I’m sleeping on it and going back to it tomorrow as I’m struggling.)

 

To keep the trend going, I’ve completed Samus Returns (and Return of Samus), along with Super, Fusion and Zero Mission. I’ve never played NES Metroid nor Other M and didn’t care much for Prime.

[dataDave]

There are so few EMMI encounters that they’re almost just background noise in the grand scheme of things. The game is massive, and they take up such a small part of it. These sections are not about exploration, no, but neither is the rest of the game once it clicks - it’s probably just as linear as Fusion was, which again, got a load of flack at the time. Personally, Fusion was/is my favourite for that very reason. No getting lost, just great set-pieces and bosses - the polar opposite to Super.

[Steven]

Fusion is my personal favourite for pretty much those reasons, too. Just updated the Switch and watched the intro - all the Fusion stuff in there in hi def made me smile. Going to start this proper this week one evening.

[Majora]

I think this gets better and better the further in you get. The environments in particular are a lot more interesting and the pacing is excellent. The momentum barely ever flags.

 

I'm not sure they quite juggle all the upgrades you get in a way that makes them all feel essential. Some of them I've basically forgotten I even have at this point unless I look in the menu. Mainly that running dash move which seems extremely location specific.

 

I can't decide if the control scheme is the work of a genius or a madman. The way it's designed means that pretty much every ability and move is instantly accessible without having to go into a submenu of any kind. But there are so many combinations of button and shoulder presses by the time you start reaching the end I still feel like they're not embedded in my muscle memory fully.

[dumpster]

The water level is soooo good.  Atmosphere.  Exploration. Shooting.  It's great.  But I have conceded.  This game is ruined by the EMMIs , they are repetitive, boring, and way, way too hard.   The games fucking brilliant in so many ways and the EMMIs absolutely ruin it. It's amazing Nintendo signed off on this.  It's a great game, utterly ruined by one thing.