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Football thread 2022/23


Naysonymous
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11 minutes ago, feltmonkey said:

So they've discovered "evidence of criminality" in the contract they offered him, and think that he should suffer the consequences of the criminal stuff they did? Right.

 

Not the current administration, the previous one under Bartomeu. Bear in mind that administration was raided by the police and removed due to an investigation into corruption and misappropriation of funds. 

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15 minutes ago, redbloodcell said:

 

Not the current administration, the previous one under Bartomeu. Bear in mind that administration was raided by the police and removed due to an investigation into corruption and misappropriation of funds. 

It's all a bit convenient though, isn't it.

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6 minutes ago, Chewylegs said:

It's all a bit convenient though, isn't it.

 

Oh definitely, I'm sure it's a play to try and pressure de Jong to accept the previous terms, regardless of whether they really have evidence of dodgy dealing or not. 

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Quite why anyone wants to join them/stay there I don't fucking know. Barcelona are probably hoping by not honouring the contracts the players won't be able to afford legal proceedings. Fucking scummy club.

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Think what's most galling about Barca is UEFA just standing by and watching, when they've been pretty quick to penalise other clubs for far, far less.

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It's not UEFA's problem though, is it?  It's not even La Liga's.  It might be in the hands of FIFPRO (who seem to have been very quiet) but the actual governing bodies aren't involved, it's not their problem.

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UEFA will be fine for them to play in their European competition this season, despite irregularities all over the shop. Seen that La Liga have refused to register new signings until the club's wage bill is sorted out. It's all moot anyway, nothing will happen to the club in the short, mid or long term. Their presence is too important in terms of commercial interests for both La Liga and the Champions League for any overly damaging penalties to be imposed.

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1 hour ago, wev said:

Quite why anyone wants to join them/stay there I don't fucking know. Barcelona are probably hoping by not honouring the contracts the players won't be able to afford legal proceedings. Fucking scummy club.

 

To use the parlance of our time, football players are pure cucks. Especially South American footballers, I think it's no coincidence that there hasn't been a South American winner of the World Cup in two decades since suddenly all of them decided their dream is to play for Real Madrid and Barcelona. Complete loser mentality to twerk for two sides who love to bathe in the piss of their own mythos. See also players who go to PSG and are surprised its anything other than a retirement bonus for footballers.

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Just checked that - at the 2002 World Cup 13 out of 23 Brazilians played in Brazil. At last year's Copa America it was just 4 out of 24.

 

None based in England in 2002, 9 in 2021.

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5 hours ago, redbloodcell said:

 

Not the current administration, the previous one under Bartomeu. Bear in mind that administration was raided by the police and removed due to an investigation into corruption and misappropriation of funds. 

 

I'm aware of that, but it's the same club. Employment contracts like this are between the player and the club. The organisation would be held responsible, and a defence that consists of, "but that was some other guy who was working on behalf of the club and offered a contract from the club" holds no water.

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I’ve just finished Simon Kuper’s Barca: The rise and fall of the club that built modern football. It’s a great read and gives a real insight into how Barca have got themselves into this mess. 

Does a good job of explaining the thinking being the ‘Mes Que Une Club’ which basically boils down to ‘Catalyuna, Cruyff, Masia, UNICEF’. Cruyff was Kuper’s hero and as is oft the norm, meeting him doesn’t go as well as expected. However, Cruyff’s impact on modern football is explained. 
 

Much like the class of ‘92, the Masia’s mythical reputation was emboldened by a bumper crop that included Messi, Xavi, Iniesta etc. Kuper explains how this was a statistical anomaly - you can’t base a club around an expectation that your academy will produce 5/6 of the world’s top 200 at any period. He also explains how the soul of the masia has been lost a bit. 
 

The UNICEF part is about how Barca always put them out there as some kind of paragon of virtue; slagged off the funding arrangements of PSG, Man City et al, Then proceeded to take millions from the Qataris. 
 

But ultimately, Barca’s current predicament is due to Messi. Obviously he brought great success to the club, but they are paying the price for that. His contract meant he could leave on a free transfer at the end of every season, meaning that Barca negotiated a new contract with him, every season. This came with a salary increase. His salary increase then prompted other players to increase their wages. The utter ridiculousness of this is best illustrated by the fact below:

Quote

Over the four years from 2017 to 2021, Messi earned €555 in total from Barca. That was 30% of the club’s total staff costs. 


Messi comes across quite negatively. When the club asked the players for a temporary wage decrease due to the COVID pandemic, he text an executive saying he was against doing so. The author calls him an extremely dull person, especially in interviews. 
 

It’s not a hatchet job; balanced throughout and clearly shows what a mess the club has made of their finances. The club comes across as a fairly classy organisation before abandoning it all in the name of success and revenue. Well worth a read. 

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1 hour ago, feltmonkey said:

 

I'm aware of that, but it's the same club. Employment contracts like this are between the player and the club. The organisation would be held responsible, and a defence that consists of, "but that was some other guy who was working on behalf of the club and offered a contract from the club" holds no water.

The whole financing of their debt is sketchy as fuck. I would imagine that the last rabble did a lot to manage the debt because the directors have to pay the debt themselves if the club can’t. 
 

Back in 2020, when Barca were trying to manage their debt and rail against the likes of PSG and Man City, one of their executives asked a senior UEFA official if there was someone in the FFP department that they could bribe. It’s not only bankrupt, it’s morally so as well. 

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25 minutes ago, Stopharage said:

But ultimately, Barca’s current predicament is due to Messi.

They could of like, you know, let him leave.

 

I mean, at some point the club decided to go into a bizarre contract arrangement with him which meant he could leave at the end of the season (as you are saying).  That would have been their choice and makes no sense whatsoever as a business arrangement.

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30 minutes ago, Chewylegs said:

They could of like, you know, let him leave.

 

I mean, at some point the club decided to go into a bizarre contract arrangement with him which meant he could leave at the end of the season (as you are saying).  That would have been their choice and makes no sense whatsoever as a business arrangement.

He didn’t want to leave. They didn’t want him to. The financial mismanagement to allow this to continue was fairly staggering but that’s why they’re in this. 
 

 

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1 hour ago, Stopharage said:

He didn’t want to leave. They didn’t want him to. The financial mismanagement to allow this to continue was fairly staggering but that’s why they’re in this. 
 

 

I totally get it but they have put themselves into this mess, not Messi IMO.  At what point do you decide a year long contract on such a high commodity is a good idea?

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LFC fan and former player Coady has joined Everton on loan. Hopefully there to make sure they can do what they failed to achieve last season; get relegated. 

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1 hour ago, Stopharage said:

He didn’t want to leave. They didn’t want him to. The financial mismanagement to allow this to continue was fairly staggering but that’s why they’re in this. 
 

 


 

He submitted a transfer request and there were offers apparently in the region of €100m on the table for him from PSG and Manchester City, but they turned down the opportunity to at least put a dent in their financial woes because there was an election on so Messi earned something crazy like another €50m and left for free less than a year later.  It was crazy mismanagement but Barcelona won’t get punished for it in any meaningful sense.  They’ll probably win the league this year because that’s how it tends to go for uberclubs.  

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1 hour ago, Chewylegs said:

I totally get it but they have put themselves into this mess, not Messi IMO.  At what point do you decide a year long contract on such a high commodity is a good idea?

Definitely. It’s a staggeringly stupid idea to allow it for a couple of seasons, let alone for the 10+ that the book suggests it’s been going on for. 
 

It’s not Messi’s fault at all that this was allowed to continue and let’s face it, we’d probably all make the most of that kind of arrangement if it was presented to us. Messi doesn’t come across that well in the book though and is hugely demanding to the extent where he openly demeans managers and other players.  However, he’s earned the right to do so by the sheer greatness of his talent. 

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34 minutes ago, Naysonymous said:


 

He submitted a transfer request and there were offers apparently in the region of €100m on the table for him from PSG and Manchester City, but they turned down the opportunity to at least put a dent in their financial woes because there was an election on so Messi earned something crazy like another €50m and left for free less than a year later.  It was crazy mismanagement but Barcelona won’t get punished for it in any meaningful sense.  They’ll probably win the league this year because that’s how it tends to go for uberclubs.  

I was referring to the fact that he had this continued end of season contract renewal which for 10 years+ kept his salary increasing. He didn’t want to leave that arrangement as he loved the club, city and renumeration. Barca didn’t want him to go as they had the best player in the world and his continued employment helped keep the directors in power. 
 

In the book, Kuper says that additional year after the transfer request cost Barca around £300m in wages and lost transfer fees. 
 

Sorry, I’ll stop wittering on about the book, needless to say it’s well worth a read. 

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52 minutes ago, Azrael said:

LFC fan and former player Coady has joined Everton on loan. Hopefully there to make sure they can do what they failed to achieve last season; get relegated. 


I don’t get this at all, why would he want to go to Everton when he’s been such an integral player at Wolves? Does Bruno Lage not like him any more?

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