Microsoft’s Xbox Series X/S (& probably PC) games will increase in price to $70 starting in 2023

[MattyP]

2 minutes ago, Talk Show Host said:

I will not be surprised at all if they actually announce some first party games coming day one on PS Plus (which would create a whole host of financial headaches because their business -as opposed to Microsoft- is not built like that).

Either that or have a clear and consistent strategy for moving first party titles to the PS Premium sub. It does seem a very seemingly random approach to things at the moment. Returnal popped up and Ghosts Of Tsushima for example. Ratchet and Clank, Sackboy's Adventure not etc etc. It will be interesting to see how Sony respond.

[RubberJohnny]

It’s weird and predictable that everyone immediately went to daft fanboy lines about how this proves company-I-dislike-were-a-baddy-all-along rather than just acknowledging that we’ve had 10% inflation this year and probably next year too and it was entirely predictable that the battle for £60 was lost a while ago because 20% of that was just wiped out.

 

You’re lucky they’re not going up more.

[Talk Show Host]

12 minutes ago, MattyP said:

Either that or have a clear and consistent strategy for moving first party titles to the PS Premium sub. It does seem a very seemingly random approach to things at the moment. Returnal popped up and Ghosts Of Tsushima for example. Ratchet and Clank, Sackboy's Adventure not etc etc. It will be interesting to see how Sony respond.

Yeah, I really think Microsoft is playing a long con. Spencer may appear to be all friendly and modern but it looks more and more likely that he may be an evil genius. He is literally going after Sony’s AAA output with the most unconventional methods imaginable. He is making them a really heavy burden to bear. And Sony has no answer except to shift s big portion of their strategy asap.

[Talk Show Host]

Just now, RubberJohnny said:

It’s weird and predictable that everyone immediately went to weird fanboy lines about how this proves company-I-dislike-were-a-baddy-all-along rather than just acknowledging that we’ve had 10% inflation this year and probably next year too and it was entirely predictable that the battle for £60 was lost a while ago.

I agree. Sony’s raising of game prices had nothing to do with inflation though. They started it two years ago, remakes including. It’s clearly part of their strategy. The console raise, that was partly due to inflation. Partly.

[thesnwmn]

Just now, Talk Show Host said:

Yeah, I really think Microsoft is playing a long con. Spencer may appear to be all friendly and modern but it looks more and more likely that he may be an evil genius. He is literally going after Sony’s AAA output with the most unconventional methods imaginable. He is making them a really heavy burden to bear. And Sony has no answer except to shift s big portion of their strategy asap.

 

It's a fucking listed company. There's never con, short or long. You know they are in it for the money at every single turn. Being nice is just a strategy to attract gamers. We see it continually in gaming, the underdog is better for consumers. The market leader is a cunt. They're both the same. Slightly different strategies (Sony probably couldn't afford to do what Game Pass does - or did to get started).

 

Take what you can get and enjoy from these organisations but give them none of your loyalty. Ever.

[Talk Show Host]

3 minutes ago, thesnwmn said:

 

It's a fucking listed company. There's never con, short or long. You know they are in it for the money at every single turn. Being nice is just a strategy to attract gamers. We see it continually in gaming, the underdog is better for consumers. The market leader is a cunt. They're both the same. Slightly different strategies (Sony probably couldn't afford to do what Game Pass does - or did to get started).

 

Take what you can get and enjoy from these organisations but give them none of your loyalty. Ever.

Exactly. I was just doing a bit of prose. 😜

[MattyP]

5 minutes ago, thesnwmn said:

Take what you can get and enjoy from these organisations but give them none of your loyalty. Ever.

Absolutely.... Personally hate buying into eco-systems all the time just want to play the games. Why sub services are my ideal solution really to get to the content without having to buy multiple devices. Think we'll get there eventually however I think I'll need a PC to access them...  

[David Kenny]

15 minutes ago, Talk Show Host said:

Yeah, I really think Microsoft is playing a long con. Spencer may appear to be all friendly and modern but it looks more and more likely that he may be an evil genius. He is literally going after Sony’s AAA output with the most unconventional methods imaginable. He is making them a really heavy burden to bear. And Sony has no answer except to shift s big portion of their strategy asap.

I seriously doubt there's any kind of 4D chess going on here. And if that is Microsoft's strategy, I'm not sure it's bearing much fruit. Gamepass subscriptions have been disappointing by MS's own admission and didn't the last God of War sell gangbusters? What would be the driver for Sony to change tack? And what do you think a shift in Sony's strategy would look like?

[PaB]

23 minutes ago, Talk Show Host said:

I agree. Sony’s raising of game prices had nothing to do with inflation though. 

price increases having nothing to do with inflation is certainly a take . 

 

 

[Talk Show Host]

25 minutes ago, PaB said:

price increases having nothing to do with inflation is certainly a take . 

 

 

Did it in this case? Two years ago? And for remakes as well? It looks more like a strategy than a forced choice by inflation.

[Stanley]

2 hours ago, Talk Show Host said:

There’s no definitive proof that games should cost 70. The idea that they now “cost more” and THAT is the reason they should be more expensive is totally arbitrary because we do not know development costs and because market forces are so difficult to predict.  Apart from a couple of games, all games which have cost millions and millions to make have the sales to back up their investment/development cost at 60. And then some.
 

Sony is charging 70 for remakes and their output until now is cross gen. They raised their prices since day one.   More expensive development costs have little to do with this raise. 
 

Microsoft has found the best way to add more value to game pass and make Sony look like a complete fool by adding their AAA day one, which cost 70, practically free with a subscription.  
 

Both of these decisions have little to do with development costs. These are just strategies and Sony is really ill equipped in dealing with what Microsoft is doing. Especially since their main strategy is so top heavy and their new investments will take some time to give a roi.

Yeah the problem with this strategy is that Game Pass is performing well below expectations and they have no AAA games, so I’m not sure why you think that makes Sony look like fools here, at least they actually have the games. 

[PaB]

Just now, Talk Show Host said:

Did it in this case? Two years ago? And for remakes as well? It looks more like a strategy than a forced choice by inflation.

You do know that inflation existed before this year, right? 

[Flanders]

Just now, Stanley said:

Yeah the problem with this strategy is that Game Pass is performing well below expectations and they have no AAA games, so I’m not sure why you think that makes Sony look like fools here, at least they actually have the games. 

And also that 2022 was the year it turned out the entire entertainment subscription model might just be an incredibly stupid way for large corporations to light mind-boggling sums of money on fire for lower returns than they got in the past.

[Talk Show Host]

10 minutes ago, Stanley said:

Yeah the problem with this strategy is that Game Pass is performing well below expectations and they have no AAA games, so I’m not sure why you think that makes Sony look like fools here, at least they actually have the games. 

Well below expectations? It has seen a huge boost on PC and the console subs have reached a limit, as Spencer said. That’s the main negative I’ve read. And that is mostly without first party AAA supply.

[Talk Show Host]

6 minutes ago, PaB said:

You do know that inflation existed before this year, right? 

Sony said the raise in software prices was due to development costs (as everyone else). You are saying that they raised the prices in games because of inflation?

[PaB]

5 minutes ago, Talk Show Host said:

Sony said the raise in software prices was due to development costs (as everyone else). You are saying that they raised the prices in games because of inflation?

What do you think an increase in development costs can be described as? What are the drivers? 

[K]

There’s no way Microsoft expected Game Pass to level out at 15% of their games revenue. That seems like quite a modest achievement given the sheer amount of money and attention they’ve poured into it. 

[Talk Show Host]

3 minutes ago, PaB said:

What do you think an increase in development costs can be described as? What are the drivers? 

Publishers have claimed the need for bigger games, extremely high quality assets, continuous support, 4K fidelity, to name but a few.

[Talk Show Host]

41 minutes ago, K said:

There’s no way Microsoft expected Game Pass to level out at 15% of their games revenue. That seems like quite a modest achievement given the sheer amount of money and attention they’ve poured into it. 

I think they expected more in the console space, but I don’t think by a lot. For a two year old service, during a hardware shortage and without a surplus of AAA it would be mad to expect a lot more. The service will expand as big games hit and Microsoft takes advantage of the AB buyout. Plus, there will be many more deals centered around GP to make it the “go to” place for gamers. They don’t even have to go after the same demographic as Sony to be a success (Nintendo hasn’t) and that gives them an advantage. If they can pull it off of course. 
 

Which is a big IF because we are talking about Microsoft here and their ability to appeal to a broader gaming audience. 

[Stanley]

1 hour ago, Talk Show Host said:

Well below expectations? It has seen a huge boost on PC and the console subs have reached a limit, as Spencer said. That’s the main negative I’ve read. And that is mostly without first party AAA supply.

Yeah it’s reached a limit which hit well below their initial projections. The other problem I see with it is whether they produce at least one AAA game per month to service that model, recent evidence suggests they can’t even do one a year, and even in a good year it’s like 3 or 4. I guess we’ll see what next year brings but I doubt it’s sustainable in the long term now they are being more realistic about the uptake. 

[MattyP]

23 minutes ago, Talk Show Host said:

Which is a big IF because we are talking about Microsoft here and their ability to appeal to a broader gaming audience. 

Well looking at the breadth of genres on GamePass and whats available in the store I think they cover just about everything? 

 

Of course they don't really have the big story/movie based type games like God Of War/Ghosts Of Tsushima etc but third parties can fill that gap up to a degree.

 

[Talk Show Host]

13 minutes ago, MattyP said:

Well looking at the breadth of genres on GamePass and whats available in the store I think they cover just about everything? 

 

Of course they don't really have the big story/movie based type games like God Of War/Ghosts Of Tsushima etc but third parties can fill that gap up to a degree.

 

Yeah, but reaching a wider gaming audience has a lot to do with branding and generally repositioning themselves after three generations. Not easy and it will certainly take time. But GP is the way to do it, not AAAs. 

[Giddas]

I'm surprised by the 15% figure, I wonder how many are on Gamepass via gold conversion, it's a no-brainer at that price.

[Flanders]

1 hour ago, Talk Show Host said:

I think they expected more in the console space, but I don’t think by a lot. For a two year old service, during a hardware shortage and without a surplus of AAA it would be mad to expect a lot more. The service will expand as big games hit and Microsoft takes advantage of the AB buyout. Plus, there will be many more deals centered around GP to make it the “go to” place for gamers. They don’t even have to go after the same demographic as Sony to be a success (Nintendo hasn’t) and that gives them an advantage. If they can pull it off of course. 
 

Which is a big IF because we are talking about Microsoft here and their ability to appeal to a broader gaming audience. 

What? Game Pass isn’t a two year old service, it was launched in 2017! It’s had five years at dirt cheap prices to build a user base.  

[Talk Show Host]

10 minutes ago, Flanders said:

What? Game Pass isn’t a two year old service, it was launched in 2017! It’s had five years at dirt cheap prices to build a user base.  

I was talking in regards to SX, because that is when GP became the main selling point of the console. No one would buy an Xbox One for GP. Sorry if I wasn’t clear.

[Flanders]

13 minutes ago, Talk Show Host said:

I was talking in regards to SX, because that is when GP became the main selling point of the console. No one would buy an Xbox One for GP. Sorry if I wasn’t clear.

Sorry but that just isn’t true. Game Pass was absolutely the main selling point for Xbox from 2017-2020, which let’s not forget is just under half the Xbox One’s lifespan and the entirety of the Xbox One X’s. 

Shit, I bought a One S secondhand for Game Pass in 2019. Forza Horizon 4 was released on it day one in September 2018. 

 

[K]

2 hours ago, Talk Show Host said:

I think they expected more in the console space, but I don’t think by a lot. For a two year old service, during a hardware shortage and without a surplus of AAA it would be mad to expect a lot more. The service will expand as big games hit and Microsoft takes advantage of the AB buyout. Plus, there will be many more deals centered around GP to make it the “go to” place for gamers. They don’t even have to go after the same demographic as Sony to be a success (Nintendo hasn’t) and that gives them an advantage. If they can pull it off of course. 
 

Which is a big IF because we are talking about Microsoft here and their ability to appeal to a broader gaming audience. 

 

Why would a hardware shortage make any difference to the percentage of revenue that comes from Game Pass? 

[MattyP]

9 minutes ago, Flanders said:

Sorry but that just isn’t true. Game Pass was absolutely the main selling point for Xbox from 2017-2020, which let’s not forget is just under half the Xbox One’s lifespan and the entirety of the Xbox One X’s. 

Shit, I bought a One S secondhand for Game Pass in 2019. Forza Horizon 4 was released on it day one in September 2018. 

 

Yep Forza Horizon 4 is the reason I looked at GP. Amazing its been around for 5 1/2 years now...

[Talk Show Host]

14 minutes ago, Flanders said:

Sorry but that just isn’t true. Game Pass was absolutely the main selling point for Xbox from 2017-2020, which let’s not forget is just under half the Xbox One’s lifespan and the entirety of the Xbox One X’s. 

Shit, I bought a One S secondhand for Game Pass in 2019. Forza Horizon 4 was released on it day one in September 2018. 

 

Yes, but it wasn’t the focus of the entire generation, which is what I am saying. That generation was lost. SX/S and GP are tied together for the success of this generation. They are codependent imo. 

 

[Talk Show Host]

3 minutes ago, K said:

 

Why would a hardware shortage make any difference to the percentage of revenue that comes from Game Pass? 

Maybe there are less consoles to buy, so less subscribers?