End of Game Bosses

[Crispin]

Rather ironically, Vice City had an end of game boss. Why? The whole point of the fun bit of the game (i.e. not the missions) was all about freedom. Plus the boss was annoying, with no quick restart button and cutscenes that had to be loaded, only for you to skip them immediately.

As well as disorientation after each cutscene ended and you were exposed and vulnerable.

That sucked.

[Jonathan_Kerr]

Every game needs a decent villian - it's the ultimate icing on the cake. Every hero needs a nemesis to stick it to.

[Crispin]

Sometimes. Master chief had no specific nemesis. But I enjoyed that all the same as he was only a soldier when all is said and done. A kickass soldier, but once, there were many of his kind, until the Fall of reach. He isn't that special.

Whereas in Zelda:OOT it makes sense. Link is the Hero Of Time. He is the one, chosen by destiny, plucked from obscurity and a normal life for one purpose. A child no one takes seriously, not even his fellow kokiri. When he finally wins the ultimate battle, it's even more satisfying when you remember that once he was a reject even within the Kokiri for being fairyless.

Bosses shouldn't be added willy nilly. For example, in realistic FPS involving human like creatures. There is only so much damage even a hunter can take before it goes down.

Then again, killing a giant blob/ mechanical spider from hell isn't that satisfying,

[Unofficial Who]

Have to say, there is nothing worse than getting to the end of a game and the end of game boss only requires couple of hits and credits role. I'm looking at YOU Sacred.

I prefer that to an impossible end boss.

I'm looking at you Jet Force Gemini.

Let's face it, if you had a game set in Iraq where the aim was to kill Saddam killing him if you are tooled up shouldn't be too hard.

It's the journey, the getting to him that counts.

Look at LOTR (movie and book, not game) the struggle, the journey.

And in the end all Frodo had to really do was drop a ring into a firey pit.

The hard part was getting there.

It LOTR was designed as a video game you'd have the bloody Balrog as the end boss.

[Robo_1]

Gun Metal has a great end of game boss. It's just a base with a number of hubs you have to destroy, but it realy tests all your Gun Metal skills without pushing you over the top.

[GwiDan]

If your aim in the game is to be the last man standing who can destroy the great evil vying to destroy the earth... etc. etc. Then you do need an end boss to beat - otherwise, how do you know that you've beat the evil and saved the universe? What would Metroid Prime be without the end bosses (apart from bliss)? If you had the ability to whip out a Dyson arm cannon attachment, and hoover up the Phazon, it wouldn't be much of an ending.

[Sabreman]

I must admit I found the ending battles from both FFVII and VIII to be spectacular affairs, though I did fail on both the first time I tried - and after a 45-minute battle that can be a little upsetting.

I find that few things get the gaming adrenaline going than facing up to a tough boss after spending several hours playing through a game, or in the case of a typical RPG maybe 30-60 hours. You're heart's in your mouth the whole time, but that feeling you get at the very moment you realise you've done it is priceless.

[Mogget]

It's the journey, the getting to him that counts.

Exactly. That's why the finale in Half Life was so lame. A magnificent game, full of wonderfully realistic locations and superb gameplay......and then two of the lamest bosses ever to appear in a computer game.

The real irony is that the tentacle boss earlier in the game was probably one of the best bosses EVER. The difference here is that this boss felt like it belonged in the game. It had a purpose....a reason for being there. It was also original. That stupid Gonarch spider thing, and the ridiculous jelly baby at the end almost ruined the entire gaming experience for me. Even now, I would love to be able to remove those two levels from my Half Life CD.

It would probably double the worth of the game.

[Vemsie]

Half Life does have crap bosses but there are many games were the bosses make a great game even better imo. REZ springs to mind, Yoshi's Island is a good example, the Zelda games, Ninja Gaiden. I love a good bossfight, especially the epic, badass ones. It all comes down to game desing in the end. Bosses are part of that.

[kitten]

I think end bosses will always make sense in some types of game (in agreement with GwiDan's point).

However, I don't like ones where I need absolute, perfect control of my character even if the camera goes to some shitty viewpoint and I can't see where I'm going - especially if that is likely to go on for some time and my fingers start slipping off the pad. I don't like the ones where I need to aim at something and get the aim exactly right first time else the boss batters my character and I lose track of where I'm aiming (ad nauseum). And I don't like having to traipse through the gameworld for hours just to reach the boss, and not be able to save my progress for another day, when I'll have time to complete it.

I know that some of those points bother me more than they would you, reader. And I know it's somewhat petty to get quite so annoyed when the boss usually isn't that hard to beat when I get it right. And yes it IS nice to have a bit of a challenge to round off the game.

It's all about balance, though.

[Mayfair Rick]

The real irony is that the tentacle boss earlier in the game was probably one of the best bosses EVER.

Whilst I respect your opinion (barely) on this, I have to say that I found the tentacle to be the most massive crock of shite in the world. A big stealth section surrounded by platformy bits - WOO YAY. As for the rest of the bosses in Half-Life, they weren't crap because they were bosses, they were just crap. The problem was that once you were taken out of the recognisable human environments, you were able to actually see how poorly the level design facilitated gunplay.

I'm personally amazed that otherwise intelligent people have such a thing against bosses, though. If you ask me what part of any particular game I want to replay, there's a 90% chance it's going to be a boss.

[Vemsie]

If you ask me what part of any particular game I want to replay, there's a 90% chance it's going to be a boss.

What part of Halo would you want to replay?

[Mayfair Rick]

All of it. Duh

[Mogget]

I'm personally amazed that otherwise intelligent people have such a thing against bosses, though. If you ask me what part of any particular game I want to replay, there's a 90% chance it's going to be a boss.

Careful. That comment is very close to being condescending.

Many of us couldn't give a rat's arse if there is a giant boss at the end that will provide a mega challenge. It's the experience that counts. Look at Deus Ex. Zero bosses, massive virtual world, and the best gaming experience ever (in my opinion).

[Jonathan_Kerr]

Sometimes. Master chief had no specific nemesis. But I enjoyed that all the same as he was only a soldier when all is said and done. A kickass soldier, but once, there were many of his kind, until the Fall of reach. He isn't that special.

Whereas in Zelda:OOT it makes sense. Link is the Hero Of Time. He is the one, chosen by destiny, plucked from obscurity and a normal life for one purpose. A child no one takes seriously, not even his fellow kokiri. When he finally wins the ultimate battle, it's even more satisfying when you remember that once he was a reject even within the Kokiri for being fairyless.

Bosses shouldn't be added willy nilly. For example, in realistic FPS involving human like creatures. There is only so much damage even a hunter can take before it goes down.

Then again, killing a giant blob/ mechanical spider from hell isn't that satisfying,

If I was a pedant, I could say that the Covenant are the enemy (specifically).

For this reason, I think Halo2 could do with a boss or 4. Not every level, but when required.

[Dimahoo]

A good boss makes for a natrual Heirachy in the progression of a player through a game with enemies that are primarily not bosses.

What bosses need are a sence of scale, and something that will make your heart pump.

So if your playing a 2D hori shooter, the level will speed up and spin around (rather then stop) and shit to make you dizzy and sick. A boss must be menacing too. And there must be some sinister sound, rather then an alarm.

This = is good.

The boss must also fire muchos Neon laser death and have many attack patterns.

Like the bosses of G-Darius.

[Mogget]

What about Unreal 2 ? That first "boss" at the bottom of the shaft was utter rubbish. Hide behind the central pillar until he appears, shoot, hide behind pillar, shoot.......continue until mindless pile of garbage is dead. Boring. A couple of missions later, and I was shooting spiders. Lots of them. I thought that gaming had progressed beyond that kind of mindless tedium, but Legend apparently thought otherwise. The end of that terminally yawn inducing level saw the appearance of another boss "classic"....the spider boss. My verdict ? RUBBISH. My solution ? UNINSTALL GAME.

Problem solved.

[Dimahoo]

Conversly, a game like Resident evil features bosses that are very creepy (remember the thuds of the spiders in the early games? Not bosses, but a good example of how spiders should sound and look)

And thats how it needs to be addressed.

A boss has to make the heart pound because a 'real' boss sterotypically does that.

Of course, if you repeat that effect (as has been in shueps) it becomes quite dull so it needs to be taken furter in all genres where they exist.

[GwiDan]

Ikaruga has excellent bosses because it gives you enough warning that you're coming up on one at the end of a level, so that the first time you're lining up to face one, oyu have a growing sense of dread at what you're about to face. When the boss finally does arrive onscreen, the general reaction for that first meeting (before countless retries, natch) is "what the bloody hell is this!?" It's impressive, so, good.

Halo didn't have bosses because specific rooms acted like boss stages. While you don't have any one particular massive enemy that can kill you with one blast of its laser death beam, some rooms are so packed full of enemies they need retries at certain difficulty levels. It isn't about the individual enemies, it's about being overwhelmed by the freaking Flood.

[Dimahoo]

Good call....

Halo is a good example of a game without bosses.

[unspec]

What would you have in their place?

A written exam.