Lost - The Full Series Thread

[A.C.R.O.N.Y.M]

Whats with Locke's scar?, on the island he has it but in the real world its nowhere to be seen. when did he get it again?.

[GrannySmiths]

There was part of me that thought the child could have been a young Locke but didn't he have black hair? I can't remember from the ep Richard went and saw him. But then I also thought it could have been Jacob, but not sure now.

Loved that the numbers have now been linked with the characters. But with Locke gone (who was one of the select numbers) does this throw things off balance?

also I wonder why smokey is now stuck in Locke? is it because Jacob is dead?

and LOL at the "inside joke" of Smokey throwing the white rock into the water!

Whats with Locke's scar?, on the island he has it but in the real world its nowhere to be seen. when did he get it again?.

Locke got his scar from the plane crash I do believe

[GrannySmiths]

I wonder if the blonde kid is Aaron?

oooo interesting concept there never thought of that!

[connerfitzgerald]

Also, this is starting to look like it's something biblical and Flocke being incarnated by the devil or something. Not that special. Man... Nerve wrecking stuff.

Indeed, he couldn't cross a circle as well, like the devil.

[Chaz]

I immediately thought the blonde kid was Jacob, but now i'm thinking it might be Richard Alpert maybe from the time when they were all human - ie, when the Black Rock crashed onto the island (going by the current theories about their origins)? Something like that. Might kind of make sense that RA couldn't see him, but everyone else (smokey and Sawyer) could. Maybe RA became the immortal gamekeeper and set out the rules at some point in the past, or something.

I straight away was thinking of Christian when the camera panned to the word Shepherd on the wall of the cave. Certainly an interesting theory.

Anyway, nice episode, much better than last week's. I also thought the delivery boy/kid in school were going to be Walt in the Locke flash-sideways, but that was only because almost everyone he was interacting with turned out to be other passengers, rather than them just being black and approximately the right age. I think it was just a deliberate little nudge from the writers.

One thing I was wondering - I can't really remember the stuff that happened with Locke's dad on the island, did we find out for sure that it was just the black smoke presenting itself as him to maniupulate Locke, or was it actually his dad that they brought back from the real world? Because I thought the smoke couldn't 'mimick' people from off the island who were alive, or even people off the island who are dead. Either way I can see this possibly becoming quite relevant to how things panned out in the alternate timeline, what with Locke having a good relationship with his 'dad' and wanting him to come to his wedding.

[Comrade]

Great ep - and the fact that Ben was in the alternate timeline confirms that the whatever the nuke did it didn't immediately sink the Island, as at least Ben clearly had time to escape.

Oh, and I like the fact that in anticipation of the inevitable Richard Alpert episode they're already building up the fact that he actually doesn't know anything. Oh well!

[Popo]

The kid being Aron would tally with Claire's appearance last episode, in that they both turned up in an identical manner.

So the numbers each represent a character? How long have they been written there? Since time imemorium? I still can't really claim to understand what they 'mean'. They're just numbers Jacob picked at random and assigned to our characters?

[peeveen]

The writers have always said that they were influenced by Stephen King's "The Stand", and this "recruitment" thing is another similarity, if I remember the novel correctly.

[Mr Cochese]

I think the spoiler policy is rediculous. Never seen a Lost thread which is so rediculous. Most places after the episode airs, you put the main plot points in spoilers for a day or so, but not every little thing. I don't see how pretty much just saying 'it's a good episode without spoiler tags will piss anyone off.

It's spelt "reticulous", for God's sake.

[Luke]

Great ep - and the fact that Ben was in the alternate timeline confirms that the whatever the nuke did it didn't immediately sink the Island, as at least Ben clearly had time to escape.

Good point. Ben was still with the others at the point of the bomb going off, so wouldn't have been evacuated on the sub. In the original timeline he clearly went back to living with the Dharmas, but that hadn't happened yet.

It actually raises some interesting points, if the second timeline was only created after the bomb, the Ben would already have been Temple-ized, and would already have met the time travelled Losties (though what he could remember of that was never all that clear).

Of course, the explosion could have caused the island to sink but everyone on it to be teleported off at the same time, or could have reversed time for everyone on the island, back until the point in their lives before they arrived. Lots of possibilities still.

I also like the idea about Aaron being the boy, I'm waiting to see what the relevance of the "you mustn't let anyone else raise him" thing was. I know the psychic admitted to Eko that he was a fraud, but I still think there could be something in it.

Oh, and someone asked where Locke got his scar - he got it in the original crash.

[JohnC]

I must be a retard but what is the meaning of the numbers again? All I saw were a bunch of numbers next to the losties' names. IDGI!!11

Don't the numbers which weren't crossed out correspond to "the candidates"? So the numbers are the candidates.

[Mr Cochese]

The un-crossed-out names are the remaining candidates. Though why this includes John, who is dead, and not Ben, who isn't, is obviously not explained.

[smods]

Don't the numbers which weren't crossed out correspond to "the candidates"? So the numbers are the candidates.

I interpreted it as every person who has visited the island was a candidate and was assigned a number. As time has gone on Jacob has crossed out people who don't fit some kind of criteria leaving those six people and those six numbers. I maybe completely wrong but that's how I interpreted it. More so because according to the list on Dark UFO it's not just the survivors of 815 but there are names of others on there too.

I don't understand why Kate isn't there though because Jacob clearly visited her when she was a child. I do believe that Shepard relates to Jack though and not Christian. When Sawyer asked if it was Jack they cut to the scene where Jacob met Jack.

What year did Danielle and the rest of the Frenchies arrive on the island? If they first heard those numbers then Jacob has clearly decided on his final six a long time ago.

Loved the episode and cannot wait for more!

[Luke]

What year did Danielle and the rest of the Frenchies arrive on the island? If they first heard those numbers then Jacob has clearly decided on his final six a long time ago.

16 years before the crash, which makes it a little strange that other 815ers were on the list, if he'd already crossed them off, why bring them to the island anyway? or had their path already been set, even though they were on the way?

Ben could have been crossed off, as Jacob had already decided he was a dick; or perhaps after Sayid shot him, and they took him to the temple, he became infected (like Sayid), so was no longer a candidate.

[Pob]

So Jacob has been cajoling people to the island for decades now. This means Abbadon and Widmore are helping him out, as they've been bringing candidates to the island as well.

I wonder why Smokey left Ben on the beach? Surely he'd be the perfect 'recruit'?

What an amazing episode though. I love the way that, even when they're explaining stuff and getting into the real nitty-gritty, they still have time for character and humour. This episode had some of the biggest LOLs. I especially liked Ben's speech and the funeral and Frank's reaction; and the bit where the boy appears and Sawyer wearily says "who the hell is that?"

This thing about 'the rules' - what rules has Smokey followed when killing people on the island? Is he unable to kill 'candidates'? He used to judge people - like he seemed to read whether or not Eko was repentant before killing him. Eko must have been a candidate.

I do get the impression that they are cobbling stuff like these 'rules' together to make everything fit with the earlier seasons, but it's working a treat!

[makkuwata]

So Jacob has been cajoling people to the island for decades now. This means Abbadon and Widmore are helping him out, as they've been bringing candidates to the island as well.

Not necessarily. After Miles was first approached to work for Widmore he was abducted by Bram and co - who we now know to be working for Jacob - and told he was 'playing on the wrong team'.

[squirtle]

Why hasn't Locke's name and number been crossed out? I imagine it's because it's Jacob that crosses them out, and as he was in his Shoe House when Locke arrived back on the island (dead), he probably didn't have chance to go back to that cave and cross the name out.

Anyway, great episode. So how did Locke end up in the wheelchair, then? Puzzler. Who is the kid in the jungle and why is Flocke afraid of him? Another puzzler.

And is there any significance to the war between Ben and Widmore any more? It's clear Ben has no idea what was going on, I'm not sure Widmore ever did. Was that all a big false direction from the makers of the show?

[Luke]

I wonder why Smokey left Ben on the beach? Surely he'd be the perfect 'recruit'?

Because Ben's been destroyed, really, he's a shell of his former self after Flocke sussed him out, and realised he knew nothing about the island or what was going on.

[rubberducker]

i think its safe to say don't assume anything. the writers of this show have started an alternative timeline, and we have all assumed we are seeing it because the bomb went off at the end of the last series. if there is one thing the writers love doing its the unexpected.

its almost certain that alt timeline goes back way further than the bomb, and will no doubt play into whatever twist jacob has up his sleeve for the man in black - in the climax of the whole series.

i'd say its pretty likely to go back to here:

SO THE QUESTION IS - IS THERE A WHITE ROCK? (what is it with black and white stones anyway?)

Also - i'd say locke being able to shift consciousness through realities is a given. he's still in the game, as it would brutally unsatisfying to have him gone forever.

[GwiDan]

Remember the failsafe in the Swan hatch? Could that have been the detonator for the nuke?

[Teeohbee.]

It only ends once, everything else is just progress.

[Luke]

SO THE QUESTION IS - IS THERE A WHITE ROCK? (what is it with black and white stones anyway?)

Oooh, that's a good question.

I'd not really noticed the black and white stones on the first watch through, but on my massive re-watch of seasons 1 to 5, knowing of the existence of Jacob and MiB, I noticed them a lot more.

Right in the first or second episode Locke is teaching Walt about backgammon, and introduces it by holding up a black piece in one hand and a white piece in the other and saying (something like) "it's a game of two sides, light and dark, good and evil". I jumped round the room in excitement hearing that line, knowing how it related to/or hinted at, much bigger things.

The next time they crop up is in the pockets of "Adam and Eve" in the caves, I'm waiting to find out the significance of them, and where their stones came from/what they meant.

[whizzo]

And is there any significance to the war between Ben and Widmore any more? It's clear Ben has no idea what was going on, I'm not sure Widmore ever did. Was that all a big false direction from the makers of the show?

I think Ben and Whidmore thought it was all about them.

[squirtle]

You know, it never occured to me that the name of the ship was relevant. The Black Rock. How did I miss that!? Is that where the present MIB came from then?

[whizzo]

You know, it never occured to me that the name of the ship was relevant. The Black Rock. How did I miss that!? Is that where the present MIB came from then?

I think he was sat watching it come in with Jacob at the end of series 5

[mercenarri]

He was, and I think we'll see him and Jacob after that scene getting people off the ship, seeing Richard and other slaves in chains.

[Anne Summers]

So Jacob has been cajoling people to the island for decades now. This means Abbadon and Widmore are helping him out, as they've been bringing candidates to the island as well.

I dunno about that ... I've kind of been erring on the side of Abbadon and Widdmore being pro-smokey. This might just have been because they are blatantly anti-Ben (in fact WHY they are so anti-Ben, is one of the big questions I really hope we get an answer to). And Ben has always been on Jacob's side. Or at least, it seems that he has always sincerely THOUGHT he was on Jacob's side.

I'm still finding the whole war issue very confusing.

I wonder why Smokey left Ben on the beach? Surely he'd be the perfect 'recruit'?

Maybe this is something to do with the same thing - Ben is too deep in with Jacob to ever turn sides? Something to do with whatever happened to him in the temple when he was a kid? It seems pretty obvious that even Ben has no idea who Smokey is, I don't think he was ever even aware he existed until now. Richard on the other hand, definitely knows something about him, but it seems not very much.

What an amazing episode though. I love the way that, even when they're explaining stuff and getting into the real nitty-gritty, they still have time for character and humour. This episode had some of the biggest LOLs. I especially liked Ben's speech and the funeral and Frank's reaction; and the bit where the boy appears and Sawyer wearily says "who the hell is that?"

Sawyer had some really great lines this episode. Can't remember them right now but he cracked me up a couple of times.

I do get the impression that they are cobbling stuff like these 'rules' together to make everything fit with the earlier seasons, but it's working a treat!

Yeah, I've had the feeling that the whole "rules" thing seems a bit tacked-on a couple of times - a quick (and slightly cliched) plot device to help them start to wrap things up. I'm going along with it for now though. On a similar note, wasn't JAck supposed to be "not even on Jacob's list"? According to ... some time around season 2. So was that a different list than the one in the cave? Or is it Christian? Or are the writers hoping no one will remember that line?

[squirtle]

I think he was sat watching it come in with Jacob at the end of series 5

Well, that's a possibility. But if the boat they were watching was so close, how did it end up so far inland?

And surely the fact that it is called "THE BLACK ROCK" must allude to something now we've had quite a few references to white and black stones/rocks.

[CGMF]

I just want to know what Ben's magic box metaphor referred to...

[Luke]

I just want to know what Ben's magic box metaphor referred to...

I'd always assumed it was just the island as a whole.