The Lazarus Project

[MardiganX]

No thread for this? In episode 3 at the moment and really enjoying this. Takes a very clever perspective on the whole time loop scenario and does just enough to feel like it has its own ideas about a few things so really looking forward to see where it goes.

 

Im also at a loss trying to find a song that plays in episodes 1 and 2, at a wedding scene then again repeatedly at a party so anyone that can point me to what could probably be classed as ‘Sarah’s song’ ok the show, that would be great  

[Arn X Treme]

I saw an advert for it and never thought about it again.

 

I may give it a watch sometime.

 

Had a brief look for you but couldn't find a decent soundtrack listing, however I did find this article.

 

SPOILER WARNING

 

Those track names seem like potential plot spoilers to be, so you've been warned.

 

https://filmmusicreporter.com/2022/06/17/soundtrack-album-for-skys-the-lazarus-project-to-be-released/

[cassidy]

Finished this earlier tonight. Rather enjoyed it and hope we get more. 

[Seamonster]

So anyway, this is really good and more people should be watching it.

 

But...

 

(spoilers up to the end of Ep3)

 

Spoiler

...I might have missed something, but I'm not sure the character's motives are making sense...

 

The 'bad' guy (Rebrov) goes completely off the rails at the point he seems to have a reason to keep the Lazarus Project going, doesn't he? <unsure.gif>

 

As in, he went rogue at the point the Irish guy died in Russia and fixed the 2018 problem, meaning his daughter made it past the next checkpoint. But shouldn't that mean he now has a vested interest in keeping his daughter alive, and should in theory want to keep the project going? Alternatively, I get that he could have been so traumatized by the loss of his son and the '2018 experience' that he might have gone a bit crazy.... but then why is his ex-partner so keen to help build a detonator in the present day? If the bomb goes off then they'll just wind time back a few months again, and she doesn't seem to have enjoyed that process much in the past...

 

It just seems that the pair of them want Lazarus gone more than they want their daughter to live, and I'm not sure I totally buy that. Unless I've missed something.

 

[MardiganX]

2 hours ago, Seamonster said:

So anyway, this is really good and more people should be watching it.

 

But...

 

(spoilers up to the end of Ep3)

 

  Hide contents

...I might have missed something, but I'm not sure the character's motives are making sense...

 

The 'bad' guy (Rebrov) goes completely off the rails at the point he seems to have a reason to keep the Lazarus Project going, doesn't he? <unsure.gif>

 

As in, he went rogue at the point the Irish guy died in Russia and fixed the 2018 problem, meaning his daughter made it past the next checkpoint. But shouldn't that mean he now has a vested interest in keeping his daughter alive, and should in theory want to keep the project going? Alternatively, I get that he could have been so traumatized by the loss of his son and the '2018 experience' that he might have gone a bit crazy.... but then why is his ex-partner so keen to help build a detonator in the present day? If the bomb goes off then they'll just wind time back a few months again, and she doesn't seem to have enjoyed that process much in the past...

 

It just seems that the pair of them want Lazarus gone more than they want their daughter to live, and I'm not sure I totally buy that. Unless I've missed something.

 

 

Spoiler

I think its less about them wanting Lazarus gone and more about them believing that the 'Project' should not have the power to decide how it gets used. Also, what Rebrov and Janet go through with the birth of the daughter loop is as traumatic as anything I've ever seen in a TV show. That experience on its own its one of the hardest things a couple can go through together, so seeing how it affects them as they keep resetting was heartbreaking to watch. 

 

I found episode 3 absolutely gut wrenching and started to really appreciate how well its all structured and paced with all the characters experiences crossing over. Loving it!

 

 

 

[bagapeas]

Gave this a try having seen it pop up on Sky. Really enjoyed it, especially showing (or leaving us to imagine) the potential consequences of the time loop.

 

Episode 8 spoiler

Spoiler

Shiv repeatedly experiencing being shot and dying over and over as the loop resets was a horrific thought

 

Underlying show premise

Spoiler

It may be something it’s heading towards, but if that technology existed you’d imagine it would be used for more sinister purposes

 

[MardiganX]

“Ooooooh George… I hope you’re already running!!”

 

Yeah, this is fucking brilliant. Only a couple episodes left and I don’t want it to end.

[MardiganX]

Just finished it. Absolutely brilliant and gets better and better all the way through. Unsurprisingly there are a few narrative jumps that have to be excused but overall very clever. Also, it seems to know when and how to inject some really measured humour considering how seriously the overall premise is played out. 
 

Was praying there was an episode 9 I had missed in the recordings as that ending was just fucking bonkers! Been a while since I’ve wanted a next season of a show immediately after it finished but yeah, more of this, NOW!!

[KaSarr]

I came across your post DAYS ago and have been wanting to respond. It took days for my application to get approved. 

 

Anyway....I found the song!!! It's called "Sky and Sand". It's even on Spotify so I was able to add it to my Playlists. 

 

Enjoy.

 

 

[MardiganX]

2 hours ago, KaSarr said:

I came across your post DAYS ago and have been wanting to respond. It took days for my application to get approved. 

 

Anyway....I found the song!!! It's called "Sky and Sand". It's even on Spotify so I was able to add it to my Playlists. 

 

Enjoy.

 

 

🥺

 

And this was your first post? Fuck me! Thank you!!

 

Close the books everyone… @KaSarr has won the internet this year!!

[Ry]

Just watched the first episode. That was outstanding. 

 

Hoping the rest can be as good. 

[Ry]

Just watched episode 3. Brilliant TV and gutting. 

 

Everybody needs to be watching this show. If it was on Netflix then it would be getting talked about everywhere. 

[Tempy]

Great shout @MardiganX. This wasn't on my radar at all. Thank you.

Smashed it in a few days and thoroughly enjoyed it. I really do hope we get another series.

 

Interesting direction it took when...

 

Spoiler

He successfully initiates a code black reset to save Sarah, only to be unceremonioulsy dumped a little later whilst on holiday. Poor George   I wonder what triggered that? given we'd previously seen them in another timeline be happy, fall pregnant, get married and enjoying life before the pandemic started to take hold. I may have to go back and see if there were signs I missed that she wasn't happy and perhaps George was blinding by his feelings.

 

It'll be interesting to see the consequences of giving Sarah the serum. That's got to backfire surely.

 

[Gigawatt]

This is flippin' brilliant and everyone needs to watch it.  We finished last night so I've resisted posting until now, but get ready for some long thoughts.

 

Spoiler-Free: What I love the most, is that this is a show that takes its concept and then actually fully explores what the consequences of that would be.  I can't think of another show or film that's done this so successfully in a long time, maybe since Primer for me (although I haven't seen Dark).  I also like that it has a very ethnically diverse main cast, and it doesn't hide away from that without exploiting it.  The music gives me real Tenet vibes, which is a plus for me (appreciate that's divisive). 

 

Episode 1-4 spoilers:

 

Spoiler

The setup is brilliant, I don't think I've seen something so simple for a while.  Yes there's a bit of hand-wavy "if you're not a Quantum physicist there's no point explaining it" but that's excusable.  It really sets up what's going to happen when they explore the consequences.  

 

Archie is great, I'm very much enjoying her no-shits-given acerbic nature throughout this.  Her through-line with Ross serves as a good primer for how it works, but at that point you haven't really understood the fallout from continually trying and failing.

 

And then Episode 3 comes along, which is simultaneously one of the most gripping and grim pieces of drama I've seen in a very long time.  The moment we realised that Janet was going to have to keep giving birth to her daughter again and again was horrifying, and from that point on I stopped seeing Rebrov as the bad guy and understood why he wants to tear it all down.  For some reason I love Tom Burke's accent in this, it's nice to have a British series where they aren't all plummy Rada types (even though they could be in real life for all I know).  

 

Shiv's story in Episode 4 isn't as grim as Janet's, but it seems to me to be a good way of explaining why he's like he is.  Nice use of his notes and deductions to work out what's going on, and making it clear that he has to remember everything as nothing survives the reset.  Also seems to be a nice way of telling the audience that everything has consequences, so doing something selfish (ie betting on the horses) ends up with his uncle's family dying (good call buying a SNES though). Trying to fix it by stopping the fire still ends up with an unintended consequence, hence why he is so clear with Archie later on that it's the earliest and smallest change you can make that makes the real difference.  You can also see that this man who has lived a couple of lifetimes worth of resets by this point is haunted by it and I took him to be absolutely devoted to the task.  Shiv was by far and away my favourite character in this.

 

Full series spoilers:

 

Spoiler

George I'm not so enamoured by, in fact I agree with Shiv that he is a F**king Dickhead.  His whole arc is driven by selfishness, even though he's had it spelt out clearly why he can't do the things he does.  His arc in the middle was the only point I thought sagged, not so much in what he was doing, because I guess I could understand his frustration and sense of loss.  But I did get a bit annoyed with how easily he was able to dispatch the 'token baddies' with the bomb and even more so how he could take out the entire security team of the Russian Ambassador.  It stretched credulity a bit that they would all believe him when he framed Shiv, even though he was the one with the motive to go back to the checkpoint.  For me, George was as close to a bad-guy as we get I think, which is good that the protagonist isn't someone you automatically root for.

 

As has already been mentioned: "Oooh George, I hope you're already running" was sublime.

 

After George got dumped (shouldn't mess with time George!) and he's moping in the pub, I particularly liked Archie's speech.  Yes it's a bit on the nose, but I enjoyed "maybe, just maybe, a woman can have some meaning in her life that doesn't revolve around who she's in a relationship with".  Made me chuckle anyway.

 

As we get towards the end, Shiv goes to see George.  George later says that Shiv was there to tell him something, but I don't think that's the case.  I saw it as Shiv trying to go there and kill George just before the checkpoint so he couldn't come back (because as established, George is an F-ing D-head), and just got interrupted.  The thought of Shiv getting shot again and again and living the same few seconds on a near-infinite loop is also horrifying.  

 

I guess Episode 8 is mostly setup for the next series, but what a way to do it.  The trap that they're in really reminded me (tonally at least) of the Battlestar Galactica episode 33.  It's very video gamey in a way as they all try to figure out how they can fix things in the time they've got.  George giving the serum to Sarah is another act of supreme selfishness, potentially condemning someone to eternal purgatory just because he wanted her back.  And don't think Sarah is all innocent in this, she couldn't wait to jump back in bed with him when she found out he's a spy.  She's not going to be happy when she remembers how George ran her over in his Fiesta. Another Black-hole/singularity seems a bit convenient, and could have been simplified if they'd just said the original one was collapsing or something.

 

Questions / thoughts for the next series:

 

Spoiler

Is there a machine? Who do they call when it's a Code Black?  I hope we get some answers to this and it's not just a JJ Abrams mystery box.  Although I'll admit it doesn't really matter so much as it's just setup.  One idea I like is that somewhere there are a load of researchers working on cold fusion or the LHC or something, and one day someone calls them up and says "press switch x" which causes something to happen that links to the singularity and resets.  But in my head, all these people don't have the serum, so as far as they know, that's never happened and they don't even know there's a switch x.  

 

Is Rebrov's intent just to shut down Lazarus and let the world die on its own, and is he still working with Janet or have they gone their own way? I think that Janet was taken by the Chinese to build them a machine, but she has used the opportunity to break through the checkpoint and go back to 2012.  I think the catastrophe is a result of her doing this.  My view is that she wants to go back and stop Lazarus from resetting any more so her and Rebrov can have a family.  Now this could break causality a bit, but we'll see what they do with it.  I hope they take a Primer/Tenet line in that what is done is done, and then they can all work together to stop the collapse.  To quote Neil from Tenet "it's an expression of faith in the mechanics of the universe, not an excuse to do nothing".

 

I hope George gets a serious bout of moral conscience for the next series, and I hope we see more of the other players in the team like the Dane.

 

If it wasn't clear, I'm a sucker for time-travel stuff.  Does anyone have any good recommendations for things that are similar to this?

[MardiganX]

8 hours ago, Gigawatt said:

This is flippin' brilliant and everyone needs to watch it.  We finished last night so I've resisted posting until now, but get ready for some long thoughts.

 

Spoiler-Free: What I love the most, is that this is a show that takes its concept and then actually fully explores what the consequences of that would be.  I can't think of another show or film that's done this so successfully in a long time, maybe since Primer for me (although I haven't seen Dark).  I also like that it has a very ethnically diverse main cast, and it doesn't hide away from that without exploiting it.  The music gives me real Tenet vibes, which is a plus for me (appreciate that's divisive). 

 

Episode 1-4 spoilers:

 

  Hide contents

The setup is brilliant, I don't think I've seen something so simple for a while.  Yes there's a bit of hand-wavy "if you're not a Quantum physicist there's no point explaining it" but that's excusable.  It really sets up what's going to happen when they explore the consequences.  

 

Archie is great, I'm very much enjoying her no-shits-given acerbic nature throughout this.  Her through-line with Ross serves as a good primer for how it works, but at that point you haven't really understood the fallout from continually trying and failing.

 

And then Episode 3 comes along, which is simultaneously one of the most gripping and grim pieces of drama I've seen in a very long time.  The moment we realised that Janet was going to have to keep giving birth to her daughter again and again was horrifying, and from that point on I stopped seeing Rebrov as the bad guy and understood why he wants to tear it all down.  For some reason I love Tom Burke's accent in this, it's nice to have a British series where they aren't all plummy Rada types (even though they could be in real life for all I know).  

 

Shiv's story in Episode 4 isn't as grim as Janet's, but it seems to me to be a good way of explaining why he's like he is.  Nice use of his notes and deductions to work out what's going on, and making it clear that he has to remember everything as nothing survives the reset.  Also seems to be a nice way of telling the audience that everything has consequences, so doing something selfish (ie betting on the horses) ends up with his uncle's family dying (good call buying a SNES though). Trying to fix it by stopping the fire still ends up with an unintended consequence, hence why he is so clear with Archie later on that it's the earliest and smallest change you can make that makes the real difference.  You can also see that this man who has lived a couple of lifetimes worth of resets by this point is haunted by it and I took him to be absolutely devoted to the task.  Shiv was by far and away my favourite character in this.

 

Full series spoilers:

 

  Hide contents

George I'm not so enamoured by, in fact I agree with Shiv that he is a F**king Dickhead.  His whole arc is driven by selfishness, even though he's had it spelt out clearly why he can't do the things he does.  His arc in the middle was the only point I thought sagged, not so much in what he was doing, because I guess I could understand his frustration and sense of loss.  But I did get a bit annoyed with how easily he was able to dispatch the 'token baddies' with the bomb and even more so how he could take out the entire security team of the Russian Ambassador.  It stretched credulity a bit that they would all believe him when he framed Shiv, even though he was the one with the motive to go back to the checkpoint.  For me, George was as close to a bad-guy as we get I think, which is good that the protagonist isn't someone you automatically root for.

 

As has already been mentioned: "Oooh George, I hope you're already running" was sublime.

 

After George got dumped (shouldn't mess with time George!) and he's moping in the pub, I particularly liked Archie's speech.  Yes it's a bit on the nose, but I enjoyed "maybe, just maybe, a woman can have some meaning in her life that doesn't revolve around who she's in a relationship with".  Made me chuckle anyway.

 

As we get towards the end, Shiv goes to see George.  George later says that Shiv was there to tell him something, but I don't think that's the case.  I saw it as Shiv trying to go there and kill George just before the checkpoint so he couldn't come back (because as established, George is an F-ing D-head), and just got interrupted.  The thought of Shiv getting shot again and again and living the same few seconds on a near-infinite loop is also horrifying.  

 

I guess Episode 8 is mostly setup for the next series, but what a way to do it.  The trap that they're in really reminded me (tonally at least) of the Battlestar Galactica episode 33.  It's very video gamey in a way as they all try to figure out how they can fix things in the time they've got.  George giving the serum to Sarah is another act of supreme selfishness, potentially condemning someone to eternal purgatory just because he wanted her back.  And don't think Sarah is all innocent in this, she couldn't wait to jump back in bed with him when she found out he's a spy.  She's not going to be happy when she remembers how George ran her over in his Fiesta. Another Black-hole/singularity seems a bit convenient, and could have been simplified if they'd just said the original one was collapsing or something.

 

Questions / thoughts for the next series:

 

  Hide contents

Is there a machine? Who do they call when it's a Code Black?  I hope we get some answers to this and it's not just a JJ Abrams mystery box.  Although I'll admit it doesn't really matter so much as it's just setup.  One idea I like is that somewhere there are a load of researchers working on cold fusion or the LHC or something, and one day someone calls them up and says "press switch x" which causes something to happen that links to the singularity and resets.  But in my head, all these people don't have the serum, so as far as they know, that's never happened and they don't even know there's a switch x.  

 

Is Rebrov's intent just to shut down Lazarus and let the world die on its own, and is he still working with Janet or have they gone their own way? I think that Janet was taken by the Chinese to build them a machine, but she has used the opportunity to break through the checkpoint and go back to 2012.  I think the catastrophe is a result of her doing this.  My view is that she wants to go back and stop Lazarus from resetting any more so her and Rebrov can have a family.  Now this could break causality a bit, but we'll see what they do with it.  I hope they take a Primer/Tenet line in that what is done is done, and then they can all work together to stop the collapse.  To quote Neil from Tenet "it's an expression of faith in the mechanics of the universe, not an excuse to do nothing".

 

I hope George gets a serious bout of moral conscience for the next series, and I hope we see more of the other players in the team like the Dane.

 

If it wasn't clear, I'm a sucker for time-travel stuff.  Does anyone have any good recommendations for things that are similar to this?

I have to assume this is a stupid suggestion if you are into your time travel movies but Predestination? Surely you have and if not what the actual fuck?!!

[Gigawatt]

4 minutes ago, MardiganX said:

I have to assume this is a stupid suggestion if you are into your time travel movies but Predestination? Surely you have and if not what the actual fuck?!!

Nope, I'll put it on the mental list. Thanks!

[Gigawatt]

Watched Predestination over the last couple of nights. Didn’t take me too long to figure out what was going on, but I enjoyed it immensely so thanks for the recommendation.  As always with films like this I’m left wanting more, which is why The Lazarus Project really hit with me as it goes into the depth that I’m after. 
 

Need more good time-film/series recs now!

[cassidy]

@Gigawatt

 

Triangle and Primer.  

Also timecrimes. 

[Gigawatt]

Love Primer but haven’t seen the other two so I’ll go search them out, thanks!

[cassidy]

6 minutes ago, Gigawatt said:

Love Primer but haven’t seen the other two so I’ll go search them out, thanks!

Their not time travel (well they may be) 

But you can't go wrong with Resolution and The Endless by Moorehead and Benson too. 

 

 

[sofasurfer]

I binged the show this week and loved it, there had better be a season 2 as it was left on such a cliffhanger it would be criminal if wasn't renewed. I like the fact the show has it's own internal logic and yes it doesn't really make sense but does make for a good drama.

 

George is quite the annoying character, yes he's called a dickhead in the showbut he really is. Shiv is obviously the best character, and the whole 

Spoiler

being shot whilst the clock ticks over to the reboot was a great piece of writing.

 One question though 

Spoiler

Janet sends Rebrov the coded text that she needs help but did he know for years that she was the one that sent it? We only saw the text and can assume that the code is used by Lazarus, so is his master plan to save Janet?  

 

It's been a long time since I've really wanted the second season to be aired asap and more people really should be watching the show.

[MardiganX]

1 hour ago, sofasurfer said:One question though 

  Hide contents

Janet sends Rebrov the coded text that she needs help but did he know for years that she was the one that sent it? We only saw the text and can assume that the code is used by Lazarus, so is his master plan to save Janet?  

 

It's been a long time since I've really wanted the second season to be aired asap and more people really should be watching the show.

Spoiler

My take is that Rebrov only knew it was Janet that sent the text when he finds out the message that George was given by Shiv, which he actually got from Janet. It links into their coded messages and only after all those years does Rebrov remember that he was sent it in that text and it all clicks.

 

The cliffhanger clearly leaves it with a save Janet save the world type scenario but even without that Rebrov swaggering back in giving it ‘you guys need me’ was a perfect finish. 

 

[Commander Jameson]

On 14/07/2022 at 21:36, Gigawatt said:

Love Primer but haven’t seen the other two so I’ll go search them out, thanks!

 

I will always recommend Coherence along these others.

 

Time Lapse and ARQ are worth a watch too.

[disperse and recoagulate]

Started watching this with my wife after her dad recommended it. It immediately felt like Doctor Who for adults and I realised once again he'd recommend some sci-fi, which is not my bag at all.

 

Thankfully after a few episodes the story became about

Spoiler

losing a baby

so my wife didn't want to watch anymore, and we won't be going back.

 

And I'll be certain to research anything my father-in-law recommends in future. Thankfully I already vetoed The Man Who Fell to Earth last week, and I think he's finally taken it onboard that I don't watch Star Wars or Star Trek.

[Festoon]

1 hour ago, disperse and recoagulate said:

Started watching this with my wife after her dad recommended it. It immediately felt like Doctor Who for adults and I realised once again he'd recommend some sci-fi, which is not my bag at all.

 

Thankfully after a few episodes the story became about

  Reveal hidden contents

losing a baby

so my wife didn't want to watch anymore, and we won't be going back.

 

And I'll be certain to research anything my father-in-law recommends in future. Thankfully I already vetoed The Man Who Fell to Earth last week, and I think he's finally taken it onboard that I don't watch Star Wars or Star Trek.

 

Man Who is really good, though. Not really sci-fi.

[Graham S]

This was good!

[Oaf]

I enjoyed that, and look forward to season 2. I was going to say that parts of it were seriously far-fetched and unrealistic, but the whole premise of the  programme is they can save-game the entire universe every year so it’s rather pointless really

 

Oh sod it:

Spoiler

Casually detonating a nuke a few miles down the road and driving away without getting vapourised.

”Bring your wife to work day”.

Murdering everyone in the Russian embassy without CCTV of the culprit getting released.

A crappy Lada that can survive multiple crashes and still drive on with perfect headlights.

 

 

[Gigawatt]

All of your spoilered points are valid:

 

Spoiler

But they all come under the category of ‘George being a F’ing D’head’ which is the weakest strand of the show for me. The storming of the Embassy is ridiculous in that he could even pull it off, but his aim was escalation to a Nuclear confrontation so I guess he wouldn’t care if there was CCTV?

Apart from that, I think this show is ace and everyone should watch it. 

[choddo]

I am at the end of Episode 3. Superb so far. Can’t believe this hasn’t had more attention. Apart from a few slightly too knowing gags from Archie in episode 1, the script is fantastic, visuals and sets are very decent and the acting is top drawer.

[Masterbeef]

Just watched episode 1. Enjoyed it a lot, but can someone please explain how the time travel rules work. I was just completely baffled by the end of the episode.