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I presume from their odd starting positions we're looking at a weird perpetually swirling vortex formation again, with everyone rotating counter clockwise in and out of possession. Definitely not a case of back to basics, but there's no Willian so my enthusiasm for this game has already increased significantly.

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Arteta is done - the squad is not his fault but when has a club ever said to a manager ‘we know the players are mostly crap, you trade then all at huge losses whilst signing better replacements without even having CL money or gate receipts’ 

 

They’re showing nothing under him now so he’s gone I’m afraid, which is a crying shame as I think he has great promise as a manager, but this bunch of lazy twats came too soon for him in his career.

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You feel for Pepe. He’s shite but at least he tries a bit. Imagine watching Willian finish another 90 minutes trotting about and occasionally spraying a long ball into the top tier whilst you’re sat on your arse on the bench again. I don’t think I have ever actively disliked one of our players before.

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I’m now in Oz again so hard to really know what’s what beyond a few news headlines and Arseblog etc.

 

So, honest question... how fucked actually are we? Depending what I read it could be that squad really is weaker than almost every other team, or that the tactics are way off, or that we transitioning to a new coach and style or we just aren’t getting enough out of the players? I’m assuming it’s a bit of everything :(

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Arsenal didn’t learn anything from Man Utd post Fergie. Poor recruitment, giving big names contracts when it’s best to replace them. 
 

Get rid of Arteta and replace him with a manager. You tried to experiment and it’s failed. No point waiting till Ozil comes back and that’s if Arteta wants him back. That’s going to make Arteta look weaker in the dressing room.

 

Real Madrid and Barca can take gambles on ex players as manager because their squads are usually filled with world class players and worst can happen is they will finish 4th. Arsenal can’t do that and Arteta is taking you downhill fast. Southampton have a way better manager than you. Arsenal need a manager who is going to get the maximum from their squad as your owners won’t be spending big. Leicester, Everton, Southampton and Wolves don’t have better teams than you. But they do have better managers. 
 

Arteta was always a strange appointment. He was putting out cones for Pep and suddenly he’s good enough for Arsenal with no other background in management. 

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The massive mistake we made was not laying the groundwork for a coach to thrive in after Wenger left. We made attempts to build an executive level and (without the benefit of hindsight) actually seemed to made some sensible decisions. It wasn't long ago we had one of the world's best recruitment brains and a compliment of people to actually do the massive amount of work it takes to run a successful club. Now, I don't think any of them were perfect by a very long stretch, but at least they existed. Now there's just Edu and a bloke who's never coached before all hands to the pump doing absolutely everything. It's madness. Before worrying about a coach we needed a technical director, a head of recruitment, a director of football, head of development etc. – an actually thought through group of people to decide what sort of football we want to play, how we get there and the players required to do so. Then you choose a coach to implement it knowing if he doesn't then you get someone who can so we're not tearing everything up again if he doesn't work out. It's not like any of this is insightful. Wenger for his faults was a complete genius and somehow managed to do almost everything to a ridiculously high level for years on end. We appreciated at the time he was overburdened but the club expected a complete rookie to come in and fulfil the same roll. Again, that is madness but suits the owners as they want someone who they can give the job and then speak to again in 2 years if they need to sack them.

 

We've also gone all in on Arteta's tika-taka which is yesterday's football. Guardiola has evolved it but still has pretty much 30 world class players to brute force it into working and even he comes unstuck more often than he should. The future was a high tempo gegenpress and counter years ago but we've still not caught on. We're trying to perfect a very difficult style of football with a motley crew of callow youth, geriatric cast-offs, stupid marquee signings and players that weren't good enough 4 years ago. It's a fool's errand. I'd agree, Leicester are absolutely a better team as they play a defined style and recruit players to fill positions they need. As it stands our chairman Kia Joorabchian is phoning up Sky Sports to complain that Jamie fucking Carragher had the temerity to have the editorial stance that he'd swindled the club with his dodgy deals for his suite of rubbish footballers.

 

Saying all of this Arteta doesn't help himself. The non-negotiables rhetoric is just hollow words. Willian should have been hooked at half time yesterday as his performance level is a genuine disgrace. He's managed one shot on goal all season and still gets 90 minutes pretty much twice a week. He's emblematic of what he's doing wrong. He might turn out to be a good coach, but it won't be with us. The time to move on is now as make no mistake we're in a fight to stay up. Get anyone who can come in and get some points on the board.

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12 minutes ago, Art Vandelay said:

The massive mistake we made was not laying the groundwork for a coach to thrive in after Wenger left. We made attempts to build an executive level and (without the benefit of hindsight) actually seemed to made some sensible decisions. It wasn't long ago we had one of the world's best recruitment brains and a compliment of people to actually do the massive amount of work it takes to run a successful club. Now, I don't think any of them were perfect by a very long stretch, but at least they existed. Now there's just Edu and a bloke who's never coached before all hands to the pump doing absolutely everything. It's madness. Before worrying about a coach we needed a technical director, a head of recruitment, a director of football, head of development etc. – an actually thought through group of people to decide what sort of football we want to play, how we get there and the players required to do so. Then you choose a coach to implement it knowing if he doesn't then you get someone who can so we're not tearing everything up again if he doesn't work out. It's not like any of this is insightful. Wenger for his faults was a complete genius and somehow managed to do almost everything to a ridiculously high level for years on end. We appreciated at the time he was overburdened but the club expected a complete rookie to come in and fulfil the same roll. Again, that is madness but suits the owners as they want someone who they can give the job and then speak to again in 2 years if they need to sack them.

 

We've also gone all in on Arteta's tika-taka which is yesterday's football. Guardiola has evolved it but still has pretty much 30 world class players to brute force it into working and even he comes unstuck more often than should. The future was a high tempo gegenpress and counter years ago but we've still not caught on. We're trying to perfect a very difficult style of football with a motley crew of callow youth, geriatric cast-offs, stupid marquee signings and players that weren't good enough 4 years ago. It's a fool's errand. I'd agree, Leicester are absolutely a better team as they play a defined style and recruit players to fill positions they need. As it stands our chairman Kia Joorabchian is phoning up Sky Sports to complain that Jamie fucking Carragher had the temerity to have the editorial stance that he'd swindled the club with his dodgy deals for his suite of rubbish footballers.

 

Saying all of this Arteta doesn't help himself. The non-negotiables rhetoric is just hollow words. Willian should have been hooked at half time yesterday as his performance level is a genuine disgrace. He's managed one shot on goal all season and still gets 90 minutes pretty much twice a week. He's emblematic of what he's doing wrong. He might turn out to be a good coach, but it won't be with us. The time to move on is now as make no mistake we're in a fight to stay up. Get anyone who can come in and get some points on the board.

Not a piss take, but would you take someone like Eddie Howe on at the moment or is that not the right time and you should have (whisper it)gone for someone like Sam Allardyce?

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Just now, davidcotton said:

Not a piss take, but would you take someone like Eddie Howe on at the moment or is that not the right time and you should have (whisper it)gone for someone like Sam Allardyce?

 

I don't think this is a job for Eddie Howe if I'm being honest. He'll probably need somewhere to rebuild his confidence and reputation a bit even if he was the right profile, which I'm not sure he is anyway. We wanted someone who could lead a long term project and made a mistake getting someone with no experience. Allardyce is a fire fighter and absolutely despised by Arsenal fans so he'd never been accepted. Arsenal are in deep trouble, but do have games to work with so a new coach could come in a start looking up the table. If we're still in this position with 8 games to go then maybe you need an old war dog who'll sort things out but we're not there now. 

 

Of all the massive cock-ups we've made the biggest was not getting Klopp when he was tripping over his own tongue to have the job all those years ago. Never mind!

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This needs a big name big ego manager who is big enough to take on the players challenging taking back their desire to keep the holiday camp going - not necessarily a super strict disciplinarian, just somebody who has a big enough rep and name that they listen, feel a bit happier about themselves and try a bit harder. In some bizarre way a peak Harry Redknapp (though not him now) or an Allegri or Conte for a year or so - there is always somebody willing to take the wages but its somebody who needs back into the game and is prepared to fight a bit to get a club back into the position it should be.

 

I'm not sure with the level of player we have in terms or wages/ego/reputation that a talented but lower reputation level coach would work, Hassenhutel for example is doing a brilliant job at Southampton but not sure why he'd want to come to us or if he is the right man at the right time. We've already got Rogers one nice doubling of his wages so no point getting snubbed again there for him to have more money to spend on self portraits, tanning beds and teeth.

 

I feel Arteta whilst a thoroughly decent and principled bloke is in the wrong place at the wrong time for his managerial aspirations.

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I don’t see how we get out of this, a new manager will see a new manager bounce which will only last a few games, then it’s back to the same old same old. 
 

The club needs a complete overhaul from top to bottom. 
 

We need a strong team above the manager and we need to get rid of about 11 players and replace them with smart signings not spunking wages on players like Willian and Cedric. 

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Just now, suzzopher said:

We need a strong team above the manager and we need to get rid of about 11 players and replace them with smart signings not spunking wages on players like Willian and Cedric. 

 

those wages are contractually spunked with no buyers wanting to take them off our hands, the waste is on a shocking scale. the best we can hope for is loans where part of the wages get paid by the club getting the player

 

add up the weekly pay of Ozil, Willian, Sokratis, Mustafi, Soares, Mari, Saliba, Kolasinac  and you won't be far short of £1m I'd wager - I know Ozil drops off in June but it's an immense ongoing level of waste we can't get off the books, which means in the short term they'll be looking for a manager to say exactly what Emery & Arteta did, that they are a underperforming decent bunch that the right person can get a tune out of. 

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